It Will Cost You Everything

Friend, there are apparently three sides to this.

Two of the sides don't read this the same way that I do.

I do what the Lord calls me to do - not so that I can be saved, but because I am saved. If I want to be a disciple, I must be willing to do what God asks of me. If I am unwilling, then that is a whole different ball of wax.

There may be those who have been called to eliminate all worldly possessions and go witness, but not all are called to do that. Neither were all the people that Jesus spoke of in his parables. He did not call everyone to commit that act, just certain ones. It is a mistake to think that everyone has the same calling, but all of those who are saved are expected to answer their call.

God blesses some with nice houses and nice possessions, and others are blessed with ministries which are very demanding. It is up to God and not to "Bible Lawyers" to decide what my calling is. When I received instructions, when a task lays heavy on my heart, I answer. I will take up whichever cross is handed to me - Jesus is my Lord.

 

You are complicating something that is very simple.

Regarding being saved..becoming a child of God for eternity, one only needs to repent from refusing to place their faith in Christ for the gift of eternal life, and choose to place their faith in Christ for the gift of eternal life. Its that simple. It goes without saying that it must be sincere.

To ask for an *acceptable* percentage of sincerity is ridiculous. Its absurd.

Its the normal kind of absurdity that "Lordship" theology produces.

This is not rocket science. :thumbs:

 

freeatlast...

Not quite. Not just intellectual ascent. Its not "believing in Christ' in the sense of just believing He lived, or believing He died for the sins of the world.

It has to be personal.

Its more a case of putting your faith in Christ for the gift of eternal life

Hope that helps clear it up. I cant go any further with it because its time for me to leave for our evening service at church. :smilewinkgrin:

Maybe someone else can pick up where I left off.

God Bless.

 

I Have Done Those Things Because I'm SAVED!

I believe the need to rid ourselves of the things of the world that we've attached ourselves to be imperative, not in order to be saved, but, to be unencumbered to be free to follow Him!

However, I don't trust in anything or anybody to save my soul, other than the blood of Jesus and His work on the cross. Good works and deeds will not get me to heaven.

The only question I have to ask myself each day is, are my feet on the narrow path to heavens narrow gate, or, am I part of the large group traveling without a care, down the freeway to hell?

Jesus is Lord in my life because of what He did for me and my faith to come to Him and trust my entire eternal future on His works, not mine!

As I said, the feet of multitudes are walking down the freeway to hell, and most of them don't realize it.

Paul addresses the problem with the church in Romans 1, and the selling of the flesh in the following areas is not going to save us, but it is going to make us more like Christ, and less like the person from whom He died to save. Think about this: Following Jesus means our heart is free from the thought of and remorse of greed, and malice. Envy, jealousy, murder, strife, deceit and treachery. Ill will and cruel ways. Backbiting and gossiping; slandering one another and acting hateful to others and toward God. Having the heart of Christ inside us is having a life free from the thoughts of insolence, arrogance, and boasting. We must cease and desist concocting new evils out of a heart lacking love and understanding for others. We must be ready to sell off conscienceless and faithless, heartless and loveless and merciless thoughts and desires.

This has nothing to do with earning anything, BUT, everything to do with selling off the ways of the flesh. The Temple He is creating and setting up within us needs to be clean, holy and pure. Therefore, the things I mention above are like heavy weights, pulling us down into an unforgivable abyss of selfish desire and selfish gratification.

We must be forever cognizant and open to the need to rid ourselves of the things of the flesh if we ever expect to move further away from the sewer of sin that He died to take us out of in the world around us.

We are to no longer be of the world, but rather to be in Him and of Him.

Believe it, or not, there are many sitting in pews who have attached themself to the above and for that reason alone, they will be allowed to continue on the highway to hell, because once they come to Christ, they should know and sense the wrong in these things, but, Paul says these folks think they know better than God, and continue to indulge themselves in the world they are to be separate from. Thus He turns them over to the desires of their hearts.

This is not a salvation by works. It is the work that comes after our being saved. We are expected to grow and become more like Him, and less like our self. To allow the Spirit to change us is what keeps our feet on the path. To ignore the call to change is to join in with the crowds headed to hell.

Think of it this way: It doesn't matter whether you're saved or lost. Either way, it is God's way, or the highway (to hell)!

