Is God judging America?

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by evangelist6589, Sep 11, 2013.

  1. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589
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    Its Patriots Day but I say what has happened since 9/11 is God's judgment on America. The economy, the job market, the student loan explosions and many whom cannot pay back their debts, terrorism on our streets (Boston Marathon bombing), the weakness of the church in this country as the church has little to any influence, the level of wickedness in our schools, on TV, and the like are results of His Judgment!

    In the past God has used certain nations to Judge and Gods people will suffer like the rest as Daniel suffered. The only thing that you can do is pursue righteousness and be out witnessing. You can witness to the lost and call the false converts to real repentance. Many claim to be saved, but are false converts and have a false profession of faith as they have submitted to a fake Jesus and an "easy-believism" gospel.

    God is indeed Judging America and I am suffering as a result of it, but God has given me strength to not forsake my primary responsibility of evangelism and apologetics. Some say that I cannot witness unless I am perfect and without sin (such as being 100% debt free), but this is the devils trap of stopping the witnessing as satan hates bold, confrontational, Biblical evangelism that calls sinners to repentance!

    Related books on what I have been speaking on.

    The Vanishing Conscience- John MacArthur
    Is God on Americas Side?-Erwin Lutzer
     
    #1 evangelist6589, Sep 11, 2013
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  2. JonC

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    Since 9/11???
     
  3. Winman

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    What do you mean when you say "call the false converts to real repentance"?

    Are these "false converts" the non elect? If so, according to your doctrine it is impossible for them to repent, and sort of silly of you to expect them to repent.

    If these "false converts" are the elect, then how can they be false converts?

    And what is "real" repentance to you? What does a person have to do to prove to you that they have "really" repented? Please be as specific as possible.
     
  4. evangelist6589

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    This one may help you understand.

    http://assets.livingwaters.com/pdf/TrueAndFalseConversion.pdf

    And my sermon as well

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0MKoI4-6LNI
    However considering your bent against Calvinism I doubt anything I say will convince you as you are very determined to argue and prove Calvinism wrong. You are not sincere and your questions are meant for an argument. No I am not taking your bait.
     
    #4 evangelist6589, Sep 11, 2013
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  5. JonC

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    That’s a good question. And I'm not "bent" against Calvinism as you identify Winman (nor am I inclined to follow links during a discussion post).
     
    #5 JonC, Sep 11, 2013
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  6. evangelist6589

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  7. JonC

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    What exactly do you mean by "repent" (how do you know another has repented) and what do you mean by submitting to the lordship of Christ?

    I'm not clicking on links - I'm sure if you were asked on the street you wouldn't say "look at my youtube video" - (I hope, anyway).
     
  8. evangelist6589

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    Turn from sins and then submit to Christs Lordship. Jesus himself must be your master. If one says He is, but your life does not have you going to church, reading the Bible, doing witnessing, praying, or having any fruit, then... But ultimately its for God to decide..

    As you can see The Gospel According to Jesus has had a great impact on my thinking.
     
  9. JonC

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    Evan,
    I’m not trying to be difficult – please don’t take it that way. I know you don’t preach “ultimately God decides.”

    I know “repent” means turning from your sins. Does one show legitimate fruit (you have here, going to church, reading the Bible, witnessing, praying as examples) before he or she can be saved? If there is no evidence of such fruit, does that mean that they are not saved? What do you mean by submitting to Christ’s Lordship?
     
  10. Winman

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    What about paying people what you owe them as Ray Comfort said?

    Are you going to pay back those persons you owe money to fourfold as Ray Comfort says here?

    Isn't this putting a person back under the law?
     
  11. webdog

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    So an unregenerate person is supposed to turn from sin? How? If regenerated, how can they not submit to Christ's lordship? Strikes against total depravity and irresistable grace.

    Lordship Salvation is inconsistent and illogical.
     
  12. preacher4truth

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    Nice sincere OP. Too bad winman and jonc have derailed it looking for an argument all-nighter. Don't feed them and they'll go away. :wavey:

    To the OP the yes I believe God's judgment is already on our nation seen via the alternative lifestyle propagation.
     
  13. preacher4truth

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    double post
     
    #13 preacher4truth, Sep 11, 2013
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  14. SolaSaint

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    I think God judged us in Nov of 2008 with Mr. O being elected.
     
  15. Winman

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    No, just asking Calvinists to be logical. How can you expect the non elect to repent, and how can the elect not truly repent?

    How can you have a "false convert" in Calvinism? Only the elect can repent, so they must "really" repent, no??

    The problem with most Calvinists is they they mindlessly accept it and put no real thought into it. If they did, it is likely that MANY would not be Calvinists.

    And as for Lordship Salvation, you always get these folks going around telling other Christians how sinful they are. Usually the folks that do this represent themselves as the standard of holiness. And usually that falls apart real quick when you judge them as they love to judge others.

    They can never tell you exactly how holy you have to be. Do you have to go to church 3 times a week or only once? Do you have to read your Bible every day, or can you skip a day now and then? Can you have debt or must you be debt free?
     
  16. InTheLight

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    America is not God's chosen people, therefore America is not being judged. People are being judged, not nations.

    I followed your debt thread and your witnessing thread(s). I challenge you to provide a link to a post where someone said you should not be witnessing because you are not perfect or are not debt free.

    I'm beginning to think you read and hear what you want to hear and not what people actually say.
     
  17. JonC

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    #17 JonC, Sep 11, 2013
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  18. evangelist6589

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    Thank you. I did not try and feed Winman but the man wants an argument very bad. John C is a moderate Calvinist and likes Erickson whom I respect. However Erickson is wrong on some areas, however he is a moderate Calvinist.

    God has given this nation 12 years to repent and she has not. More judgment will be coming. Maybe another 911 or something worse. What if what I saw in the Steven Seagal film called the Patriot actually happens????

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Patriot_(1998_film)

    Chemical weapons being sprayed al over our cities.
     
    #18 evangelist6589, Sep 11, 2013
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  19. preachinjesus

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    I don't think America matters to God as much as Americans think they matter to God.


    The nation is meaningless, the people within are meaningful. God sees to borders in according blessing and salvation.
     
  20. JonC

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    I agree. We often view ourselves in the “center” of things. But America was never a “Christian nation” - there is no such a thing. Spurgeon put it well when he noted that men go to hell in the lump, they are saved individually (along those lines anyway).

    Scripture tells us the consequences of ungodliness. It’s hard to believe that America is not under this condemnation – but she is not alone.
     

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