God will call His Elect to Salvation

Discussion in 'Calvinism/Arminianism Debate' started by evangelist6589, Feb 17, 2014.

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  1. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589
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    I used to think differently and watching some old open air sermons, or even reading some old writings this was obvious. But the doctrine of election becomes even more clear to me as I learn more and trust God. For example last week when I took my trip to another state I had many reject the gospel message, but one female was very CONVICTED by the 10 Commandments and I just saw it soak into her soul as she sat and thank. She told me she has NEVER heard the gospel explained this way before as perhaps she was a false convert I do not know.... Then yesterday while I was out witnessing and open air preaching I preached the doctrine of election very clearly and with confidence. I had many mock me, but one man was convicted as God drew him to hear my message.

    My point? If you are out witnessing and sharing the gospel do not give up but continue to do the work and preach to every creature (Mk 16:15) for God will bring his elect into your path and their hearts will be softened and they will hear your message. God does not need some fancy apologetic arguments to win people to himself, nor does he need some professional evangelist. You alone can be used to bring people to salvation, just be faithful. I believe God can use gospel tracts and presentations that are not complete to bring His own to salvation, but these presentations can be dangerous as false converts sit and soak on them and why the 10 Commandments and a call to self-denial, and the Lordship of Christ must be addressed.

    I have been reading the book God is the Gospel which is a good read. Not as detailed as a certain book by Arthur W. Pink but still a good one.
     
    #1 evangelist6589, Feb 17, 2014
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  2. JamesL

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    If you hold to any Reformed idea of election, you are seriously misguided. Doesn't matter if your take is that God chose some, haphazardly, to believe, or that He chooses those who He knows will choose Him.

    Both sides of that debate are dead wrong, arguing whether a bicycle has three wheels or four.
     
  3. pinoybaptist

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    by the time any missionary or preacher sounds out the gospel call, God was way ahead of him and already gave out the effectual call, like He did at Corinth (I have much people here).
     
  4. Earth Wind and Fire

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    Yes but Pinoy, let us not interfere .....God only knows, this guy can be used by the HS. As odd as it sounds, Ive been there to perhaps be a witness to Gods love & grace....and maybe thats all the Lord required of ME at the time. NO I WAS NOT THE REASON, just a witness, (And I am the better for it). So maybe, just maybe it is a reinforcement for the Witnessing Believer more than anything.
     
  5. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire
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    Oh Evan.......I really encourage that you read PINK though. There are websites that you can get tons of his work so you dont have to read an entire book ....just google it.

    Martyn Lloyd-Jones is another one....."Studies in the Sermon on the Mount" will communicate to you everything Jesus wanted you to know & be.

    Dont pass these guys for these moderns......You could get lost in both forever, because they are that good. Trust me.
     
  6. convicted1

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    Here, here!!!!

    :thumbs::thumbsup::thumbs::thumbs:

    Jesus stated it best when He said, "All that the Father gave Me, I have lost none."
     
  7. Inspector Javert

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    ............save Judas. Whom he lost.

    Jhn 17:12
    While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.
     
    #7 Inspector Javert, Feb 17, 2014
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  8. convicted1

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    Judas was given so that the scriptures would be fulfilled.

    But I will begrudgedly say touche'... :laugh:
     
  9. thisnumbersdisconnected

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    The Father never gave Judas to Jesus. Being called to sit in a seminary doesn't mean you're saved.
     
  10. convicted1

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    The way I've come to understand it, was Judas was given to Jesus in the sense, not that he was one of the sheep, but to fulfill the scriptures. Such as the "scars in the house of my friends", "he raised his heel against me" for example. So I do believe Judas was given to Jesus, as it appears Jesus said "save one, the son of perdition", was Judas...
     
  11. evangelist6589

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    Do you have any good books by Pink? This book looks really good.

    Eternal Punishment

    I have the book Spiritual Depression by Jones but have not read it. Is it any good?

    I was planning on my next good read being Paul Washer's latest book, but my plans may change.
     
  12. Yeshua1

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    Well, both jesus and paul disagree with you on this issue, as BOTh clearly taught to us that men are saved when and bythe working of the Holy spriit on their behalf, APART from human will/desires/efforts!
     
