Hour of Power / Bayless Conley

I'm not a fan of the HoP. There's too little repentance preached. But I've never sen anything overtly contrary to scripture. My cousin is a church member there and he gets what he needs. It's not my cup of tea, but it may be others. Now that the senoir pastor has retired and the HoP has a fresh face, it seems to be getting a bit more salvation centered. Time will tell.

BC is pretty solid gospel-wise. Again, he's not quite my cup of tea, being a bit too Calvarean for me, but he seems to be on the mark.

 

Reminiscent of a Calvary Chapel environment.

 

Nothing wrong. I just don't care for the Calvary Chapel type of worship.

Just because I don't care for something, doesn't mean it's in scripturally wrong. I don't care for goat's milk, but it's not a sin to drink it.

 

That's irrelevant to this topic. If you want to find out info on Calvary Chapels, visit www.capvarychapel.org or www.calvarychapel.com

If you want to discuss the CC church, it would be a good idea to start another thread.

 

xdisciplex,

I have watched Pastor T.D. Jakes and he does not water down the message of the Gospel. He is dynamic and energetic about what he preaches. He points out the hypocrisy of many Christians and gives you the possibility of Christian growth. His messages are Bible centered. If he had a church in Lehigh Valley I sure would attend his services on a regular basis. He has spiritual substance in his sermons and not a lot of hot air as some speakers give us. His message is thought out and shows some real depth of commitment if Christians want to grow in maturity in Christ.

 

http://www.apologeticsindex.org/j11.html

Jakes is connected with the Oneness Pentecostal which believes in baptismal regeneration, a well known heresy. He holds to many other heresies as well which stem from the Oneness Pentecostals such as
"The belief that God exists in three "manifestations" which is called Sabellianism or modalism."
DHK

 

DHK,

Many branches of the Christian Church believe in baptismal regeneration among whom are: the Presbyterians, Roman Catholics, Episcopalalians, Lutherans. Even if Pastor Jakes believes in this it does not make him a non-Christian.

Many Christians believe also that the first dispensations of time God the Father created the world. Then the Son, Jesus the Messiah offered His era of time which was thirty-three years. And lastly, after His ascension the age of the Holy Spirit came into being. I know this is not accurate but many young Christians believe this is true. Most of us believe in the unity of the one Godhead, probably only because some experienced S.S. teacher, pastor, professor, or theologian explained it to us. This again, does not make a pastor a false prophet. It does, however, mean that his orthodoxy is tainted. And for many of us Pentecostalism is a plus because they do not merely 'tip the hat' if you will to the Third Person of the Holy Trinity. Their pastors teach the people to respect and worship God the Spirit. Plus, they do not deny I Corinthians 12 & 14, nor do they explain these chapters away as being merely national languages. Pastor Jakes probably believe that Christ died for all sinners which places him in the truth and not like Calvinists who deny the full atonement of Jesus Christ for sinners.

As you see I have caused you to look at Pastor Jake types in a better light, than you are able to do according to your defined views in theology.

For me, only if a clergy person denies the Deity of Christ will I then call that one a false prophet. Why? Because if they deny that Jesus is Divine the are absolutely not saved [I John 4:2].

Regards,
Berrian, Th.D.

 

Ray ,if one denies the Trinity -- one is not a Christian . It is too foundational . I know that trying to explain the Trinity is hard but Jesus is God , The Holy Spirit is God and the Father is God . Using the term persons may not be the best word to use but I don't think another comes close at this time . The word manifestation is too weak and leads to more confusion .

I was involved with some inner-city folks years ago who were into the " birthing " teaching of Jakes . It was a mess . The black community at large is highly vulnerable to Jakes' heresies . The white community has there hands full as well
with multiple false teachings holding sway .

 

Let's stay on topic here folks. In the above quoted post Ray has intorduced a whole bunch of topics that are well debated in their own threads in this forum. Please do not take the "bait" he has thrown out here and drive this thread off topic. The subject of this thread is the Hour of Power (T.D. Jakes). Please stay on topic.

Yours in Christ,

Bible-Boy,
Forum Moderator

 

Does it matter?
Jakes believes that it is necessary for a man to be baptized in order to be saved. Works does not save. We are saved by grace through faith alone. Not through baptism. He preaches a false gospel. That is all that one needs to know.
DHK

 

Baptism does not save. Baptism is an act of obedience after salvation and an outward profession that one has been saved.

 

Does it matter?
Jakes believes that it is necessary for a man to be baptized in order to be saved. Works does not save. We are saved by grace through faith alone. Not through baptism. He preaches a false gospel. That is all that one needs to know.
DHK </font>[/QUOTE]Brother DHK,

You are exactly right. The teaching of baptismal regeneration is one of the primary reasons why we are Baptists and not part of one of these other demoninations. However, I would never attempt to argue that members of those denominations are not saved. That is not the issue here (as Ray appears to be attempting to assert). The issue is whether or not T.D. Jakes teaches false doctrine.

 

Rippon,

I believe and was taught in Bible College and seminary about the truth of the Trinity.

When I was saved as a youth of eleven years of age I hardly knew the difference between the Trinity and the name Tony, and yet the Lord took away my sins and gave me salvation making me a child of God.

There are doubless other Christians who confuse the modes of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. They cannot process at this point the fact that God is one and yet He speaks of Himself often in our age as God the Holy Spirit [John 14:16,17,26 & I John 2:27]

Just because people are learning about their saving faith does not place them back into the Kingdom of darkness.

Berrian, Th.D.

 

DHK,

You said, 'Does it matter?
Jakes believes that it is necessary for a man to be baptized in order to be saved. Works does not save. We are saved by grace through faith alone. Not through baptism. He preaches a false gospel. That is all that one needs to know.'

 

http://www.apologeticsindex.org/j11.html

Jakes position on baptismal regeneration, and on the trinity make him a heretic. The difference between his view of baptismal regeneration and other Prostestant views is that the Oneness Pentecostal view (T.D. Jakes) believe that there is no other way of salvation but through baptism. If baptism (and their baptism) is not a part of your salvation, then you are not saved. That is a definite mark of a cult.
He is a Oneness Pentecostal, a heretical cult. They do not believe in the Trinity as evidenced above. If you do not believe in the trinity it goes to stand that you do not believe in the same Jesus as the Bible. You do not believe that Jesus is God, at least as the Bible describes him as God. He preaches a false god, a false Jesus.
DHK