We know that many who receive the seed find it being plant on hard ground or amongst weeds. Either way, the seeds of salvation are smothered out, and they never grow to mature, rather they wither and die, or have the life of Christ strangled from their soul!

I know who my Savior is! I know who I serve! I know that there are many things that still need to be addressed in my life, and I am open, humble and willing to allow Him to continue that good work that He started within me on December 24, 1966.

I have always been willing and able to rid myself of the things that do not please Him, and I am fully aware that it is not my works, but His good work within me that are forever shaping and reshaping the temple within that He lives in.

Heaven forbid that I ever think I can earn or work my way to heaven. I am not standing on the side of the highway to hell with a sign that says "will work for salvation."

The work has already been completed on Calvary, making Him the Lord of my life, my heart, my soul, my everything!

Again, the eleven minute message posted at the beginning of this topic should be taken to heart and acknowledged as a direct, prophetic word from the Father for the church and its many members to allow Jesus to bring about some serious sacrificial changes within the heart and soul before it is too late to come on board. And believe me, there will be a day, when it will be way too late to change the direction in which many a traveling!

Shalom,

Pastor Paul :type:

 

I’m not sure I understand repentance the way that some of you do. First off I believe that God calls sinners to repentance. When I took heed to the call, I had to repent with the Godly sorrow that Paul wrote about in 2 Corinthians 7:
[9] Now I rejoice, not that ye were made sorry, but that ye sorrowed to repentance: for ye were made sorry after a godly manner, that ye might receive damage by us in nothing.
[10] For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.
[11] For behold this selfsame thing, that ye sorrowed after a godly sort, what carefulness it wrought in you, yea, what clearing of yourselves, yea, what indignation, yea, what fear, yea, what vehement desire, yea, what zeal, yea, what revenge! In all things ye have approved yourselves to be clear in this matter.
In John 16:
[20] Verily, verily, I say unto you, That ye shall weep and lament, but the world shall rejoice: and ye shall be sorrowful, but your sorrow shall be turned into joy.
[21] A woman when she is in travail hath sorrow, because her hour is come: but as soon as she is delivered of the child, she remembereth no more the anguish, for joy that a man is born into the world.
[22] And ye now therefore have sorrow: but I will see you again, and your heart shall rejoice, and your joy no man taketh from you.
[23] And in that day ye shall ask me nothing. Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, he will give it you.

I had to travail in much sorrow and tears. Then at the end of my strength, I became willing to give it all over to Him to perform a work in me that only He could perform. When this happened the new birth took place with much rejoicing on my part.

 

I think you are right about there being another side to this issue. On the one hand I agree that being saved is not about good deeds or a works based salvation. I did not get saved because I stopped sinning first. On the other hand I believe that there is another aspect that gets overlooked sometimes. It is clear that repentance is required for salvation. I believe that the repentance that is required is the repentance of being in rebellion against God. When I think of the term "Lordship Salvation", I think of it in terms of yielding my life and my will to God, giving up control of what I want to do and my desires for His. It is not about MAKING Jesus Lord of my life, He is Lord whether I get saved or not that doesn't change. What does change is that I acknowledge Him as Lord of my life and by acknowledgment there also comes surrender. In a war when it comes time to sign the peace treaty, the defeated side by signing the treaty is explicitly saying that they lost and they surrender and recognize that the other side is now in control. To me that is Lordship Salvation, simply saying that I am giving up control of my life to my Lord and that my life is now His to do with as He will.

 

Righteousdude

Praise the Lord! No problem with that at all.

(((AMEN!!)))

My brother...you are not on that freeway to hell. By your own testimony, you have placed your trust in Christ. You are secure!

You dont have to be concerned about that at all. You are a Spirit born child of the living God. :thumbs:

Me too, brother. Me too.

I know it. I grieve with you.

I agree. After we are saved we should indeed be concerned with isues like that.

Yes. Unfortunetly, we all have our issues that we deal with. But isnt it wonderful that we deal with them from a perspective of (((security))) rather than dealing with those issues from the false perspective of possilbly being damned to hell if we dont do a good enough job of it?

Yes, and that is a terrible situatuation. I agree completely. But regarding the "highway to hell" comment, that might or might not be true.

If they are "pew sitters" who have never been born again, yes its true. They are headed to hell if they dont trust Christ.

