John Calvin said...

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by humblethinker, Mar 7, 2013.

  1. humblethinker

    humblethinker
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    "Those who assert that 'the earth moves and turns'...[are] motivated by 'a spirit of bitterness, contradiction, and faultfinding;' possessed by the devil, they aimed 'to pervert the order of nature.'"
    - John Calvin, sermon no. 8 on 1st Corinthians, 677, cited in John Calvin: A Sixteenth Century Portrait by William J. Bouwsma (Oxford Univ. Press, 1988), A. 72
     
  2. quantumfaith

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    Have not seen you in a while HT, quite a way to get back into the fray. :)
     
  3. Jerome

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    Ah, yes, from Calvin's Sermons sur l'Epitre aux Corinthiens:

    "Nous en verrons d'aucuns si frenetiques, non pas seulement en la religion, mais pour monstrer par tout qu'ils ont une nature monstrueuse, qu'ils diront que le soliel ne se bouge, et que c'est la terre qui se remue et qu'elle tourne. Quand nous voyons de tels esprits, il faut bien dire que le diable les ait possedez, et que Dieu nous les propose comme des miroirs, pour nous faire demeurer en sa crainte."

    Those who say that the earth moves round, rather than the sun, are frenzied, monstrous, devil-possessed!

    The sermon text is I Cor. 10:19-24. What an expository gem.
     
  4. webdog

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    That kind of accusation sounds like something you would read here. Calvin would have fit in well here :)
     
    #4 webdog, Mar 7, 2013
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  5. saturneptune

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    Another genius scientific quote from Calvin: Un jour l'homme se rendra au soleil, et il ira la nuit, donc il ne pas vous brûler.

    This translates "One day man will travel to the sun, and he will go at night so he does not burn up."

    Institutes, pg 228, 1559
     
    #5 saturneptune, Mar 7, 2013
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  6. humblethinker

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    I'm looking to make a case for a geocentric view of the cosmos... It is Biblical, after all, you know?

    Yeah, it's been a while. Has the talk changed much?
     
  7. humblethinker

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    "The eyes are witnesses that the heavens revolve in the space of twenty-four hours. But certain men, either from the love of novelty, or to make a display of ingenuity, have concluded that the earth moves; and they maintain that neither the [stars] nor the sun revolves...Now, it is a want of honesty and decency to assert such notions publicly, and the example is pernicious. It is the part of a good mind to accept the truth as revealed by God and to acquiesce in it."
    - Melanchthon, famous Protestant Reformer and one of Luther and Calvin's friends -- as cited on the Internet in Wayne Aiken's incredibly long and amusing collection of quotations, "Freethought Fortune Cookie".
     
  8. Thomas Helwys

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    :laugh: :laugh:
     
  9. humblethinker

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    "The heavens revolve daily, and, immense as is their fabric, and inconceivable the rapidity of their revolutions, we experience no concussion -- no disturbance in the harmony of their motion. The sun, though varying its course every diurnal revolution, returns annually to the same point. The planets, in all their wandering, maintain their respective positions. How could the earth hang suspended in the air were it not upheld by God's hand? (Job 26:7) By what means could it [the earth] maintain itself unmoved, while the heavens above are in constant rapid motion, did not its Divine Maker fix and establish it? Accordingly the particle, ape, denoting emphasis, is introduced -- YEA, he hath established it."
    - John Calvin, Commentary on the Book of Psalms, Psalm 93, verse 1, trans., James Anderson (Eerdman's, 1949), Vol. 4, p. 7
     
  10. Aaron

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    While the issue of the church and a geokinetic cosmology is much more than what is being implied in this little hatchet-job of a thread, I'm going to press you for a publisher, date, and if there is no url to which you can link us, a scan of the statement in context.

    In the meantime: http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/tj/v15/n2/geocentrism
     
  11. saturneptune

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    [​IMG]
     
  12. Herald

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    And if we lived 500 years ago we would be making the same nutty statements. Cut 'em some slack, guys. Just a few years before their time they were convinced the earth was like a Ritz cracker!
     
  13. Aaron

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    No one ever thought the earth was flat.
     
  14. Aaron

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    Then you're a liar.
     
  15. InTheLight

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    Awesome!!!
     
  16. Robert Snow

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    Well, at least you didn't call him a drone! :laugh: :laugh:
     
  17. humblethinker

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    "People gave ear to an upstart astrologer who strove to show that the earth revolves, not the heavens or the firmament, the sun and the moon. Whoever wishes to appear clever must devise some new system, which of all systems is of course the very best. This fool [or 'man'] wishes to reverse the entire science of astronomy; but sacred Scripture tells us that Joshua commanded the sun to stand still, and not the earth."
    - Martin Luther, Table Talk
     
  18. quantumfaith

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  19. RLBosley

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    Satire? I hope so...

    I remember seeing something similar a few years ago but at the bottom in SUPER small print they had a disclaimer that basically affirmed it was a satirical site.
     
  20. humblethinker

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    Really Herald? Statements made with such presumption and judgement? Re-read what Calvin said... seems far from a disposition of humility. I suppose you would similarly cut the Westboro Baptists some slack, right? (maybe that's a cheap-shot, and if so, I take it back, but I'm not sure it is...) Should they not all be considered in light of the meaning of their own words and actions?

    These statements of these 'calvinists' does not cause me to therefore disbelieve their other statements of theology or philosophy but it does cause me pause to accept as truth what they say solely based on their honor. Their ability to be so certain and presumptuous while yet being wrong is astounding. It seems parallel to calling someone Racca or 'fool' to me.
     

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