Jack Hyles & Hyles Anderson College

Discussion in 'Baptist Colleges / Seminaries' started by Kathy, Aug 21, 2001.

  1. Kathy

    Kathy
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2001
    Messages:
    1,541
    Likes Received:
    0
    Where can I get information on what Jack Hyles taught and what his legalistic views were? Such as, women wearing pants...that kind of thing. Thanks!

    Kathy
    <><
     
  2. Bob Landis

    Bob Landis
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2001
    Messages:
    282
    Likes Received:
    0
  3. Dr. Bob

    Dr. Bob
    Expand Collapse
    Administrator
    Administrator

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2000
    Messages:
    29,402
    Likes Received:
    12
    Jack Hyles was a very gifted public speaker and motivator. He held some really wrong doctrinal views and a lot of really warped cultural views.

    Because his church looked in the eyes of men to be a success many tried to emulate his manners, preaching, methods. He held "schools" so pastors could learn, sold 24 million books, a gazillion cassette tapes are still floating around, and, if you go by the church he pastored, a 45 foot mural of himself painted on an outside wall (ala Saddam Hussein)

    If you go to JackHyles.net and link to the Fightin Fundamentalist Forum, you can read from hundreds of "survivors" who safely escaped from that mentality. His was a short-lived type of pseudo-fundamentalism that gives us real ifb'ers a bad name!

    There are some that will never see anything he did as "evil" or even "questionable". They will probably post and start shooting at me!
     
  4. Kathy

    Kathy
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2001
    Messages:
    1,541
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hey Dr. Bob...speaking of IFB'ers, I recently joined one. What are some typical legalistic idiosyncracies of these types of Baptist churches. I have found things out by mistake, such as no shorts, no mixed swimming...that kind of stuff. Altho this doesn't bother me, it is like making a 180 degree turn from a SBC I used to go to in Florida. I joined the church because of it's doctrine which I totally agree with, and I just think that legalistic things like I mentioned above are a small price to pay for sound Bible doctrine. <---This statement refers to myself and my family and in no way is saying that EVERYONE should do this...it's just my humble opinion. Thanks!

    Kathy
    <><
     
  5. Dr. Bob

    Dr. Bob
    Expand Collapse
    Administrator
    Administrator

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2000
    Messages:
    29,402
    Likes Received:
    12
    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Kathy:
    Hey Dr. Bob...speaking of IFB'ers, I recently joined one. What are some typical legalistic idiosyncracies of these types of Baptist churches. Kathy<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>SOUND DOCTRINE is the great blessing of many true historic ifb churches. Others that bear the same name, however, deceive even the elect, and teach a man-made legalism that sickens my heart.

    SOUND DOCTRINE teaches a sovereign God and sinful man, that salvation includes repentance as well as faith, not some easy-repeat-after-me tripe to parrot so we can parade bus kids into the baptistry.

    SOUND DOCTRINE involves the Great Commandment to love God more than anything else (including the KJV or standards or a pastor) and to love others

    SOUND DOCTRINE hinges on the Great Commission to make disciples, baptize and then thoroughly teach ALL THINGS

    Much of that is missing in some ifb churches and replaced with:
    ~Dress codes where only the spiritual giants where shoddy dresses and tennis shoes with bobby socks, long hair in a bun, little make-up when there is MUCH to "make up" for; choking ties and coats even if its 110 and no air conditioning
    ~Attendance codes - miss a Sunday or a service and watch the fur fly
    ~Bible Version conformity - just try to bring an NIV and quote from it in SS class and see what happens.
    ~Do's and Don'ts List for "Spiritual" people (man, don't let them see you play cards, wear shorts or even slacks, smoke, mixed swimming)
    ~Pastoral dictatorship where he is the oracle of God and never wrong and to vote against him or his plan at a business meeting makes you a rebel
    ~Mind control where everyone must think alike. Uniformity (rather than biblical unity, a missing element)
    ~Dronelike working for Jesus while really building an empire for the pastor to boast about in the next ad in the Sword
    ~Pseudo-spirituality
    ~Caste system where women are second class citizens, only slightly above the untouchable lowest class, divorcees
    ~Pharisaical Righteousness which you can NEVER attain (the code changes daily and you will ALWAYS fall short

    And much more. You GET bits of sound doctrine but make sure you're not getting truckloads of do-do along with it, or it won't be worth it.
     
