Featured John Calvin's Lip Service

Looks like the Anabaptists had a strong Antitrintarian movement until 1530
http://pacificuu.org/wilbur/ouh/chapter/07_VII.html

*also appears that some of the Strong persecution tools place in these areas.


*Rebel, I want to be clear. I am not referring to Mennonites or Amish. They both came after this heresy

 

Rebel,

A question sir. Was there ever burnings of Anabaptists who were not against the Trinity? I don't know....that is a real question. Not rhetorical.
I will try to spend time on google tonight looking. But I know that Calvin and King James issues involved the Trinity.

 

It is apparent that you don't want the truth:
http://www.anabaptists.org/history/sepamarg.html

http://www.house-church.net/original/beliefs.htm

 

The persecution of the Anabaptists took place mainly on the grounds that "they re-baptized" as their name indicates. For this practice they were a hated group from all sides--the RCC, Church of England, Lutherans, and Presbyterians.

 

Its apparent you don't want to *know truth.

*Statement works both ways

 

Executions, or ran *off the land they occupied? I only know of executions of anti trinitarian Anabaptists

 

Your Anabaptist link does not change the fact the Unitarian Movement traces all the way back into the Anabaptist movement. Just as the Mennonites came form them, so did these Unitarians. You can try to re write history if you want. But they name at least 4 unitarian Anabaptist teachers from the 1500's that there teachings are from.

I will post the home page.

http://pacificuu.org/fore/

 

So to you was he saved, was he a gifted pastor/teacher/theologian, or just another heretic of times past then?

 

Did John Calvin sin even after being saved by God?

Yes

Sometimes very badly?

Yes

was he still a gifted teacher/expositor/theologian God used to instruct his people in the truths of the scriptures

Yes

was he infallible, his views on doctrine/theology always correct?

No, but more right than a vast majority living today would wager!

 

IOW:

A direct statement that they are NOT interested in the truth.
Why do you go to such sites?

Look again at its purpose:

http://pacificuu.org/publ/univ/

 

They were persecuted, tortured, and murdered in various horrible ways by Catholic and Protestant alike, because they opposed state churches and infant baptism. They also opposed oaths and going to war.

 

I don't think the are seeking truth either. That is why thru deny the Trinity. But their views have came from early Anabaptist believers. Not all the Anabaptists believed the same thing in the 1500's. Heck, they don't believe the same things now.

Yes they are out in left field. That is the point DHK. I posted them because they are insane. Just like some were in the 1500's. Servetus, Wightman and the other 3 from the previous link. all taught this, all had followers. All Anabaptists.

 

Do you have any locations or names off the top of your head? Don't go searching if you don't. I'm not asking you to waste time for me. I will look tonight.

 

C.T. Christian, A History of The Baptists, states in his chapter on the Anabaptists:

 

I'll give you three names, and then some articles; these will do for starters. The Anabaptists (Mennonites and others) were persecuted, tortured mutilated, murdered by state churchists both Roman Catholic and Protestant; prepare to be made sick to your stomach:

Felix Manz; Michael Sattler; Dirk Willems

http://www.anabaptists.org/writings/excerpts/mennonites-in-europe-persecution.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martyrs_Mirror

http://www.homecomers.org/mirror/contents.htm



Persecutions and migrations

Roman Catholics and Protestants alike persecuted the Anabaptists, resorting to torture and execution in attempts to curb the growth of the movement. The Protestants under Zwingli were the first to persecute the Anabaptists, with Felix Manz becoming the first martyr in 1527. On May 20, 1527, Roman Catholic authorities executed Michael Sattler. King Ferdinand declared drowning (called the third baptism) "the best antidote to Anabaptism". The Tudor regime, even the Protestant monarchs (Edward VI of England and Elizabeth I of England), persecuted Anabaptists as they were deemed too radical and therefore a danger to religious stability. The persecution of Anabaptists was condoned by ancient laws of Theodosius I and Justinian I that were passed against the Donatists, which decreed the death penalty for any who practiced rebaptism. Martyrs Mirror, by Thieleman J. van Braght, describes the persecution and execution of thousands of Anabaptists in various parts of Europe between 1525 and 1660. Continuing persecution in Europe was largely responsible for the mass emigrations to North America by Amish, Hutterites, and Mennonites."

 

The subject of this thread is on the person of John Calvin. Do not go on side trails.

Al Mohler Jr. :

"John Calvin was a multi-faceted personality possessed of manifest gifts. God invested this man with extraordinary intelligence, theological courage, unquestioned tenacity, and a deep love for the church."

"Half a millennium after his birth, Calvin's theological contribution appears more, rather than less, important than it appeared in his own day."

T.H.L. Parker :

"By expounding Scripture as a whole he was forced to deal with the scriptural range of ideas. And, as an honest interpreter, he labored to represent the thoought of the Bible faithfully. He had a horror of those who preached their own ideas in place of the gospel of the Bible : 'When we enter ther pulpit, it is not so that we may bring our own dreams and fancies with us.' "

 

Felix Manz: I have no issue with him or his Swiss group. Nothing substantial anyway. I would not call this group of Anabaptists heretical. I see nothing wrong with them.....of course, my limited reading is of Wikipedia

I will give the other 2 a look later tonight.

I don't not have issues with all early Anabaptist teachings. Just the 4 or 5 I listed earlier in this thread. Felix seems to be a good man. By our worldly standards and Christian standards.....but my knowledge of him is very limited.

 

Indeed. Even if someone was not orthodox, that is still no reason to persecute, torture, and murder them. That is what state churchists regularly did to Anabaptists, other Dissenters, and even to each other.