Gen. 4:14

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by AndrewG, Jan 2, 2008.

  1. AndrewG

    AndrewG
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    Who was Cain scared may kill him? Seth isnt mentioned til later.
    Honestly curious for opinions.
     
  2. David Lamb

    David Lamb
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    Matthew Poole asks and answers precisely that question in his commentary:

    Quest.
    Whom did Cain fear, when it appears not that there were any but his father and mother?
    Answ. So ignorant people conceive; but it is a fond conceit to think that there were no more men than are expressed in this book, where God never intended to give a catalogue of all men, but only of the church, or those who had some relation to or concern with it. Nay, that there were very many thousands of men now in being, is very credible upon these rational grounds and suppositions.
    1. That Adam and Eve did, according to God’s precept and blessing,
    #Ge 1:26, procreate children presently after the fall, and God’s gracious reconcilement to them; and consequently their children did so, when they came to competent age.
    2. That those first men and women were endowed by God with extraordinary fruitfulness, and might have two, three, four, or more at a time, (as divers persons long after had), which was then expedient for the replenishing of the world; and the like may be judged of their children during the world’s infancy.
    3. That this murder was committed but a little before the hundred and thirtieth year of Adam’s age, which appears by comparing
    #Ge 4:25 and #Ge 5:3. Before which time, how vast and numerous an offspring might have come from Adam, none can be ignorant that can and shall make a rational computation.

     
  3. menageriekeeper

    menageriekeeper
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    While I don't disagree with #1 and #3 above, #2 is a bit farfetched. We aren't given any reason to believe that multiple births were a regular thing at this time in creation.
     
  4. AndrewG

    AndrewG
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    Thanks, that makes a some sense. Never doubting, just in case Im asked the same question someday.
     
  5. Trotter

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    Cain knew that he would live a long, long time. He also knew that, because the population of the world was so small, EVERYONE would know him and what he had done. he knew he was and would be hated and that his life would e worthless.

    Who was Cain afraid of? Every man and woman on the earth.
     
  6. AndrewG

    AndrewG
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    Do you think perhaps, after reading the narrative again, that maybe Cain thought he was sacrificing Abel to the Lord? I know this sounds crazy, but when he realized it was blood God wanted, he went out and talked with Abel, and killed him. I doubt it, but the possibility crossed my mind for the first time.
     
  7. Trotter

    Trotter
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    Sacrificed in anger? Sorry, don't see it.

    It wasn't so much the blood. Cain gave what didn't realy cost him anything, whereas Able gave up the life of one of his flock. Cain gave just to give, whereas as Able gave out of worship.
     
  8. Dale-c

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    I believe this is the first mention of what the reformers would call the regulative principle of worship.
    The principle that we only worship God in the manner that He has told us to.
    We don't add, subtract or in any other way change His command to worship.
    Cain tried to worship in his own way. He thought he could do better than what God had commanded.
    Which is what we do today when we add things to our worship that God hasn't commanded because we wish to worship in our own way.
     
  9. AndrewG

    AndrewG
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    I believe it was the blood. Abel worked with animals, Cain tilled the ground. He surely put as much sweat into his offering as Abel did.
    God told Cain he could make it right with an offering, "sin lieth at the door"...

    As for the anger, he was wroth at first for sure, but that is not clear after God spoke with him, and he was later in the field talking with Abel.
     
  10. menageriekeeper

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    Andrew you are somewhat correct that God was dissatified with a bloodless sacrifice. There is scripture that says "without the shedding of blood there can be no remission of sin." But the blood was necessarily the point.

    God prescribed the manner of worship and sacrifice and He expected obedience. Cain decided that he wanted to things his own way and brought an unacceptable sacrifice. It was disobedience plain and simple. Then when God refused it, Cain got mad.

    Now God had asked for a blood sacrifice, because (IMO), the sacrifice ultimately reflected Christ's sacrificing Himself for us. You can't reflect Christ with a bunch of burnt vegetables. Somehow, that just doens't produce the right picture. So it was about the blood, but it was even more about the attitude.
     
  11. North Carolina Tentmaker

    North Carolina Tentmaker
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    The blood sacrifice of course is always a picture of Christ but there are bloodless sacrifices in scripture. There are meat offerings and drink offerings throughout the old testiment and thost meat offerings are usually some type of bread. Numbers 15:6 even gives the recepie for the 'meat' offering: two tenth deals of flour mingled with the third part of an hin of oil. Don't make the mistake of thinking 'meat' in the bible means animal flesh. It can mean any kind of food.

    To me the difference in the sacrifices is in the firstfruits.
    Abel brought the firstlings of his flock, but Cain simply brought of the fruit of the ground. Abel gave the best he had, Cain gave out of his abundance.

    In Genesis 4 we see that at least two times God spoke with Cain face to face. We can speculate about whether or not God wanted a blood sacrifice, perhaps he did, but there can be no doubt that Cain knew exactly what God wanted.
     
  12. North Carolina Tentmaker

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    How many people were there when Cain slew Abel? Even if we skip the idea that more births were multiple back then we can see that Seth was born when Adam was 130 years old. If we assume Eve bore a child every other year then she would have had 65 children at this time. With an average age of 65 if her children began bearing children at 20 years old Eve would have had over 700 grandchildren and another 12,000 great grand children. Factor in the great greats and on, the earth's population could have easily been 20,000 or more. I think this is a very conservative estimate.
     

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