  6. Bible Believing Bill

    Bible Believing Bill
    Expand Collapse
    <img src =/bbb.jpg>

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2001
    Messages:
    3,761
    Likes Received:
    0
    In reading Dr. Bob's post I realized that what he was talking about is what I always thought Baptists were all about. That is before I became a Baptist. I realize what a blessing my church really is to me. It is an IFB chuch, but most of the legalistic stuff is missing.

    When it comes to dress codes, playing cards, mixed swimming, etc. it is left to the individual to work out between himself and God. That is not to say the the Pastor and the chruch do not have ideas of what they think is right, but they do not try to force anyone to do anything. As example of what I mean: My wife used to wear pants and jeans, while most of the ladies did not. No one told her to stop, no one told her she was not welcome at church. She did become a sunday school teacher, and she decided at that time she would stop wearing pants. In the end she found she like this mode of dress better, but it was not forced upon her.

    It is my opinion that this is the way the legalistic things should be handled. Leave it to the person to discuss with God. Set the example you want and other will follow.
     
  7. Kathy

    Kathy
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2001
    Messages:
    1,541
    Likes Received:
    0
    New Believer

    You VERY eloquently described ME when describing your wife....AND you eloquently described my church when describing yours! I THANK GOD DAILY for placing me in this church and as you said, they lead by example not by chastisement.

    Hey, Dr. Bob...thank you for your advice! WHEW was I glad it didn't define my church *hehe*

    THANKS!!!!!!

    Kathy
    &lt;&gt;&lt;
     
  8. Bible Believing Bill

    Bible Believing Bill
    Expand Collapse
    <img src =/bbb.jpg>

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2001
    Messages:
    3,761
    Likes Received:
    0
    Aw Gee Shucks Kathy, Iv never been accused of being eloquent before.
     
  9. Dr. Bob

    Dr. Bob
    Expand Collapse
    Administrator
    Administrator

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2000
    Messages:
    29,402
    Likes Received:
    12
    And Kathy, I've never had anyone actually follow my advice before! :rolleyes:
     
  10. Bro Shaun

    Bro Shaun
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2001
    Messages:
    52
    Likes Received:
    0
    I get REAL tired of people throwing the word "leagalist" without even knowing what the word means. If you are going to acuse someone of being leagalist, look up the word.
    Legalist means to add to salvation to get to heaven, such as grace through faith plus works, or grace through faith plus baptisim. This is leaglism, the Mormons are leagalist, the Seventh Day Adventist are leagalist.
    Dr. Jack Hyles was not, nor was he ever, a legalist. This is the common accusation of Christians that don't like his preaching on sin. God does not want us to get saved and do whatever we feel is right, he gave us Preachers to tell us the way God wanted us to live. Dr. Hyles never made anyone feel like less of a christian for not wearing skirts, listening to CCM, going to the movies, etc. He just told us what God expected us to do, yes he did it with a loud voice, but it got the point across.
    God gave the Isrealites Moses to tell them the law and how the should live. Jesus was our example on how to act, and he got mad at sin (in the temple).
    There is nothing wrong with following men of God. Paul said "follow me as I follow Jesus."
    Thats all Dr. Hyles was saying, follow him as he followed Jesus.
    In the Old Testament, 250 Jews called Moses and Aaron legalist. Remember what happened to them, the ground opened up and swallowed them, their families, tents, animals and everything they owned into hell, alive.
    Careful how you bash the man of God.REAL
    null

    [ August 23, 2001: Message edited by: DSM ]
     
