Israel, Gaza and Syria

Discussion in '2006 Archive' started by Phillip, Jun 28, 2006.

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  1. Phillip

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    Let's discuss some REAL news for a change. After an attack on an Israeli outpost inside of Israeli territory, one soldier is kidnapped and two killed while two or three of the attackers are killed.

    Today the Israeli settler was killed while Israel arrested about 30 Hamas leaders and buzzed the country-home of Syria's President Assad. Syria claims its anti-aircraft systems ran the planes off, but with the IDF airforce being one of the best in the world, this is highly unlikely.

    This is as close or closer to war in the Middle East which would include Israel than the Yom Kippur war.

    It is my opinion that Israel is cracking down to let Hamas know this is not going to be an on-going standing operating procedure. Israel must be tough or they can expect Hamas to continue to bully them. The thought of Syria joining into a war with Israel is a scarey thought, especially since a jihad will no doubt be called and Egypt and Jordan will have to join the fight whether or not they want to.

    Israel is thought to carry about 70 to 90 tactical nukes which I'm not so sure they will hesitate to use if they feel their country is likely to be overrun.
     
  2. Bro. Curtis

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    My thoughts.....this is the biggest news issue of the last several years.

    We can blame the Palestinians, as they voted these creeps in. They deserve what's coming. And it is coming. Thankfully, Israel's reached the end of her rope.

    But you are quite correct, this will drag several countries in, and we're spread pretty thin, now.

    But if I didn't know any better, it would seem the world is lining up against Israel.

    Oh yeah, the IDF don't read Paul Krugman, and we can predict the methods information retrieval they use will make Gitmo look like Romper Room. It won't be panties on the head in a chilly room for those poor jihadists. The UN, Amnesty International, and most likely CAIR will all go nuts, and Israel won't care.
     
  3. LadyEagle

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    It is all proof that you can't make deals with jihadists, like I've said all along. Israel was wrong to give up Gaza, to give up "land for peace" and recent events have proved that.
     
  4. Phillip

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    It seems odd that such a news story is not getting coverage on a Baptist Bulletin Board. We seem more interested in conspiracy theories than we do what is happening to Israel and the rest of the descendents of Abraham.

    In my opinion, this is bigger news than the US invading Iraq. I'm not so sure we need to be involved, but we might have to just to keep Israel from using their tactical nukes. This happened during the Yom Kippur war when Russia moved nukes up to the boarder in Egypt at the request of President Nixon during the first and only real use of the hot line (teletype) between the US and Moscow. (This is a little known fact.) They moved Nukes they were keeping at the Aswan dam up to the boarder at our request. Luckily the war started changing tide toward Israel and they took the nukes off of the planes that were already loaded and put them back in storage. We came way closer to WWIII at that point than we ever did with Cuba and that was in the 1970's.

    What might happen this time.

    Apparently, Jordan caught the Mossad killing the Hammas representative and King Hussein of Jordan called Israel and told him that he would kill the Mossad agents if they didn't send the antidote for the poison. (This was just a few months or a year or so ago.) Israel sent the antidote and barely saved the man's life who was already on his death bed in the hospital. Hussein of Jordan kept his word and let the Mossad agents go.

    The politics in the Middle East are really fascinating if you get into them enough to understand what is going on.

    By the way, you stole my logo. "Go up, thou bald-head." Obviously, we all have something in common with Paul.:applause:
     
    #4 Phillip, Jun 28, 2006
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  5. Phillip

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    You are absolutely right; but in reality gaza was disputed terroritory so in order to try to make peace that land was given up. Especiallly since it was so far down in the desert and so close to Egypt. I think they considered it the lesser of three evils. (Gaza, West Bank, Golan Heights).

    Israel is pretty good t making deals with jihadits, a hellfire rocket is pretty persuasuave, especially if it hits your house.

