KERRY WAR COMRADES PREPARE BATTLE -- AGAINST KERRY

As ole honest Bill Clinton said at the Boston Convention--where Democrats tried to look like moderates--"go out there with all you got and win just one for the Zipper!"

 

As with so many other things, you are convinced of the wrong thing. You have unfortunately made a habit of that. I didn't say Bush was handling it perfectly. I think there are many things he could have done better. I was addressing two very specific wrong accusations made by Ken, presumably because Ken does not follow the news, but rather his own pet sources that do not give accurate representations.

It is not "obvious." It may be so, but it is certainly not "obvious," at least by the standard definition of the term. Today, there are millions of people free from a brutal dictator. There are fewer people in political imprisonment and fewer people dying from Saddam's torture chambers. There is a move toward democracy in Iraq. If that is a mistake, then we have some serious issues. It is a shame that you apparently do not value life and freedom any more than that.

When you or anyone else speaks the truth, I will agree. I always have. But you make yet another mistake. I am not a neocon in the least.

 

"I'm not a neocon; I just play one on the Baptist Board."

 

Really? You don't sound anything like a neocon Galatian. That is the most surprising thing you have ever posted on here ... And that covers a lot of ground.

 

Oh, I didn't mean to hurt the feelings of the Clintonites. Poor babies.

 

I guess I am to understand, Pastor Larry, by your lack of attempted rebuttal to the facts about the switch of focus from Afghanistan to Iraq that you are conceding the issue. A smart move on your part. Perhaps you are not drinking all of the Bush kool-aid that you are alloted.

 

Boy, Ken, you just can't get it right. ... Did you read what I said on the previous page??? I repeat it here for you word for word: I was addressing two very specific wrong accusations made by Ken, presumably because Ken does not follow the news, but rather his own pet sources that do not give accurate representations.

Does that sound like a concession??? You did not support your assertions with any evidence, much less credible evidence. You have shown yourself to grasp at anything that will possibly make Bush look bad. You have shown yourself to be unstable in your position by switching sides, much like Kerry has done and Bush to a large degree. However, it took them a lot of time to switch sides. It didn't take you long to go back and forth.

You need to get back to studying the issues and quit your ranting about this stuff. It is clear to us that it is not clear to you what is going on. To say that Iraq and Afghanistan are not better off than they were a year ago or six months ago or whatever is so obviously wrong that it barely deserves a response.

Furthermore, you have yet to say on what grounds it is the responsibility of the US to make it better. Did we all of hte sudden become the world's caregiver?? You, from what you have said here including your links, apparently think we should be involved in nation building. But your dear CP will have nothing to do with that and if you were consistent, you wouldn't either. You are just stretching to find something to blame on Bush.

 

Then refute the facts I presented if you can, Pastor Larry. I don't think, no, I know you can't.

 

I didn't see any "facts." I saw some assertions, made by a guy who doesn't have the access to the information to make those assertions. You copied that info from somewhere, and it is incumbent on you to show where you copied it from. You know the drill here, Ken.

Secondly, you are making a mistake of thinking that your criteria for "better" are the criteria that should be used. I think we can all say with confidence that we on the Baptist Board do not have enough information to set ourselves up as the criteria.

Thirdly, I have already refuted your argument by showing a number of cases where things are better than they used to be.

I took a counseling class one time and the teacher posed the question, Does the Bible have the answer to every question? His answer: No, there are some stupid questions. In the same way, there are some stupid things being said that simply don't deserve much of a response. Until you put forth some credible information for your position, there is no reason to answer you.

But you still haven't answered the last paragraph. You are so big on the constitution and you seem to be arguing that there is some responsibility the US has to make things better. Could you outline that responsibility from the constitution? Or are you inconsistent becuase you have an opportunity to bash Bush?

 

Once we overthrow the government of a country we are responsible for cleaning up the mess, Pastor Larry.

I guess you Bushinistas have it covered both ways against me. If I post articles I get accused of copying and pasting. If I research a subject and post my findings I get accused of not copying and pasting the information.

Well, Pastor Larry, I imagine you know how to use Google and how to copy and paste info from my post into the Google box to search for it.

But it is just as I thought - you can't refute the facts I presented. All you can do is stand on the sidelines and cry "WRONG!!" like a good little Bushinista.

 

Can you cite the relevant part of the constitution for us here??? Of course not ... because, as I say, your first priority is to bash Bush. If you can support the constitution in the meantime, all the better.

I have never accused you of cutting and pasting, although you do an awful of that, and most of it is poorly argued opinion pieces that have no real weight. But when you start posting facts it is customary to post your links. I could use google and look it up, if I wanted to. I am not that interested, because i don't base "better off" on the same flawed criteria that you do. Assuming all your "facts" are accurate, the countries of Afghanistan and Iraq are still better off. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that out.

BTW, what is a "Bushinista"??? You make up words like you make up other stuff. I presume it has something to do with Bush ... And therefore don't see how it applies to me since I think Bush has done a pretty bad job as president. Because I happen to have enough common sense to know that he is the better alternative between him and Kerry does not make me a Bush supporter.

 

I see. You, as a Bushbot/Bushinista/Bush kool-aid drinker, don't support George W. Bush. But you are going to vote for him and urge others to do the same. But you are not a supporter of him.

In the twilight zone world of Pastor Larry voting for a candidate while urging others to do the same does not equal supporting the candidate.

 

ONly in the confused world of Ken the Flip Flopper does one not understand how voting for the better of the two options is the best move one can make. I am not a great Bush supporter. I simply know that he is better than Kerry and those are the only two viable options available. I have pointed out faults of Bush's before and I am sure I will do it again.

I am not a Bushbot/Bushinista/Bush kool-aid drinker, whatever those things are. I think he has been bad. Trust me, Bush doesn't want supporters like me. But the fact of that matter is that good citizenship requires you to spend your one vote in a manner that will help the country the greatest. You will ignore your civic responsibility and vote for a man who is not even able to mount a serious campaign. And then you will sit back and complain about the process. You have been so twisted in the past few months with your flip flops that you can't see straight. If you were to sit down and think about what is actually going on, you would begin to see the dangerous road you are advocating. It will result in the lifetime appointments of supreme court justices who will uphold Roe. It will result in higher taxes and greater government spending (yes it is possible). It will result in hastening the leftward tilt of this country. I refuse to be a part of that. You should too. You should take a stand against all the nonsense that is being spewed by teh Constitution Party right now. Support their formation as a party and work to get them established. But do not throw your vote away on someone who cannot win. Do what is right and best for this country.

And above all, quit blaming me and others out of your own confusion. The fact that you have been on both sides of this issue twice does not mean that the rest of us are that unstable.

 

Pastor Larry said, "Because I happen to have enough common sense to know that he is the better alternative between him and Kerry does not make me a Bush supporter."

Pastor Larry also said, "I am not a great Bush supporter."

Now, being not "a great Bush supporter" does not equal "does not make me a Bush supporter".

So, Pastor Larry, which of those statements, if not both, are false?

 

I got it!!!! LINK TO THE BEST WAY TO BE A GOOD CITIZEN AND SPEND YOUR ONE VOTE IN A MANNER THAT WILL HELP THE COUNTRY THE GREATEST, PER PASTOR LARRY'S ADMONITION TO ME

 

Here is an example of what I mean:

"In that same spirit, I find it hard to believe that the Creator who gave us liberty will ignore President Bush's willingness to sacrifice his own presidency for the liberation of Afghanistan and Iraq — their 50 million citizens, and perhaps their progeny for ages to come. A kind of cosmic justice (which does not always materialize, I recognize) calls for vindication." - Michael Novak