is salvation by faith alone?

Discussion in '2003 Archive' started by massdak, Dec 21, 2003.

  1. massdak

    massdak
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    i wanted to put this site up for those who want to read a very interesting debate on faith alone vs. faith plus works.
    these two debaters know their stuff, one is affirming faith alone to start the debate, the other gives his opinion in support of faith plus works.
    each point on both sides would have a person tossing a coin on the issue, both are very skilled in persuasion and use mostly new testament support with some old testament also. at the end i see the faith plus works argument fall apart but i do have the bias as i believe in faith alone in Christ alone.
    very interesting and would like some opinion on this discourse.

    http://www.lookinguntojesus.net/faithalone.htm
     
  2. Dr. Bob

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    Went to the debate link and was not shocked to see it was Church of Christ! I would not "join in" there, but at least know the premise.

    "Is salvation by faith alone? OF COURSE NOT."

    Those are debating words to many of us!! :rolleyes:
     
  3. massdak

    massdak
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    yes, the church of Christ site also has a debate by the same authors on baptism as requirement or not. i would not recommend anyone joining the site but rather just viewing the debate.
    i would also discourage those that are not strong in the doctrine of faith alone in Christ alone
     
  4. Watchman

    Watchman
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    Faith alone, or Faith plus works?
    Yes!
    We are saved by grace through faith alone, but not by a faith that is alone. If one is truly born again, works will follow. If not, something is seriously wrong.
    The devil and his ilk has faith, but not the type that produces anything positive for the Kingdom of God.
    Faith and works are complimetery, not contradictory. This is what James, in his much misunderstood epistle, is saying to us.
     
  5. gb93433

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    I am always reminded of Hebrews 11:6, "And without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him."

    Wer come to God in faith first. It is not faith plus works but faith alone. Faith alone in Jesus alone produces works that are consistent with Christ. The works are an outward manifestation of faith in Christ. Works alone do not produce anything other than works. Faith precedes works not the other way around. If believers were under persecution we would see that kind of American theology thrown out the window. We would see the wheat and the chaff would disappear. The church would be uncovered for what it really is.

    It is amazing how many heresies come up under comfort and then disappear when persecution comes.

    I can remember when I was a young college student and hearing a man who was a Lutheran pastor in Romania and how he and his wife endured persecution at the hands of the communists. He talked about how many other pastors denied the faith. He talked about how so many went their own way. Their theology was exposed for what it was--nothing. His was real.
     
  6. massdak

    massdak
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    i believe i understand what you are saying, you could clairfy by telling me which debater you agree with.
     
  7. Brett

    Brett
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    I agree with watchman. While I cannot speak for him and hesitate to put words into his mouth, I think he means (and I agree) that the faith alone VS faith and works is a false dichotomy, and it doesn't make sense to debate them as if they are mutually exclusive. If one truly has faith, then this faith will manifest itself in works that bring glory to Christ's kingdom. One cannot have true faith and simultaneously turn one's back on Christ by overtly sinning or by ignoring the needs of this world.

    In summary, true faith without works is impossible.
     
  8. Watchman

    Watchman
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    Massdak:
    Clearly I would agree with Mr. Peacock of the affirming position. What he said concerning the Epistle of James is what I was trying to convey in my earlier post.
    Mr. Stewart mentions two of the scripture references that Mr. Peacock uses:

    Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.
    Romans 5:1

    For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.
    Eph. 2:8&9

    Mr Stewart makes the outlandish statement:
    "Neither text affirms salvation by "faith alone."
    He might be able to say that about the Romans passage, but the Ephesians passage? How much plainer can Paul make it? What part of NOT OF WORKS does he not understand?
     
  9. Watchman

    Watchman
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    Brett, you said it very well.
     
  10. David Mark

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    This does make more sense in the light of many other scriptures regarding faith. Brett, you made a concise and well written reply. ;)

    If I have faith, can I generate my own works so as to substantiate my faith to men or God?

    Dave [​IMG]
     
  11. R. Charles Blair

    R. Charles Blair
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    If we take the Scriptures seriously, and take our prepositions seriously, we are not saved by faith at all! (Before you scream "Outrageous," look again at Eph. 2:8-10, partially quoted in several posts on this thread. We are "saved BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH," and all that not of ourselves, for we are His workmanship. If I am saved BY faith, when I quit believing, I am lost. If I am saved by grace when I believe, it is the responsibility of the One providing the grace to keep me saved.) Think about it!

    Happy New Year- R. Charles Blair
    Rom. 8:28
     
  12. David Mark

    David Mark
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    I am often inspired by the man who said: Lord help my unbelief. Mark 9:24.

    Dave. [​IMG]
     
  13. pinoybaptist

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    The question was is salvation by faith alone ?
    My question is : whose faith saves ? My answer is : If I am saved by my
    faith alone, then I am saved by works and not grace.
     
  14. Precepts

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    Hi!

    My first reply in BB.

    I have to agree with the Bible: Eph. 2:8

    For ye are saved by grace through faith, and that not of yourselves.

    I do realize faith produces works that glorify God, but what about those who "worK' for awhile after a "profession" but then seem to "backslide" and are found "wanting"?

    I mean that as to those who go back to the "world" after even a few years. They had works, but then unseemingly they "quit".

    Thanks!
     
  15. massdak

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    yes i agree by grace through faith.
    my started post should of read " is salvation by grace alone through faith"?
     

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