"He shall baptize you with....

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by ktn4eg, Jan 3, 2014.

  1. ktn4eg

    ktn4eg
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    .....the Holy Ghost, and with fire:" (Mt 3:12).

    I've read about different interpretations of what this baptism "with fire" really means.

    Some have written that this baptism [i.e., "immersion"] refers to what happened on the day of Pentecost as recorded in Acts 2.

    While others claim that this baptism refers to what Jesus Christ will do to those who fail to receive Him as their Savior after they die [cf. Heb 9:27, 10:27-30].

    How exactly do you interpret what John the Baptist was telling his audience in Matthew 3?

    Could it possibly be referring to both the Acts 2 and what Hebrews 9 & 10 statements?
     
  2. Scarlett O.

    Scarlett O.
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    Here's a commentary with much scripture and is not dogmatic about the interpretation.

     
  3. kyredneck

    kyredneck
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    Just a very brief scan of the text reveals two baptisms with two objects and two events:

    ...he shall baptize you in the Holy Spirit and in fire: whose fan is in his hand, and he will thoroughly cleanse his threshing-floor; and he will gather his wheat into the garner, but the chaff he will burn up with unquenchable fire.

    Paul writes in the same vein here:

    Behold then the goodness and severity of God: toward them that fell, severity; but toward thee, God`s goodness... Ro 11:22

    [add]

    The wrath to come, i.e. the baptism of fire that John was referring to was the awful judgment that was soon to come upon 'that generation' (even now the axe lieth at the root of the trees):

    http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?p=1671933#post1671933
     
    #3 kyredneck, Jan 3, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 3, 2014
  4. convicted1

    convicted1
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    I always thought that "with fire" was in regards to refining, with cleaning. Whenever they make gold bricks, everytime they put it in the fire, it brings the impurities to the surface where they can scrape them off. I see it that when we're baptized "with fire", it's God's way of burning the impurties up, cleansing us up, so that He dwells in a clean temple, the inner man.
     
  5. kyredneck

    kyredneck
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    3:12 'thoroughly cleanse his threshing-floor' is synonymous with 8:12 'sons of the kingdom cast forth' is synonymous with Ro 11 'natural branches broken off' is synonymous with 13:41 'gather out of his kingdom all things that cause stumbling' is synonymous with 13:49 'sever the wicked from among the righteous'.

    Take a couple steps back Willis, see what ‘fire’ is signifying here in the context:

    7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to his baptism, he said unto them, Ye offspring of vipers, who warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
    8 Bring forth therefore fruit worthy of repentance:
    9 and think not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.
    10 And even now the axe lieth at the root of the trees: every tree therefore that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
    11 I indeed baptize you in water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you in the Holy Spirit and in fire:
    12 whose fan is in his hand, and he will thoroughly cleanse his threshing-floor; and he will gather his wheat into the garner, but the chaff he will burn up with unquenchable fire. Mt 3

    Look at the word ‘fire’ in a concordance and see what fire is more times than not representative of in the scriptures:

    31 And I will pour out mine indignation upon thee; I will blow upon thee with the fire of my wrath; and I will deliver thee into the hand of brutish men, skilful to destroy. Ezek 21

    20 As they gather silver and brass and iron and lead and tin into the midst of the furnace, to blow the fire upon it, to melt it; so will I gather you in mine anger and in my wrath, and I will lay you there, and melt you.
    21 Yea, I will gather you, and blow upon you with the fire of my wrath, and ye shall be melted in the midst thereof. Ezek 22

    19 For in my jealousy and in the fire of my wrath have I spoken, Surely in that day there shall be a great shaking in the land of Israel; Ezek 38

    9 Thou wilt make them as a fiery furnace in the time of thine anger: Jehovah will swallow them up in his wrath, And the fire shall devour them. Ps 21

    5 How long, O Jehovah? wilt thou be angry for ever? Shall thy jealousy burn like fire?
    6 Pour out thy wrath upon the nations that know thee not, And upon the kingdoms that call not upon thy name. Ps 79

    46 How long, O Jehovah? wilt thou hide thyself for ever? How long shall thy wrath burn like fire? Ps 89

    4 Circumcise yourselves to Jehovah, and take away the foreskins of your heart, ye men of Judah and inhabitants of Jerusalem; lest my wrath go forth like fire, and burn so that none can quench it, because of the evil of your doings. Jer 4

    12 O house of David, thus saith Jehovah, Execute justice in the morning, and deliver him that is robbed out of the hand of the oppressor, lest my wrath go forth like fire, and burn so that none can quench it, because of the evil of your doings. Jer 21

    4 He hath bent his bow like an enemy, he hath stood with his right hand as an adversary, And hath slain all that were pleasant to the eye: In the tent of the daughter of Zion he hath poured out his wrath like fire. Lam 2

    6 Who can stand before his indignation? and who can abide in the fierceness of his anger? his wrath is poured out like fire, and the rocks are broken asunder by him. Nahum 1

    The ‘baptism of fire’ of Mt 3 is the same as here:

    49 I came to cast fire upon the earth [the land]; and what do I desire, if it is already kindled?
    50 But I have a baptism to be baptized with; and how am I straitened till it be accomplished!
    51 Think ye that I am come to give peace in the earth [the land]? I tell you, Nay; but rather division:
    52 for there shall be from henceforth five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three. Lu 12

    And He clearly identifies what form this wrath [fire] was going to manifest itself, DIVISION, i.e., CIVIL WAR.
    http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?p=1671933#post1671933

    “ In the history of "The Wars of the Jews" by Josephus we have a detailed account, written by an eye witness, of the almost unbelievable sufferings of the Jews during the siege of Jerusalem. To this account we will refer later on; but we wish to state at this point that the distresses of those who were hemmed in by the sudden appearance of the Roman armies were peculiar in this respect, namely, that what they endured was mainly self-inflicted. That is to say, they suffered far more from cruelties and tortures inflicted upon one another, than from the common enemy outside the walls. In this strange feature of the case it was surely "a time of trouble such as never was since there was a nation, even to that same time" (#Da 12:1).”

    The ‘baptism of fire’ came upon ‘THAT GENERATION’ of Christ’s day, the same generation that betrayed and murdered Him:

    23 Woe unto them that are with child and to them that give suck in those days! for there shall be great distress upon the land, and wrath unto this people.
    32 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all things be accomplished. Lu 21
     
    #5 kyredneck, Jan 3, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 3, 2014

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