  13. Allan

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    Actually, the way you just worded that "I" believe is not correct. I could be misreading you but here is my points in contrast to what I perceive your statement is saying:

    While yes, we are SAVED apart from works, we will not come to eternal salvation apart from the persons choice to believe what God has said. In fact, scripture even tells us that it is by faith the propitiation is applied to them (Rom 3:25). Belief/Faith can never be called a work or effort (Rom 4:3-6). But at the same time, neither does any man come to such faith a part from the work of God in their life - but ALSO neither do they understand sin, righteous, and the judgment to come apart from that SAME work of God via the Holy Spirit.

    Jesus makes the declaration in many places 'your faith' and Paul begs or pleads with the people to 'be reconciled' (meaning the person is the doer of the action), and these are just a small few pieces that contradict your above in which the person does not desire or chooses (will) belief. The reason? Because in all instances it is the person's desire and will that is being called to respond which is 'active' not 'passive'.

    NOW – let me make 2 points here:

    1. Faith does not save a person. It is not being offered to nor exchanged with God for salvation. It is simplythe trusting that all of what God has said and done - is true.

    2.My second point is that the person will respond only in conjunction with and to the working of God. However they will not respond in belief apart from the work of God

    Again, what is actually being stressed by Paul, Peter, Jesus, and others is that man will not come to faith of his own - meaning without outside and internal influence.

    Here is an interesting question to ponder as well – Jesus even stated that some are intentionally kept from knowing the (more) truth because if they know the truth they would believe and be converted (John 12:40; Mar 4:11-12). Now granted these being spoken to and about are the religious leaders and people who have already rejected God from scripture and thus the Messiah He has sent.. but the statement is still an interesting one.
     
  14. Luke2427

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    This is where all Arminians miss it (yes, yes, I know... you are not an Arminian because you believe eternal security, right? So, I'll just call you 4/5th's Arminian).

    4/5ths Arminians think that the words "faith" and "choice" are interchangeable. Of course they have no Bible for it, but they can't see that. All they can see is what they were raised to think.

    So when they see someone putting faith in Christ they actually see someone "CHOOSING" Christ.

    And everywhere the Bible says "faith" they subconsciously (ironically against their will) think "choice." It's not there... but its how their minds work.

    And that is why they miss the biggest part of biblical soteriology.

    They believe "By grace are you saved through CHOICE..." That is what they see when they Read Ephesians 2.


    But the Calvinist has the blinders removed and he can see the verse for what it actually says: "By grace are you saved through FAITH..."
     
  15. convicted1

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    (((((HALLELUJAH)))))

    :jesus::godisgood::jesus::godisgood:
     
  16. quantumfaith

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    Luke, just for clarity sake, are you suggesting that "arminians" do not accept eternal security? If so, you should reconsider.
     
  17. Luke2427

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    I'm talking about people who spurn the title "Arminian" because they ignorantly think it does not apply to them, they say, because they believe eternal security.

    We know better but you have to talk to them in a way they can understand.
     
  18. Earth Wind and Fire

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    Thats a splendid summary! :thumbs:
     
  19. Benjamin

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    Really?!? You guys think that fallacious rhetoric is even noteworthy and/or worth your praise??? Seriously??? [​IMG]

    [​IMG]....Cool!!



    5 point Calvinists think that the words "faith" and "determinism" are interchangeable. Of course they have no Bible for it, but they can't see that. All they can see is what they were raised to think.

    So when they see someone putting faith in Christ they actually see someone being "DETERMINED" by Christ.

    And everywhere the Bible says "faith" they subconsciously (ironically according to their will) think "Determinism." It's not there... but its how their minds work.

    And that is why they miss the biggest part of biblical soteriology.

    They believe "By grace are you saved through DETERMINISM..." That is what they see when they Read Ephesians 2.


    But the Arminian has the blinders removed and he can see the verse for what it actually says: "By grace are you saved through FAITH..."

    [​IMG]
     
    #19 Benjamin, Feb 21, 2014
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  20. Earth Wind and Fire

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    I am not a Calvinist. But I know what is right & I know whats wrong.....and you are way off course. But then again, thats your "Choice" :laugh::laugh::tongue3:
     
    #20 Earth Wind and Fire, Feb 21, 2014
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