  11. Barnabas H.

    Barnabas H.
    Expand Collapse
    <b>Oldtimer</b>

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2000
    Messages:
    6,807
    Likes Received:
    0
    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by DSM: Dr. Jack Hyles was not, nor was he ever, a legalist. This is the common accusation of Christians that don't like his preaching on sin.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    An interesting hypothesis DMS, could you elaborate (but without the frills), and please do list chapters and verses. [​IMG]
     
  12. Bro Shaun

    Bro Shaun
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2001
    Messages:
    52
    Likes Received:
    0
    Verses to seperate from the world (movies, tv, music, friends, smoking, drugs, drinking, anything at all to do with the world and not God)

    2Corinthians 6:14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?

    James 4:4 Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.

    verses for dress

    Deu 22:5 The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God.

    Isa 47:1 Come down, and sit in the dust, O virgin daughter of Babylon, sit on the ground: there is no throne, O daughter of the Chaldeans: for thou shalt no more be called tender and delicate.
    Isa 47:2 Take the millstones, and grind meal: uncover thy locks, make bare the leg, uncover the thigh, pass over the rivers.
    Isa 47:3 Thy nakedness shall be uncovered, yea, thy shame shall be seen: I will take vengeance, and I will not meet thee as a man.

    Now, I don't know what verse you want to prove Dr. Hyles was not a legalist LOOK UP THE WORD!!!!!!!!! He did not believe you had to do anything else to be saved but believe by faith, thats it, nothing else. Have you even heard Dr. Hyles preach, or are you taking your opinion from liberal Baptists that claim to be IFB when they are closer to SB. Listen to him preach and decide for yourself, unless you like your sin and don't want to hear a man of God preach against it. [​IMG]

    [ August 23, 2001: Message edited by: DSM ]
     
  13. KeeperOfMyHome

    KeeperOfMyHome
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2001
    Messages:
    2,403
    Likes Received:
    0
    I would just like to add here that there are many people who hold standards of dress who are not legalists. I have been called on more than one occasion a legalist and a Pharisee because of my beliefs about women's clothing. However, whoever does that is spreading false witness against me because I do not believe that my clothing makes me acceptable in God's eyes. I am not saved because of what I wear, and I am not holy because of what I wear, but I wear what I do because I am saved and God made me holy. My outside, as much as possible, should reflect what is inside.

    The Pharisees and legalists in the Bible were busy busy busy cleaning up the outside while inside there was still filth. That is not who I am, nor what I am about.

    It really doesn't bother me if someone disagrees with me on this, but what does bother me so much is being labeled as something (or someone) I am not.
     
  14. Barnabas H.

    Barnabas H.
    Expand Collapse
    <b>Oldtimer</b>

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2000
    Messages:
    6,807
    Likes Received:
    0
    For your information DSM, I am a member in good standing of an IFB church and am familiar with the Bible passages you quoted above. These are standard Bible references, and at times are misquoted, but in general they point the way toward the right direction. Thanks.

    The brash defense you offered all of a sudden on behalf of the late Dr. Hyles, incidentally, was unnecessary for the following reasons. Dr. Hyles doesn’t mind it (not that he ever did during his lifetime), you cannot change people’s perception, and that leaves you one more reason: your personal belief system in the man was hurt. Now, if you have an opposing view of people on this board you are welcome to state it. But state it without throwing punches, for that is the Bible way - "... speaking the truth in love…" (Ephesians 4:15). Your brother in Christ, BJH [​IMG]
     
  15. Barnabas H.

    Barnabas H.
    Expand Collapse
    <b>Oldtimer</b>

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2000
    Messages:
    6,807
    Likes Received:
    0
    Amen to that KeeperOfMyHome! [​IMG]
     