    I also think Israel was letting the King of Syria knew that he wasn't safe anywhere. I think there is more to that than meets the eye. I think Israel is getting awfully tired of terrorists coming out of Syria with Assad's stamp of approval to kill Americans or Israelis and not necessarily in that order. Good point LadyEagle.
    :thumbs:
     
  6. Joseph_Botwinick

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    I agree they should not have given up the land, but for different reasons than you, I am quite certain. The Palestinians gave nothing in return. I would have demanded something tangible in return for the land. The problem is that they didn't make any deal with the Palestinians whatsoever. They just gave them land for nothing in return.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  7. Bro. Curtis

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    Phillip, most of the posters here tell us today's Israel has nothing to do with the Israel of Revelation. Also, a lot of posters here see no reason to keep Israel as an ally.

    That's probably why no one posts the news about this war.
     
  8. Joseph_Botwinick

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    Curtis,

    I see several reasons to keep Israel as an ally. None of them, however, have anything to do with my eschatology.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
    #8 Joseph_Botwinick, Jun 28, 2006
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  9. Phillip

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    I may be wrong, but I think Israel is the same Israel and the fact that it came back into being against all odds is quite a miracle in itself.

    I do not look at this as an "end-time" situation. I learned a long time ago that everytime we shout "end of the world" then we look like idiots when it turns out to be a war that has nothing to do with end-times.

    I am more fascinated because of the history of Israel and who the people came from than prophecy. I am no good at prophecy, know little about it and don't care to try to guess.

    I do know; however, that I was standing on the ruins of Megiddo while a pastor was reading about the battle of Armageddon and I was facing the other way taking pictures. I noticed something in the sky, far away getting bigger. Just as the pastor reached the "trumpet of the Lord" a KFIR C2 broke the sound-barrier directly overhead less than 1000 feet above the top of the hill.

    Believe me, the end of the world came for THAT bunch of people that day. Since I saw it coming and knew what it was, I simply enjoyed it. It made my entire day.
     
  10. Bro. Curtis

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    http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1150885868104&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull



    In an unprecedented operation, the IDF arrested overnight Wednesday over 60 senior Hamas members throughout the West Bank, including ministers in the Palestinian Authority parliament.
    Detainees included such senior figures as Finance Minister Omar Abdel Azek, Labor Minister Mohammed Barghouti, and parliament member Mohamemd Abu Teir.
    PA Prime Minister Ismail Haniyeh convened an emergency meeting of government members in Gaza early Thursday morning. An unofficial response said that, ""Israel is targeting Hamas' political wing, which wasn't involved in the kidnapping [of IDF Cpl. Gilad Shalit]."
    "Israel is heading in the wrong direction, and will pay for it," the response continued.
    While the arrests were being carried out in Ramallah, Nablus, and Bethlehem, the IDF denied early Thursday Palestinian claims that IDF tanks and bulldozers moved into northern Gaza before daybreak, adding a second front to the Israeli incursion.

    Witnesses also reported heavy shelling around Gaza's long-closed airport, and IAF missiles hit two empty Hamas training camps and an arms factory operated by the Fatah-affiliated Aksa Martyrs' Brigades. Warplanes flew low over the strip, rocking it with sonic booms and shattering windows. Troops in Israel backed up the assault with artillery fire.
    No casualties were reported in the incursion, launched in southern Gaza. The area's normally bustling streets were eerily deserted, with people taking refuge inside their homes. Dozens of people living near the airport fled to nearby Rafah. Earlier Wednesday, backed by columns of tanks, troops from the Givati Brigade were poised to sweep into the northern Gaza Strip in the second phase of "Operation Summer Rains," launched earlier in the day with the goal of retrieving kidnapped Cpl. Gilad Shalit.
     
  11. Bro. Curtis

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    http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1150885858552&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull



    The IDF confirmed early Thursday a report the Popular Resistance Committees issued from Gaza that it had executed Eliyahu Asheri, 18, of Itamar, who was kidnapped earlier this week in the West Bank.

