If someone was saved but then turned atheist are they still saved?

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by cheryllei9h, Oct 20, 2015.

  1. cheryllei9h

    cheryllei9h
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    So there is this person that says he got saved when he was young and that he believed. But like 5 years ago said he didn't believe anymore and is an atheist. Is he still saved? Now he says he can't believe he ever believed ay of that and that he never had one prayer answered. He uses the GD word a lot and other bad words. He calls God an imaginary friend for adults. He says once saved always saved so he's good. He said he never got baptized and never wants to and never liked going to church.

    I know that believers are supposed to try to help get people saved but I am not sure how to help. We have talked about it before but he's set in his way and says he could never believe again.
     
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  2. Revmitchell

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    It is not likely he was ever saved. We do not turn from God when we have been converted. (I Peter 1:3-5) His statement was quite contradictory. He is trying to claim a salvation from an "imaginary god for adults". Such is not possible.
     
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  3. steaver

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    Being saved is being born of God through the Holy Spirit. The person is a new creation with a new heart which continually cries ABBA Father. So no, a person cannot be saved and then turn to atheism. The Spirit of Jesus Christ which would be dwelling within would not allow for it, nor would the person with the new heart ever revert back to unbelief.

    I actually have a nephew in the exact same situation, claiming he was a Christian for 30 years and is now an atheist. I have had many debates with him showing the scriptures which declare there can be no such reversal if he actually did know Jesus Christ.
     
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  4. TCassidy

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    Let's see what the bible has to say.

    1 Thessalonians 5:23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

    That verse seems to say that Paul prayed for the preservation of believers.

    Jude 1 Jude, the servant of Jesus Christ, and brother of James, to them that are sanctified by God the Father, and preserved in Jesus Christ, and called.

    According to Jude, believers are preserved in Jesus Christ. Therefore a true believer will never apostatize unto perdition.

    So it would seem that he was never saved. He made a false profession of faith. This is a problem in many churches today. Rather than trusting in Christ many "saved" people are trusting in having "prayed a prayer" or having "walked the aisle" or "made a commitment" or something they did in order to receive their salvation.

    Of course, true, bible salvation has nothing at all to do with having "prayed a prayer" or having "walked the aisle" or "made a commitment." It has everything to do with Christ regenerating a sin sick soul. And when that happens, the new convert is indwelt by the Holy Spirit of God Who will guide that new Convert into all truth. John 16:13. :)
     
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  5. heisrisen

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    If a person turns away from God after claiming to be a Christian, they were NEVER saved, NEVER regenerated born again new creature in Christ. They were a false convert which is explained in this scripture, and also other places in the bible. (1 John 2:19- They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.). The bible says if someone doesn't have the Spirit of God dwelling within them, they are not God's. There has to be a true new birth experience. There are MANY false converts and it's very sad. Not everyone who claims Christ, is actually genuinely saved.
     
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  6. annsni

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    I have seen through my many years as a Christian that there are those who "play the game" and you think that they are a believer but there was never a heart change. Often it's a time in their lives where they needed to be accepted and have a community so they went along with it - maybe even with some sincerity - but when push comes to shove, they easily walk away and say "I don't believe in God." It's sad but I've seen it too many times to deny it. I definitely don't think a person who is truly saved - called by the Father and indwelt by the Holy Spirit - will ever walk away from God.
     
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  7. Doubting Thomas

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    IF he was genuinely saved but now no longer believes, then he is no longer saved. We are saved through faith and kept through faith, but if we abandon faith, we abandon our salvation since our salvation is IN CHRIST.

    Of course it's also entirely possible he was never saved to begin with. In either case, since he doesn't presently believe, he isn't presently saved.


    It's also odd that he'd say "once saved always saved" so he's "good" if he really believes it's all rubbish anyway. That makes no sense whatsover.
     
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  8. Darrell C

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    Here is what I have to be true of those who say they were "once saved but now are not:" you will find that most have simply never understood what salvation is to begin with.

    Most understand "being saved" as going to church with their parents. They have no understanding of Redemption, only some religious lingo.

    This is what I would suggest: first, make sure you yourself are ready to address the questions they may pose. What I mean by this is understand how and why someone is saved, and be able to explain that in simple terms. Secondly, you challenge this person in regards to their understanding, and I usually do this by asking them how one is saved. A simple enough question, but the answers that ensue are rarely Biblical.

    In order to help those who think they have lost or walked away from salvation understand Scripture doesn't allow for this as a possibility, then you have to confront them on a doctrinal level.

    This doesn't mean you have to wait until you have every answer, because you can speak with them and promise to get back to them with an answer if it is something your not really sure about.

    Another issue to consider is that it is possible for Christians to fall into a state of shipwreck, but usually falling away evidences that the "salvation" they claim to once have had was not genuine conversion, but simply religious participation. I have only encountered a few that I thought may be brethren in need of restoration, most of them were never saved, and the "salvation" they walked away from was a construct of indoctrinated heritage.

