John 14:6

That's like saying, "Why should I read Canterbury Tales - the Cliff Notes are perfectly clear?" Without an understanding of the Greek, or at least the use of good lexicons (not concordances, like Strong's) you really miss a whole lot in the Scriptures, such as the use if di' in John 14:6 and logos in John 1. It's fascinating stuff and really helps cement one's grounding in the Word. But it does take work.

Again, it's like just reading the Cliff notes, when you have the chance to read the actual work.

 

No those who understand Greek don't need an explanation. It is for the benfit of those who don't. In fact what was mentioned is basic elementary Greek grammar. It is kind of like when you study English. One who knows English well does not need an explanation. But those who don't understand do.

If you would like something a little more challenging look up the word (logos) for "word" in Jn. 1:1. </font>[/QUOTE]Since I understand English fairly well, why should I waste my time with Greek when the English is perfectly clear?

I invite your challenges to the Word of God.

BTW, that's Word, not "word".

I know what the Greek word "logos" means. </font>[/QUOTE]Then tell us your understanding of it tying in the philosophical idea of it during that time. Because I am not sure I understand it all that well.

 

Peace and love to you all in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour!

To all of you who study and know greek, I think that it is wonderful and I praise God for all of your hard work and efforts. Please do not misunderstand me. For someone who is teaching the word of God to others, with a background knowledge of the greek is a wonderful treat to those who don't know it. Sometimes, it gives a more amplified meaning to the text which can be very beneficial. In my Bible study on the Book of Revelation, Wayne Barber explains the greek of certain words that amplify the english meaning, and it has been a great blessing to me.

I do have to agree with others however, that this can be abused, and that we do not necessarily need this to understand what our Bible already says.

I just wanted to let you all know what I thought regarding this issue, to avoid any misunderstandings that might be taken.

May the Lord richly bless you all.

love in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
michelle

 

If this is true, Michelle, then would you agree that the KJV can be seen as less than everything one would ever need? As you have admitted, through somoene explaining the Greek you are getting more out of your KJV. Does this affect your beliefs as far as the KJV being the complete Word of God? Why or why not?

 

Peace and love to you in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour!

Scott,

What has been beneficial to me, has been confirmation of what I already knew from reading the word, and I mean this by specific words that have an amplified meaning that cannot really be explained by any other english word than that what was chosen. This is hard for me to explain to you, but I know what worship means as I read it, and I know this from my own worship experience. To expound upon the greek meanings for this word is beneficial in a descriptive way to what one knows from not only reading the word but through one's own experience/knowledge of it. But it is not just limited to the greek, but to also learning the history of the word used in the word of God. There are different greek words that have the same meaning as one word in english, and this is where the abuse can happen if the context is not considered. This only verifies that the KJV is the complete word of God for me in the English language.

love in Jesus Christ our Faithful Lord and Saviour,
michelle

 

"Precepts Pretext" you are an English "enthusiast", and from reading your recent posts, you have become a Ruckmanite, in that you assume the English of the KJV;kjb corrects the very inspired language of the N.T: Greek.

 

The first rule of hermeneutics: Context, context, context. That has nothing to do with Greek but with interpretation. However there are times when understanding the proper usage of a Greek word does eliminate many other ideas.

Such as in English we might say that if a cat was killed by a car it was run over. It is doubtful we would say it was murdered. The same is true in Greek. For example evil is different than bad.

 

1. Greek properly defines the Greek. As one learns Greek he begins to learn how to "think" in Greek, just as all those who become fluent in another language become. The Greek is limited by much of what is found in the KJV - but the translators at the time did the best that they could, I believe.

2. I don't think there is a thing wrong with the exactness or clarity of the Greek, just in the English that is used to translate it.

3. What do Westcott and Hort have to do with translation - they didn't have anything to do with that?!? Can you do more research here before making claims such as this, please?

