Head Covering and Silence?

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by Jesus is Lord, Jan 12, 2006.

  1. Jesus is Lord

    Jesus is Lord
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    Hi there,

    I know that this is an ooooold and much discussed topic. But I ran into some guys recently that confronted me with their belief that women should be silent and should wear a covering. I am not talking about teaching and preaching etc. but the fact that they should be silent, period.

    These things are not very common in churches today and I am interested in your main points, why you do NOT think it is necessary, to wear a covering or to be completely silent as a women.

    P.S.
    Please don't beat me [​IMG] I am just interested in the different reasons, why it may NOT be necessary.
     
  2. Johnv

    Johnv
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    It's fair to say that they're perverting scripture to meet their agenda. Scripture does not require silence of women in general, nor does it require women to wear headcoverings in general.

    When Paul was discussing the issue of headcoverings, he was addressing the issue of spiritual authority, using the then-custom of headcoverings to make his point via analogy.

    When Paul was discussing the issue fo women and silence, he was addressing the issue wives (who sat outside the church) talking to their husbands (who sat inside the church). Paul's point was the need for silence and respect during the message portion of worship.
     
  3. standingfirminChrist

    standingfirminChrist
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    The command for headcoverings can be found in 1 Corinthians 11:4 - 6, 15

    First, let me say, it is a cultural thing. The seaport of Corinth was a busy town where merchants sold their wares. There were pagan temples in Corinth where the worshippers there were known to shear their hair shave their heads and walk around with their hair extremely short, or bald heads showing. Paul did not want the church body to be identified with the pagan worshippers.

    1 Corinthians 11:4 Every man praying or prophesying, having [his] head covered, dishonoureth his head.

    In verse 4, we see Paul instructing the men not to have their heads covered when praying. When he prays with his head covered, he dishonors Christ (v.3). Why? Because he is identified by others as being one of the pagans praying to their false goddess.

    1 Corinthians 11:5 But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with [her] head uncovered dishonoureth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven.

    A woman who prayed without a veil brought dishonor to her husband. It was the same as if she were one of those pagan worshippers.

    1 Corinthians 11:6 For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered.

    Now, many would argue that this covering is her hair, for v. 15 states that the woman's hair is for a covering. The covering in this verse cannot be hair. If it were hair, the verse would read as such....

    'For if the woman have short hair or be bald, let her also have short hair or be bald: but if it be a shame for a woman to have short hair or be bald, let her have long hair.' This statement makes no sense whatsoever if you change covered to hair.

    1 Corinthians 11:15 But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for [her] hair is given her for a covering.

    The word covering here is a different word than the word covered above. The word covering here means to cast down, or to let down. But above, the word covered means to veil; to wrap around wholly. If covered were referring to the hair being all the covering a woman needed, again, verse 6 would make no sense.

    The covering or veil, was necessary in those days. In some areas of the world, the covering is still used. Here in America, we see no need to follow this custom.

    Now, Mennonites wear what we call a doily. It is funny how the covering shrank from a veil that could be wrapped fully around to a little doily. The Amish wear bonnets, again, not the same veil we see in Paul's day.
     
  4. TaterTot

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    "First, let me say, it is a cultural thing."

    How can this be but alcohol not be? [​IMG]

    I agree, it was a custom then, and we are not required to wear them today.
     
  5. Johnv

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    Heheh! Since consumption of alcohol has never been forbidden (though drunkenness has always been forbidden) it's not a similar situation. Of course, that's gettiing waaaayyyy off topic. [​IMG]
     
  6. DHK

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    Did Paul say it was "a cultural thing?"
    Does the Bible say that?"
    Or do Christians just like to avoid commands of Scripture that are not convenient to them in their culture?
    I believe you will find the latter to be the case.
    Let the rationalization of Scripture begin.
    DHK
     
  7. Johnv

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    No. It's readily aparrant in the context when reading the entire chapter/section. One must always consider the context when studying scripture. Otherwise, misinterpretation and misapplication are likely to occur.

    DHK, I know that you hold the position that headcoverings are mandatory. While I disagree with you completely, I don't disrespect your view, or you, whotsoever. Since the real topic of the OP wasn't about "are headcoverings required" I respectfully suggest that you and I (and hopefully others) will not hijack the topic by having that debate here.
     
  8. DHK

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    Don't hijack the thread?
    Since the real topic of the thread wasn't about "are headcoverings required,"
    What were you reading John??


    Now what was that topic again?
    DHK
     
  9. TaterTot

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    It was to explain why you believe it is NOT necessary to wear one AND for women to be silent in the churches. So I think he only wants people who DONT think along those lines to post their reasoning. [​IMG]
     
  10. Baptist in Richmond

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    Should we also wear robes?
     
  11. standingfirminChrist

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    That's the question for the pants thread.

    BTW, I graduated from 3rd grade in Richmond in 1990.
     
  12. TaterTot

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    Wow, you are younger than I thought! lol [​IMG] I graduated from high school that year.
     
  13. standingfirminChrist

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    TaterTot. I am older than you. lol
     
  14. gb93433

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    If women wore much as was acceptable during the time of 1 Cor. they would wear a burka and look like the oppressed women did in Afghanistan.

    What women wear in one country is not the same as what women wear in other countries.

    I know of no women who pray with their head covered in any American church, do you?
     
  15. DHK

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    The context is "in the church".
    The answer to your question is, yes.
     
  16. standingfirminChrist

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    TaterTot, so ya don't wonder too long, I graduated 3rd grade in Richmond, Va in 1990. This is true.

    It was at the VRCB. Virginia Rehabilitation Center for the Blind. Braille only goes up to 3 grades. I graduated 3rd grade braille. lol

    I am sure Baptist in Richmond knows where it is. 401 Azalea Ave.
     
  17. TaterTot

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    LOL, thats great Standingfirm!
     
  18. standingfirminChrist

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    When I was attending the school back in the 80's and 90's, I told people that I was a member of an exclusive club that most people would never see the inside of. lol
     
  19. Baptist in Richmond

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    That's the question for the pants thread.
    </font>[/QUOTE]The pants thread?
    [​IMG]

    Oops, sorry: I guess my graduation card is about fifteen years too late!

    Regards to you and yours, Pastor,
    BiR
     
  20. standingfirminChrist

    standingfirminChrist
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    lol, BiR.

    I reckon since we need to make our women wear headcoverings, we may as well go full throttle and don the robes too. lol
     

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