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Discussion in 'Politics' started by Rufus_1611, Aug 24, 2007.
There isn't an option for "I don't have a clue"
I'm with McDirector...he claims to be; but then again so does Bill Clinton.
And Al Sharpton. And Larry Flint.
Yes, lots of folks make the claim, but without the evidence, it's a delimma.
I'd still like the option to vote I don't have clue.
I don't doubt either one of them
You are a better man than I Gunga Din
How about I just say that I'm glad I wasn't discipled by the same folks who did either Dubya, or Bubba.
I doubt it.
All the "evidence" I have seen tells me they are a lot like me, sinful men.
In the absence of any "evidence" that they are actually unsaved, I'll let God judge 'em both. And pray we all do the same. raying:
I do understand where you are coming from, but the reason I want the "I don't have a clue" is because I think their actions too frequently belay their words. That if we looked we would find evidence to the contrary.
Not to be negative, but just the language we've heard testimony that they've used contradicts. I've heard men in my church use such language and I've had to give second thought to their testimony. (it's been rare and long ago -- but on occasion.)
I do always try to give the benefit of the doubt, but there are times, when I have to say, I just don't know. There isn't enough evidence to support what they say is true.
I agree with you ,but I wonder at this ?as a christian(presuming that he is )and knowing(presuming that he does)that Israel's land is the promised land. You have to wonder why on Earth he would pressure Sharon to give the Gaza strip to the palastinians,then wonder why it seems that Gods judges the US as he has. I don't know for sure......but we are told that they will know we are christians by our love ,one for another,as well as our fruits,my question would be ....are there any friuts?I don't see any,holding hands with arab sheiks,kissing the ring of the pope... I too would like to see a 5th choice,"haven't got a clue"
Of course, none of us know, but if someone claims to be a Christian, I normally give him/her the benefit of the doubt. As far as I know, he has done nothing to show that he isn't.
BTW, not everyone holds to a dispy/premil view, especially regarding the future of Israel. That does not make them a non-Christian.
Without checking the film itself it might be too early to comment, but the advertizement doesn't mention about how the faith was checked and tested.
In a certain sense, most of American Christians have been deceived by the notion that G Bush is a Protestant Christian.
However, I believe his belief has not changed from Episcopalian Catholic Belief. He was a Episcopalian and is said to have converted to a Methodist, which Bill Clinton claimed to be too.
But here is someone's post that she met him at the Episcopal Cathedral even after he became the President.
What is Episcopalian ? It is about 80-90% Catholic.
1) It is American version of Church of England which was invented for the divorce and remarriage of Henry 8, not much different from RCC.
2) They have the priest system, Archbishop, bishops.
3) They have an Altar in the Cathedral for the sacrifice because they don't believe in the complete Sacrifice of Jesus Christ at the Cross Once for ALL, and perform the Mass every week.
4) They call the Lord's Supper " Eucharist" which may include the "Transubstantiation" which means that they confess "they drink the human Blood" prohibited by Leviticus. This Transubstantiation may have been altered a little later reflecting the Protestants belief.
5) They conduct Penance- Confession to the Priest
6) perform the Extreme Unction
7) have the nuns, diocese, the same admin system as Catholic
8) call Mary as Mother of God
9) in the discussion with Roman Catholic for the union.
10) Perform the Infant Baptism ( Unbelievers Baptism bringing millions of unbelievers into the Christendom)
11) Believe in the Baptismal Regeneration which means that anyone can be born again by Water Baptism.
12) Separation between Priesthood and Laity ( Doctrine of Nicolaitane)
13) They see the true believers like fundamental Baptists and Brethren as cults
14) they justify the Crusade, Catholic's killing Albigenes, Waldensians, Anabaptists.
15) call the church "Cathedral" which is the Catholic term coming from Cathedra ( Peter's chair)
They may be proud of Martin Luther King.
I wish anyone should have checked on these issues if anyone tried to report on his faith.
That's why it is no wonder that we heard G Bush saying these:
1) Let's run the Crusade to Afghanistan when US invaded it.
2) In London, he said we, Christians, Catholic, Islam, Judaism, all serve the same God,...
3) Performed the 9/11 memorial at the Washington Cathedral.
4) appointed 2 Catholics to the Supreme Court Judges
I remember a Texan woman who murdered someone but later believed in the Lord and was born again, then many Christians asked Governor Bush to grant the pardon reducing from the Death Penalty to Life Sentence, but he refused and the woman was executed.
Has anyone interviewed G Bush about how he claims he was born again and what was his spiritual experience?
He may have been born again in terms of Episcopalians, by Baptismal Regeneration which is a ridiculous heresy.
So many people are deceived, I believe. But our Lord kindly admonish us this way:
Ye shall know them by their fruits ( Mt 7:16)
From your source:
"With all sincerity, and partisanship aside I tell you: This is a special man! There is a peace and a Godlinessabout him. It radiates from him. It is the only reason that I was able to remain calm. It was more than the adrenaline I've felt when I've met other famous people. A goodness flows through this man. He has more than my vote in November. He has my respect, my prayers, and my gratitude. Whatever your political affiliation, and whether or not you agree with his decisions, you should take comfort in the fact that--despite recent press attacks--this is a man of integrity who makes decisions because he believes that are RIGHT, not popular. He makes these decisions with a heavy heart and through prayer."
As you say,
Ye shall know them by their fruits ( Mt 7:16)
Actually that was the view from another Episcopalian lady, but the objective, neutral view may be quite different from hers.
Today millions of Iraqi civilians have become refugees and are suffering from the extreme difficulties.
If he hadn't caused the Iraqi War wasting lots of blood and resources, by now US could have prevented Iran from Nuke development by the pinpoint attack onto the Iranian Nuke site.
It seems that God doesn't listen to his prayer, nor helps him and his administration either.
But what if someone believes that Christians and Moslems worship the same god (Allah = Yahweh) and that there are more ways to heaven than through a saving faith in Jesus Christ? Then do you wonder about their Christianity? Bush has stated this twice for the record (TV interview and newspaper).
I can't see that it matters who it was, except to you.
She sounds at least as neutral or objective as you do.
No, when one sees another in depth, as many are cheated and even the Satan disguise himself as an angel of light. ( I don't mean he is like that, but many do not know another in depth).
Already, I said, millions of Americans are cheated believing that he is a protestant. His belief is far nearer to Catholicism. Why do the millions of protestant Christians support him and feel responsible for his failure ?
As I said, you are neither neutral nor objective.
But judgemental does seem to be a good fit.
I believe he is wrong with both statements.
He may really believe God and Allah are the same God. This is probably more a lack of knowledge about Islam and their beliefs than a statement about his Christianity. That hardly disqualifies him as a Christian. It is his acceptance of Jesus Christ as the Son of God and his personal Savior that makes him a "Christian". As he grows in his Christian life, I believe he will come to think differently.
As for the second statement, there are many Christian Denominations that believe one must have faith plus works to get to heaven. I disagree, but that theology does not disqualify them as "Christian" either.
1"Do not judge, or you too will be judged. 2For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.
3"Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 4How can you say to your brother, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? 5You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye.