1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

genocide as commanded by God?

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by gekko, Feb 6, 2008.

  1. The Scribe

    The Scribe New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2006
    Messages:
    952
    Likes Received:
    0
    Exactly, only the ignorant would call God a monster.

    God's judgments are final and just. There's no need to question his actions.

    1 Corinthians 14:38 (KJV)
    But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant.
     
  2. gekko

    gekko New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2005
    Messages:
    2,030
    Likes Received:
    0
    then tell me why it seems God is going against his own morals in the O.T.
    please i'd like to know donnA. scribe.
     
  3. The Scribe

    The Scribe New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2006
    Messages:
    952
    Likes Received:
    0

    Isaiah 55:8-9 (KJV)
    8: For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
    9: For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

    We maybe made in the image of God, but we will never have the mind of God.

    He's higher than us and created everything. God is our judge.

    We don't have any right to question his authority or judgments.
     
  4. Alcott

    Alcott Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2002
    Messages:
    9,405
    Likes Received:
    353
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Because no one can do anything about what he does. Like some in power have tried to ascribe to themselves... some popes, James I and Charles I [the "divine right of kings'], Stalin,...

    When it comes right down to it, it's that simple... God can order a nation-- men, women, children, animals-- to be slaughtered as a 'final solution.' And it ain't evil if he says it ain't. Tough luck for those kids bleeding and crying; they were born to the wrong parents.
     
  5. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2002
    Messages:
    32,913
    Likes Received:
    71
    Faith:
    Non Baptist Christian
    Not true.

    "God is not willing for ANY to perish" 2Peter 3.

    "God sends his Holy Spirit to CONVICT THE WORLD of sin and righteousness and judgment" John 16.

    "Behold I stand at the door and knock if ANYONE hears my voice AND OPENS the door I will come in" Rev 3.

    "He is the light that coming into the world enlightens EVERY man" John 1:5-9

    Even in the case of infants destroyed in the flood - it is not a certainly that they are also not saved.
     
  6. Matt Black

    Matt Black Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2003
    Messages:
    11,548
    Likes Received:
    193
    Exactly - which is why the literal interpretation can't be right.
    Agreed - which is why He would be incapable of ordering the murder of infants.
    Please explain how incitement to murder is not monstrous.
     
  7. Matt Black

    Matt Black Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2003
    Messages:
    11,548
    Likes Received:
    193
    In what way? You said @ #26:

    All I see here is a tawdry piece of moral relativism, not a viable answer.
     
  8. Matt Black

    Matt Black Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2003
    Messages:
    11,548
    Likes Received:
    193
    And only the immoral would call evil good.

    <Sigh> Let me try to spell this out step by step:

    1. God said "Thou shalt not commit murder"

    2. Killing children and babies (inside or outside the womb) is murder. Period. I don't think you'll find anyone who'd disagree with that unless they were 'pro-choice' abortionists.

    3. God cannot contradict Himself; that is one of His immutable attributes

    4. Ordering the killing of infants is ordering their murder (per #2 above), which is in direct contradiction of #1 above.

    5. Therefore, God cannot have ordered it. No way. Not in a million years. God cannot be an accessory or inciter to murder; it is against His very nature.
     
    #48 Matt Black, Feb 14, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 14, 2008
  9. The Scribe

    The Scribe New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2006
    Messages:
    952
    Likes Received:
    0
    Reread Isaiah 55:8-9, God has the right to judge as he will.

    Even if that means killing the entire population of a city, like God did with Sodom and Gomorrah.
     
  10. DHK

    DHK <b>Moderator</b>

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2000
    Messages:
    37,982
    Likes Received:
    137
    Have you set yourself up as ruler and judge over God.
    God may judge as He will and has the perfect right to do so.

    Romans 11:33-36 O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out! For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been his counsellor? Or who hath first given to him, and it shall be recompensed unto him again? For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen.
     
  11. The Scribe

    The Scribe New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2006
    Messages:
    952
    Likes Received:
    0
    That's what I said. God can do as he wishes. We don't have the right to question God's judgments.
     
  12. Alcott

    Alcott Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2002
    Messages:
    9,405
    Likes Received:
    353
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Yes or No : Was God willing that the Amalekytes perish?
     
  13. Matt Black

    Matt Black Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2003
    Messages:
    11,548
    Likes Received:
    193
    I reiterate: God does not do anything which contradicts His nature. That's not 'judging' Him; it's simply stating an obvious fact
     
  14. DHK

    DHK <b>Moderator</b>

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2000
    Messages:
    37,982
    Likes Received:
    137
    Judgment is an attribute of God's nature.
    So is justice.
    His ways are not our ways; His thoughts are not our thoughts.
    How can a finite man understand an infinite God? We cannot.

    Abraham said:
    Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right?
     
  15. Matt Black

    Matt Black Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2003
    Messages:
    11,548
    Likes Received:
    193
    The judge of the earth shall indeed do right. Murdering children and babies is not right and therefore He would not order that.

    Evil is not one of God's attributes, neither is sin. Murdering children is both evil and sinful and therefore He would not order that.
     
  16. donnA

    donnA Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2000
    Messages:
    23,354
    Likes Received:
    0
    How do you account for the fact the bible says God did. If He didn't then the bible is a lie.
    We judge this to be evil by human standards, God is not bound by our standards.
     
  17. Matt Black

    Matt Black Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2003
    Messages:
    11,548
    Likes Received:
    193
    God is however bound by His own standards - I refer you again to "Thou shalt not commit murder".

    This doesn't mean that the Bible is a 'lie' as you polemically put it, just that the 'genocidal' portions are not meant to be interpreted literally, that's all. It seems pretty clear to me.
     
  18. gekko

    gekko New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2005
    Messages:
    2,030
    Likes Received:
    0
    and to any related response of "our thoughts are not God's thoughts" etc etc.
    - all a nicely elaborated almost gift-wrapped stereotypical sunday school answer.

    come up with something unbiased.

    ------

    our standards are not God's standards of course.
    our standards should be God's standards.

    like matt has been saying - God doesn't disagree with himself - he is not a hypocrite.

    "how can a finite man understand an infinite God" you say?

    how is this information so hard to understand?
    God bless
     
  19. DHK

    DHK <b>Moderator</b>

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2000
    Messages:
    37,982
    Likes Received:
    137
    You are assuming yourself to be God.
    You don't know what God's standards are.
    He is perfect in all that He does. What seems like murder to you is not murder to him, but perhaps either mercy or justice. In the case of infants it may be mercy--taking them to heaven; in the case of adults, judgement.

    Why did he send such a devastating tsunami that wiped out a good part of the population of Indonesia? Is He a cruel and malicious God, or was it part of His attributes of both justice and mercy?

    Why not wait til heaven and you can ask him and get a better understanding of the things that you cannot understand now.

    "The secret things belong unto the Lord."
     
  20. gekko

    gekko New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2005
    Messages:
    2,030
    Likes Received:
    0
    we have a pretty good idea when we read what His word..

    who's to say God sent it?

    you assume too much about God as well.
     
Loading...