4. How is Elizabeth English "best"? From where do you get such a claim?

5. The Holy Spirit put His approval on many modern versions! How do I know? Just look how He has worked through the KIV, NASB, the Message, and other versions of the BIble!

 

Peace and love to you all in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour!

Soctt, is there now another new version out there - KIV? What does the K stand for Korruptive International Version? Kmart International Version? Kremlin International Version?

Naw, just kiddin with ya. I know what you meant.
I couldn't help but joke about it though.

No hard feelings please?

love in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
michelle

 

A little learning is a dangerous thing.
Alexander Pope (1688-1744)

 

That's like saying, "Why should I read Canterbury Tales - the Cliff Notes are perfectly clear?" Without an understanding of the Greek, or at least the use of good lexicons (not concordances, like Strong's) you really miss a whole lot in the Scriptures, such as the use if di' in John 14:6 and logos in John 1. It's fascinating stuff and really helps cement one's grounding in the Word. But it does take work.

Again, it's like just reading the Cliff notes, when you have the chance to read the actual work. </font>[/QUOTE]You mean the Canterbury Tales were first written in GreeK?

I would never deny Greek is fascinating, but what fascinates me more is how those who profess to know Greek deny the context and try to negate the meanings of the words used in the KJB and thereby try to disqualify those words. If the study of Greek causes me to deny what the obvious shouts from the rooftops, then I'll abstain from the Greek, but my little study of the Greek offers more than what these Greek "enthusiasts" are offering. I have found their rules for the Greek grammar are not THE rules for Greek grammar. Where "they" say the Greek means ONLY one specific thing in English, I find that the Greek means more than they are willing to admit.

Again the over-riding factor of pride has taken it's toll in the mind of the Greek "enthusiast" </font>[/QUOTE]Many times I have preached with the Greek NT in hand. Why would I want a translation?

You are right about context. But you have done the same thing you accuse others of doing in your answer to the "Word" in Jn. 1:1 on another post.

 

I wonder if we should heed the words of Proverbs 23:9 when it comes to the ignorance of one who will not listen. I am sure all of us know who the antagonist is.

Proverbs 23:9, " Do not speak in the hearing of a fool, For he will despise the wisdom of your words.

 

Peace and love to you all in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour?

I am just wondering, after a conversation I had with my unbelieving husband (he has read some of the posts here and thinks it is hysterical), how much of the ancient greek do you all know? I mean, are you people relying upon the works of other men/scholars/seminaries for your education in the ancient greek language? I bring this up, because my husband, who has been called "Albert" at times, and scored as genius on an IQ test for his current global sourcing directer position, brought to my attention that not many people have the ability nor time to actually truly learn the ancient greek language, and that the likeliness of the scholars today being learned in it, in the same respect to the translators of the KJV are much more limited - if any at all. So please tell me, where does your education come from?

love in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
michelle

 

Precepts,

What do you suppose is the national language in Greece today? It is Greek! Greek is not a dead language and it has been preserved over the past 2,000 years much better than English has been preserved over past the 1,000 years. Modern day Greeks can easily read Koine Greek from the first century, but can you read anything in English that was written even 1200 years ago?

I have several contemporary Greek New Testaments and I will send you one if you will promise to read it and compare it word for word with the Koine Greek New Testament.

The same applies to the Old Testament. The Biblical languages are Hebrew and Greek, and both of these languages have been preserved by God much better than what man has been able to do with English. The English language is changing so rapidly that in order for an English translation of the Bible to be written in current English idiom, it is necessary to revise it every 30 or 40 years. That is not at all the case with Hebrew and Greek.

Seminaries all over the world study the Bible in Hebrew and Greek, not in English! The only two universal languages for Bible study are Hebrew and Greek. In the world of Bible study, English is very common, so is German, and both languages are very helpful, but Hebrew and Greek are essential.

 

Michelle, I personally have six semesters of study in the Biblical languages. So, I would say that I have the equivalent of someone who has taken Japanese, Russian, or another foreign langugage for six collegiate semesters. Does that help?