I would like some feedback!

Discussion in 'Free-For-All Archives' started by JesusandGeorge04, Oct 31, 2004.

  1. JesusandGeorge04

    JesusandGeorge04
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    I would like some feedback on an article I wrote for a local paper. Bring your bibles and enjoy!

    http://thirtyfour.org/

    [Names removed. Threads may not be addressed to any person by name]

    [ November 01, 2004, 06:42 PM: Message edited by: Dr. Bob ]
     
  2. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy
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    Here is one statement of yours that shows that you are writing from a liberal viewpoint:

    "Certainly the Bible condemns heterosexual promiscuity with more vigor and frequency and is silent regarding the allegedly deleterious social effects of allowing committed same-sex couples to enjoy the same rights as heterosexuals."

    That is just so false from start to finish that one wonders why you even bothered to post it on the Baptist Board unless you wanted to start a debate on same-sex marriage? The truth of the matter is that you have the same rights on marriage that I do. You have the right to marry a person of the opposite sex. That is the only right that I have. No right is being denied you. Furthermore, homosexuality is strongly condemned in both the Old Testament and the New Testament.
     
  3. JesusandGeorge04

    JesusandGeorge04
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    Indeed I am. I am also writing from a Christian viewpoint... do you find them incompatable for some reason?

    No, I simply find that many Christians read their own cultural prejudices into scripture, producing a very unchristlike respresentation of the Word.

    As I am a heterosexual, I agree that no right is being denied me; for homosexuals however, their desire to be married under the eye of god (and many churches want to) is being denied them by others who feel differently. Why is their choice under god anyone's business but their's and god's? Why should your particular understanding of scripture be law?

    Yes, but as I stated the contexts within scripture are much narrower than the broad interpretations that many Christians apply them to.

    Just out of curiousity, what did you think about the rest of what I wrote?
     
  4. corinne

    corinne
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    Can you please back this up with Testament chapters and verses? Thanks

    Corinne
     
  5. JesusandGeorge04

    JesusandGeorge04
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    Ummm... are you addressing me or mouse?

    What did you think of the article as a whole?
     
  6. Maverick

    Maverick
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    I don't have a cultural perspective. The Bible aka God's Word has said that homosexuality is a sin. If it didn't I wouldn't care about the issue at all.
     
  7. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy
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    Sodomites have the right to marry a member of the opposite sex; therefore, they have the same rights in marriage as a hetrosexual has. No right has been denied them that any other person has. They do not deserve special rights because they cannot win an election on the issue of same-sex marriage.
     
  8. corinne

    corinne
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    Can you please back this up with Testament chapters and verses? Thanks

    Corinne
    </font>[/QUOTE]I was addressing the person who said that homosexuality is condemned in both the Old and New Testaments.

    Corinne
     
  9. corinne

    corinne
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    It may be a sin, but if it is, it is a sin among a multitude of sins. To judge and condemn a homosexual for his way of life is also a sin. Where in the New testament do you find such a condemnation? Christian Homosexuals are under grace as much as Christian heterosexuals. As for the non Christian homosexuals, you are still required, as a Christian, to love them "a priori" as human beings, rather than as "brothers or sisters in Christ".

    Corinne
     
  10. Baptist in Richmond

    Baptist in Richmond
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    I have looked at your article, but I am leaving for Roanoke, VA on a business trip. I will respond to you when I return to Richmond. Please keep this discussion going.....

    Hope this post finds all of you doing well,

    BiR
     
  11. Baptist in Richmond

    Baptist in Richmond
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    There is nothing wrong with a liberal viewpoint.

    Not saying that I agree/disagree with you here, but if you are going to make a statement like this, at least give us examples of what is "so false from start to finish."

    Like I said: please keep this discussion going.

    Hope you have a great week CMG,

    BiR
     
  12. Hardsheller

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    It may be a sin, but if it is, it is a sin among a multitude of sins. To judge and condemn a homosexual for his way of life is also a sin. Where in the New testament do you find such a condemnation? Christian Homosexuals are under grace as much as Christian heterosexuals. As for the non Christian homosexuals, you are still required, as a Christian, to love them "a priori" as human beings, rather than as "brothers or sisters in Christ".

    Corinne
    </font>[/QUOTE]So how do you account for the brother in 1 Cor 5 who had his father's wife outside of the bonds of matrimony? He was a member of the church and the Apostle Paul said kick him out for his sinful sexual behavior. Are you suggesting we should tolerate sinful sexual behavior on the part of church members who are gay?
     
  13. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy
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    It seems that you lay down rules for Christian behavior but you do so based upon your own opinion. You assert that the Christian has judged and condemned "a homosexual for his way of life" sinfully. Nothing could be further from the truth. The homosexual confesses that he engages in sodomy. Sodomy is the sin, as you know.

    Leviticus 18:22 Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.

    Matthew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. (Jesus)


    Romans 1:24-32 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
    25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
    26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
    27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
    28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
    29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
    30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
    31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
    32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.
     
  14. Maverick

    Maverick
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    Yes, read Romans 1. Jesus fulfilled the Law but He did not destroy the moral law hence murder, rape etc are still sins and crimes in most places. Homosexuality is still a sin and had no rights in the the OT. Since Israel was under Roman rule they had to abide by those laws. Had Israel been free there would have been no rights there. In fact, note that it is in the pagan cities of Rome and Corinth that Paul speaks to the issues. Since Paul quotes a lot of the law I would say that it is still useful in many places.

    We are free from the ceremonial law and the law of sin and death but God's morals never change so how He felt about it in the OT is clearly expressed in the NT. Nothing has changed except us.

    I can still love them as Christ loved them but I do not condone their sin and make it respectable by giving it rights equal to what God says is a holy bed and undefiled, ie the marriage bed. Like all sinnser I point them to the Cross not the marriage altar.
     
  15. JesusandGeorge04

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    Ummm... it is not a 'special right' to possess the same right to marry who they choose to as we heterosexuals have the choice to do. Even if I was to grant you your logic, they would still not possess 'special rights', as you and I could marry a same-wex partner as well as they could (not that we would want to... but on that note, why would a gay person want to marry an opposite-sex partner?).

    But we're digressing into badly reasoned wedge issues which shouldn't take up all of our energy; many people suffer in our nation and around the world, and they need our love and support. What is to be done for them?
     
  16. LadyEagle

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    Posting Rule # 2. Topics condoning homosexuality are prohibited.

    This thread needs closed.
     
  17. JesusandGeorge04

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    To that I would offer the warning against using Paul too frivolously--- 2nd Peter 3:15-17:

    "And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness."

    Beware of using God's Word to exclude His children.
     
  18. JesusandGeorge04

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    Homosexuality is not the topic of this thread; I would rather have people talk about the bible's position on war and poverty.

    I would hope you took more out of my article than just that one paragraph...
     
  19. JesusandGeorge04

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    Church mouse guy, I addressed both the OT and NT references to homosexuality, and their contexts from my point of view... and I gave it only a paragraph for a reason:

    The Word speaks of promoting peace and social responsibility FAR more than it does homosexuality. Why don't we talk about that?

    Enough with the wedge issues... Poverty and war harm humanity. Thousands of people die both here and abroad, and all people here can talk about is homosexuality?

    Look into your heart!!!
     
  20. Hardsheller

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    To that I would offer the warning against using Paul too frivolously--- 2nd Peter 3:15-17:

    "And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness."

    Beware of using God's Word to exclude His children.
    </font>[/QUOTE]Well then what standard would you suggest be used to discipline church members? Man's Word?

    Or better yet maybe you could just give us a list of the books of the Bible that are pertinent to us today. :eek:
     

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