If a christian slides back then does this prove he never was a christian?

Works have nothing to do with your eternal salvation. So if you don't have any works after you are saved that doesn't prove nor disprove your salvation, because eternal salvation is not based upon the person's works, but the works of Christ.

 

"Faith", which is a noun, has to do with how you live your life after you are saved.

 

No. Backsliding proves that you chose sin instead of fellowship.

 

Well, this is posted in his statement of beliefs at his website.........

PERSEVERANCE OF THE SAINTS. Those whom God hath accepted in the Beloved, and sanctified by His Spirit, will never totally nor finally fall away from the state of grace, but shall certainly persevere to the end; and though they may fall, through neglect and temptation, into sin, whereby they grieve the Spirit, impair their graces and comforts, bring reproach on the Church, and temporal judgments on themselves, yet they shall be renewed again unto repentance, and be kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation.

 

Here is what the Bible says -- JJ may not like it - but it is instructive to the rest.

Saved walk “Contrasted” to the enslaved-to-sin walk defined in Romans 2

 

Therefore the “loss of salvation” is seen whenever that state of salvation is explicitly seen to be revoked, when our acceptance and peace with God is denied by God.

#1. Turned over to Satan 1 Tim 1
#2. A certain terrifying expectation of Judgment to come – Heb 10
#3. Forgiveness revoked Matt 18 – old massive debt is now put back on us.
#4. Christ denying us 2Tim 2
#5. The shipwreck of faith 1 Tim 1
#6. Impossible to be renewed again having been partakers of the Holy Spirit Heb 6
Bound up to be burned – John 15, Heb 6
#7. Enslaved to sin again – as a dog that returns to its vomit



Turned over to Satan – in the shipwreck of faith

Denied by Christ instead of His “confessing us before God and His angels” –


[quote]2 Tim 2[/b]
11 It is a trustworthy statement: For if we died with Him, we will also live with Him;
12 [b]If we endure, we will also reign with Him; [b]If we deny[/B] Him, He also [b]will deny us;[/B]
13 [b]If we are faithless[/b], He remains faithful, for He cannot deny Himself.
14 Remind them of these things[/b], and solemnly charge them in the presence of God not to wrangle about words, which is useless and leads to the ruin of the hearers.
[/quote]

Soul bound by sin and under the condemnation of death

Forgiveness revoked –

Severed FROM Christ and Fallen from grace

 

A car without a battery is dead, too. It's still a car.

 

You are understanding the idea that once a Christian always a Christian, because it's not based on what you did, what you are doing or what you will do. It is solely based on what Someone else did on your behalf. And if it is entirely based on Someone else's works then how can you become unsaved, because that Someone certainly hasn't changed His works to make it so.

 

hahaha. i read the title of this... and had to chuckle a little. sorry bout that.

umm... what you call "backsliders" are essentially false converts as displayed in the parable of the sower. (stony ground hearer.)

for one to backslide - they need to be backsliding from somewhere. somewhere "forward" - a person who has slidden forward desires not to slide back. and therefore clings to the savior so that a "backsliding" situation does not occur. if one does not cling to the savior - they will backslide. from what though? if they havn't clung to the savior - they havn't slid forward.

so. there is not such thing as a "backslider" because they havn't slid forward in the first place.

rather - call them false converts. for that is much more biblical then "backslider"
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oooh is J.Jump gonna jump all over this one! (pun intended)

 

I do believe there are backslidden Christians. Christians do fall into sin and sometimes get their conscience seared. After all, God does not force us to keep resisting temptation. And some believers stay in it awhile. But then the conviction and misery is too much for them and they repent and come back. I've known and seen several like this - have heard their testimonies.

I do agree sometimes it's hard to tell the difference between a backslidden Christian and a false convert, but after a few years, if the person has not repented and is going merrily along their way, you can maybe guess they are not a believer.

But it's not up to us to decide who is which one unless we are called to counsel that person, then we need to try to figure it out as much as possible. Jesus said to let the tares grow up with the wheat and he would send the reapers to separate them. Not us.

 

I think Marcia has called it about right. But since we do not know the hearts of individuals we cannot really know whether or not a person is a backslider or one that never had faith.

 

umm... that's because they're the same thing...

 

In your opinion, gekko. :tongue3:

 

Well there is something I have a problem with...
Something I was attacked with about a month ago. Some people have it in their minds of how a Christian is suppost to dress and act and behave. (No smoking, no losing temper, no wearing shorts or sleveless shirts... ect) Some of these people want to set a standard for Christain living for others to live by but won't live by thier rules. All I know is that today I'm not where I used to be and praise the Lord I'm no longer under bondage, because Jesus set me free! Although I'm not where I think I ought to be in my Christain walk... Paul summed it up pretty well.

2Co 3:18 But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

So if I see someone who is struggling with life... its easier to pray for them than to judge them. :flower:

 

No, it just means they need to repent of their sins.