  16. Bro Shaun

    Bro Shaun
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2001
    Messages:
    52
    Likes Received:
    0
    Bro. Halo
    You are correct. I shouldn't have been so harsh, I apologize. I tend to get angry when Baptist Brethern attack a leader who's teaching I follow. I have been called a legalist many times and the term is 99% used out of context. I am just tired of seeing brothers attack each other because they disagree on some unimportant belief. Yes, my wife wears skirts and I never wear shorts. Yes I only use the KJB, go soulwinning, run a bus, teach a Sunday School class, lead the youth, do not own a TV, and try to stay as close to God as I can. I do not believe, however, if my wife were to start wearing pants, both of us started smoking, drinking, cheating and completely stopped serving God that we would go to Hell. I don't think I'm a better Christian than someone who doesn't hold the same standards I do and I will never preach against them if they are my Baptist brother. Why bash a brother or sister in the faith because they have different standards than you. Too many of us do it. I do not agree with many Baptist preachers, I think they are too liberal in their practices. But I will not name names. Maybe they are out of the will of God, but they are still God's anointed. We are all fighting the same fight, to keep sinners out of Hell. If we kill each other, the Devil will surly win. If someone asks where they can learn about another brother's teachings, tell them where to go and let them decide for themselves. We need to stop picking at each others convictions and agree though they may be different, we are still brothers and sisters in Christ. Again, I apoligize for my tone and pray you will forgive me.

    Because of Calvary, Bro. Shaun [​IMG]
     
  17. Barnabas H.

    Barnabas H.
    Expand Collapse
    <b>Oldtimer</b>

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2000
    Messages:
    6,807
    Likes Received:
    0
    No need to apologize Bro. Shaun. Sometimes we blow off some steam. But remember this, a pot full of water left on the stove would be useless unless it first comes to a boiling point. Only when we see the steam rising can we use the water for coffee or tee - don't you agree? ;)

    The Bible teaches us that we may be "angry, and sin not: let not the sun go down upon your wrath: Neither give place to the devil." (Eph.4:26-27). You are on the right track. Don't let anybody dissuade you of your convictions - but remember, our admiration, praise, devotion, and loyalty should always be given to the Lord and not to mere man.

    Incidentally, you are pretty new here (only posted 7 so far), and don't remember meeting you at the New Members forum. So, a belated welcome to the BaptistBoard! A small point of advise: when you answer a post, always try to separate the subject in question from the person! It works! [​IMG]
     
  18. Bible Believing Bill

    Bible Believing Bill
    Expand Collapse
    <img src =/bbb.jpg>

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2001
    Messages:
    3,761
    Likes Received:
    0
    Actually Bro. Shaun I don't find the word "legalist" in either my American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language , or in my Smiths Bible Dictionary. When I used the term legalistic I really ment legalities, Or actually my own corrupt definanition of that word. I acctually was talking about rules being imposed on people by people rather than people obeying God's Laws.
     
  19. Kathy

    Kathy
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2001
    Messages:
    1,541
    Likes Received:
    0
    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dr. Bob Griffin:
    And Kathy, I've never had anyone actually follow my advice before! :rolleyes:<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Dr. Bob! You trip me out! LoL LMBO! I'm gonna ask my mommy if I can keep ya! *hehe*

    How much is that Dr. Bobby in the window? The one with the 20 lb. Bible...
    :D ;) [​IMG] [​IMG] :cool:

    Kathy
    &lt;&gt;&lt;
     
  20. Kathy

    Kathy
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2001
    Messages:
    1,541
    Likes Received:
    0
    I also apologize if I misused a word, but I assure you it was in ignorance. I did not use the word to condemn because I myself don't appreciate condemnation.

    But can I ask a sincere question about the verse in Deut.? Couldn't that be construed or interpreted against women cross-dressing as men and vice versa? (ala Rupaul and drag queens) I don't wear pants much anymore, except I wear my shorts in the privacy of my home...but when I wear shorts or pants, I ALWAYS present myself as a woman because that is what I am. I have chosen in my own life to follow the examples of the outstanding women in my church, it's not an overnight conversion, but I think that even the Bible tells me to test everything right? If not, I may as well accept that glass of blue kool-aid if you know what I mean...

    Kathy
    &lt;&gt;&lt;
     

Share This Page

Loading...