    IDF combat engineers and Shin Bet agents, acting on intelligence, found Asheri's body Wednesday night in an abandoned car in an open field outside of Ramallah. The youth had been shot in the head, and initial findings indicated that he may have been killed as early as Sunday.
    Asheri's family has been notified.
    After a spokesman for the PRC in the Gaza Strip revealed an authentic copy of Asheri's identity card to the press Wednesday morning, confirming claims that he had been kidnapped, the police's elite counterterrorist squad raided a home in Ramallah in the afternoon hours and arrested a fugitive. The arrested fugitive may have provided the information on the location of Asheri's body.
    On Tuesday, a spokesman for the Hamas-affiliated PRC told Al-Jazeera that Asheri would be "butchered in front of TV cameras" if the IDF operation in Gaza did not stop. "Our patience is running out," he said. "I am announcing for the first time that the kidnapped Zionist Israel is searching for is the same settler who is being held by us. He is aged 181⁄2... and is a soldier in a pre-military academy," said the spokesman, who identified himself as Abu Abir.
     
  12. StefanM

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    I wonder if that the unconditional withdrawal wasn't just setting a "tripwire." If Israel gives the carrot without strings and the Palestinians give the stick in response, then Israel has the ability to use the stick with much more moral authority.

    I personally think that they were just waiting for something like this kidnapping to happen in order to "finish the job" in response. After all, it is just one soldier.

    Nevertheless, I fully support Israel's actions because Hamas must be destroyed. Period.
     
  13. Joseph_Botwinick

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    I am quite sure someone like Poncho will heartily embrace that theory. I don't think it is that sinister, however. There was much pressure from within their own country to pull out of the Gaza from the Israeli citizens, and from without from Bush and Condi. I think the government probably thought things would be different this time and failed to use their brains.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  14. StefanM

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    It is also equally possible that they thought they couldn't buck the political pressure. I think the pullout was a colossal mistake on philosophical reasons, but pragmatically the result may be the overthrow of terrorist organizations.

    Does anyone think war with Syria might be looming?
     
  15. LadyEagle

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    Not under the Bush administration, at least not as far as the US goes. "It is only one soldier" may just be the catalyst for Israeli leaders to get motivated to destroy their enemies instead of consistently turning the other cheek due to US and international pressure. At least Israel is taking definitive action. We had two soldiers mutiliated and beheaded and there was little outcry from the Bush administration or the American public. But our government long ago sold out to muslim terrorists and their sponsors.
     
  16. Daisy

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    Palestine is in dire straits now, it's economy shut down and the people on rations.

     
    #16 Daisy, Jun 29, 2006
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  17. StefanM

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    I sympathize with the plight of innocent Palestinians. It is absolutely unfortunate that they are suffering in this, but that is the nature of conflict. When you elect a terrorist government, you will get problems.

    I would much rather have the Palestinians pursue a lasting peace alongside Israel.
     
  18. Joseph_Botwinick

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    Agreed. If you elect a terrorist government, you should expect this to be the consequences. Of course, Israel does share at least a small amount of the responsibility in this in that they continued to give Palestinians everything they wanted for nothing in return. IOW, they legitimized Hamas' terrorism by rewarding it. That is never good.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
    #18 Joseph_Botwinick, Jun 29, 2006
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  19. Bro. Curtis

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    You are correct, Joseph. Israel demonstrated poor stewardship with their land, didn't they ?

    We were all praying, against our own doubt, for this two-state thing to work, but will we now admit it's hopeless ? The only solution may be war.

    May the best team win, and we all know who I mean.
     
  20. Joseph_Botwinick

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    Curtis,

    I think you misunderstood what I said. I don't think it was wrong to give them the land in and of itself. What Israel did wrong was to not demand anything in return. I don't think it is hopeless even now. For the time being, it appears as if the only solution is war. Israel will win. After they win, I hope they take back Gaza, and then do some real negotiations with the Palestinians and discard the failed policies of Bush and Rice that call for them to appease terrorists and demand reciprocity instead. If they do this, I have no doubt that a better future can be attained.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
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