But they might be carnal christians who are born again, and completely secure...but boy are they asking for problems. God has ways of chastising/and or disciplining His wayward children.

Oh no. Not neccesarilly. It depends on if they are saved..yet living carnally,(but saved) or not saved and headed for hell.

If they never become saved, yes.

Me too, brother.

AMEN!!!!

Regarding the lost, yes I agree. The saved...those whos sincere faith is in Christ...have absolutly no reason to ever doubt their salvation, but carnal living will surely bring problems in this life for this life.

Shalom,

Pastor Paul :type:[/QUOTE]

Shalom to you as well.

 

So says who?

I challenge you to prove that statement. [edit] prove it from scripture.

 

I posted...

To which Kyredneck responded...

God. In his scriptures.

Kyredneck again...

Be glad to


Scripture...

Scripture...

Scripture...

http://ichthys.com/salvation.htm


Hope this helps.

 

On the other hand, perhaps living the life of a vagabond is a interesting choice. St Francis did it & displayed both a humility & a focus to God rarely found. Of course it aged the guy prematurely & eventually led to an early grave...but that was his choice & who's to begrudge a man's choice.

 

And previously you said:

So being born in America makes you exempt from the commands of Christ to forsake all and follow him.
Being born in America makes you exempt from the demand of Christ to make him the Lord of your life????

You have yet to give your testimony.
According to Lordship salvation are you saved?
If you are, please describe when and how you "forsook all that you had and followed Jesus." Did you forsake all your worldly goods, house, car, TV, furniture, etc.,--all of it?? That is the command he gave.
That is Lordship salvation. If you haven't done that you can't possibly be saved under that theological paradigm. I would really like to hear your salvation testimony.

 

You have not shown that the Greek word 'sozo', translated 'save' [read deliver] is synonymous with the birth from above, or the acquiring of eternal life.

 

Ashleysdad, you and I are in total agreement.

I think the stumbling block of this discussion has to do with the idea of "cost you everything." No, it doesn't. I owned nothing to start with, but I didn't realize it. It is just as when I was saved initially (which was only a year ago). Some worry that they will have to let loose of those worldly activities in order to be a Christian, and they don't want to do that. Brothers and Sisters, I can tell you that - for me - after letting Jesus into my heart and acknowledging him as my Lord, those desires faded. Not all of them, and not totally, but I lost the intensity of desire for those worldly things. If any of them rear their ugly heads, a short prayer to God settles the issue. I just ask Him to answer the door for me, and the unwanted visitor goes away.

I didn't lose, I gained.

If the Lord wants me to sell my house, car, and dogs in order to walk the highways; He has only to tell me. I'll tell the wife that we are going hiking. I do hope that He tells her first, though.

By the way, brother, I see that we are practically neighbors!

 

It is not an "IF".
That is not what Lordship Salvation teaches.
Here it is again.

So likewise, whosoever he be of you that forsaketh not all that he hath, he cannot be my disciple. (Luke 14:33)

or, as he said to the rich young ruler:

Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me. (Mark 10:21)

They teach that this is an actual requirement for salvation--to forsake all; to sell whatever you have and then follow Christ. It is not, "IF you are willing..." It is "this you must do in order to be saved, else Christ is not Lord."

How many on the board have actually done this? There may be some.
How many actually did this the day that they were saved? I doubt that you will find any.

 

I guess I am not a follower of "lordship salvation." Until this thread, I didn't know that there was such a thing.

Evidently, I don't see the referenced passage as a universal command for everyone. I tend the look at the whole Bible, as best as I can at this point in my life, and I don't see things that way. If I am wrong, I trust the Holy Spirit to correct me.

 

No, you are not wrong. The concept of Lordship salvation is.
Salvation is by grace through faith. It is the gift of God.
Notice in the verses quoted Jesus always qualified them ...."you cannot be my disciple."
A disciple is different than one who is newly saved. There are many believers; few disciples. It is that willing heart that you spoke of that puts one on the road of discipleship, a follower of Christ.

 

I don't know about anyone else but I go through phases. There are times where my faith and service wanes. I can be greedy with what God has given me. I have been lazy with my time. I've wanted it my way and not God's way. But, God brings me to repentance through a realization of my sin. In those time I am more generous. I serve with a willing heart. I have a renewed vigor to work hard. I want what God wants.