    So the only way to really approach this fellow is to compare what his understanding of salvation is in light of what Scripture teaches. And if you can show him that his understanding of salvation is not the salvation taught in Scripture, it will at least take away his justification for assuming salvation on a Biblical level.

    If he never believed to begin with, you can at least show him that it's not a matter of "never believing again."

    Good luck with that.


    God bless.
     
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  9. Darrell C

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    This would be the first point you could address: why would he think he was saved if he never liked going to Church? lol

    The conversation could go something like this:

    You: so you never liked going to Church?

    Him: never.

    You: shouldn't saved people like going to Church? Seeing that Scripture explicitly and implicitly teaches fellowship among those saved?

    Him: whatever.

    You: But you say you were saved, and it seems to me you were against it even in the time you were exposed to it. Wouldn't that be like me saying "I was once a hair stylist, but now I'm not, because I don't cut hair anymore. When I was in school for it I hated it and so I quit going to the school and never actually cut any hair after I left."

    Just a suggestion. Again, good luck with it, and remember, keep it doctrinal, never make it personal. Don't point out his cursing, for example, you already know he is openly admitting he is not a believer. He may do these things just to get an emotional rise out of you, but your concern is simply clarifying to him what salvation is in contrast to what he thinks it is.


    God bless.
     
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  10. steaver

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    You let a very important part out in your statement Thomas. Here is the actual scripture that speaks of being kept by faith....

    "Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time." (1Pe1:5) Has nothing to do with YOUR power to keep on believing....
     
  11. Iconoclast

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    1jn2;
    19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.
     
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  12. kyredneck

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    No it isn't. 'Being saved' is a life long endeavor of faith and obedience on the part of His children. 'Born of God' on the other hand is a one time event that can occur decades BEFORE faith and obedience.
     
  13. BobRyan

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    No they are no longer saved as both Romans 11 and Matt 18 and Ezek 18 all point out - OSAS is not a Bible doctrine.
     
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  14. BobRyan

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    There is a circular argument that says that if a person does fall away - then they were never saved.. and so never fell -- and the proof that they never fell (since they were never saved to start with) -- is that they fell.

    At some point OSAS not only does not work in the Bible - at does not work in conversation.

    By contrast - Romans 11 and Matt 18 and Ezek 18 all point out - OSAS is not a Bible doctrine.
     
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  15. TCassidy

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    You heard it here, folks. Works based salvation. Pure paganism. :(
     
  16. annsni

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    Hmmm - Isn't this the exact argument John used in 1 John 2 when he said "They went out from us, but they were not really of us; for if they had been of us, they would have remained with us; but they went out, it would be shown that they all are not of us."
     
  17. Iconoclast

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    A person cannot be both saved and lost. They are lost to begin with. When God saves a person they will persevere as God who has begun the good work will perform it unto the day of Christ.
    OSAS is unbiblical...Perseverance of the saints is biblical.
    God's salvation is a Covenant transaction and fixed and certain.
     
  18. BobRyan

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    Usually I differ with you on everything you say - but I have to admit - I do agree with you on that.

    At any one point in a person's life they are either saved or lost -- but not both.

    When the lost hear the gospel and accept it - they go from being lost - to being saved.

    But that does not mean that while they were lost -- they were both lost and saved.

    ok - another point where we agree -- at least a little.

    But the Bible warns against failing to persevere because failure is possible and the warning is needed - hence Romans 11.

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
  19. BobRyan

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    Does the Bible ask the lost to "persevere in being lost"?? I think we all agree it does not.

    All the warnings about failing to persevere - are not warnings against "failing to persevere in being lost".

    So while it is true that some folks were never saved in the first place - so that scenario does exist -- yet also we have "I FORGAVE you ALL that debt - you should have forgiven others just AS you were forgiven... return all his debt, he must now pay in full" Matt 18

    There is room in the Bible model for the case where someone was never saved.

    But there is no room in OSAS for the Bible examples of Romans 11 and Matt 18, and Ezek 18
     
  20. BobRyan

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    An easy way to see what is going on in 1 John 2 - answer this simple question.

    Are those people who are lost in 1 John 2 - "standing only by their faith?" (Romans 11) - are they in the saintly condition of having the personal experience of full and complete forgiveness of sins and debt-free acceptance with God (Matt 18)? Have they been enlightened by the Holy Spirit - are they partaking of the heavenly gift of salvation and the new birth, have they become partakers of the Holy Spirit are they filled with the good word of God and also the powers of the age to come (Heb 6)?

    Is that what it means to be "depraved and lost" in 1 John 2?

    Is that how Paul defines the lost condition in Romans 3:10-20?

    Is that the state in which you find the person described in the OP to be living today?
     

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