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"Logic" and Bible versions

Discussion in 'Bible Versions & Translations' started by Mexdeaf, Apr 21, 2010.

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  1. Mexdeaf

    Mexdeaf New Member

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    IF it were so critical for men to have a PURE, and PERFECT copy of God's Word, then WHY-

    1. Did God allow the actual original autographs, which (I trust) we ALL would agree were perfect and pure, to be LOST?

    2. Did God allow us instead to have multitudes of manuscripts, folios, fragments and so forth, none of which agree 100 percent in every way?

    3. Does God allow there to be TWO editions of the KJV which do not 100% agree with each other if purity and perfection are so important? Which one is preserved?

    4. And why in the world would God allow it to be preserved in English which is one of the most difficult languages to read and learn? (http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn1233-english-is-toughest-european-language-to-read.html- and others)
     
    #41 Mexdeaf, Apr 22, 2010
  2. Cutter

    Cutter New Member

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    It never ceases to amaze me the lengths that some posters go to to discredit the Word of God. You really enjoy this devil's advocate thing, huh Mexdeaf?
     
    #42 Cutter, Apr 22, 2010
  3. Trotter

    Trotter <img src =/6412.jpg>

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    I don't recall you ever trying to make out that your personal conviction was the one and only. That is what has stirred up all the contention. No one here has a problem personally with Winman, or Cutter, or Amy.G, or even you. in fact I have a whole lot in common with all of you save this one issue (and maybe one or two others outside of this).
     
    #43 Trotter, Apr 22, 2010
  4. Baptist4life

    Baptist4life Well-Known Member
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    I'm not really talking about the KJVO debate so much. I'm talking about the attitude from most of the regular posters on here. There truly seems to be a "bias" or "good ole boys" thing going on. That's why I tend to just read posts and refrain from getting into them. I just wanted to encourage some people.
     
    #44 Baptist4life, Apr 22, 2010
  5. TomVols

    TomVols New Member

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    Unfortunately, yes. :tear:

    No amount of evidence will ever convince me to believe something that would lead me from the inerrant, inspired, infallible word of God.

    I know. KJVOs stop at nothing. It's shameful.
     
    #45 TomVols, Apr 22, 2010
  6. Mexdeaf

    Mexdeaf New Member

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    How did I discredit the Word of God? Did I lie? Twist the truth? Deny that it exists?

    Pray tell exactly HOW?

    I am asking honest questions based upon what you and Winman claim- that there MUST be a perfect, preserved and pure Word of God- yet not even the various KJV editions agree 100% perfectly. Which one is letter- and word- perfect?

    You set up that standard and denigrate any modern version which does not meet it when your own version of choice does not. How is that logical?
     
    #46 Mexdeaf, Apr 22, 2010
  7. Cutter

    Cutter New Member

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    Nice twisting of my post TommyV. Kind of like what some liberals and revisionists do with scripture.
     
    #47 Cutter, Apr 22, 2010
  8. Dr. Bob

    Dr. Bob Administrator
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    Remember that when they say "Word of God" they mean the Anglican translation. If you show its (the AV, not the Word of God) errors or translational biases or opting for poorer Greek text choices, then you are attacking or discrediting the Word of God.

    When the rest of us say "Word of God", thankfully we are not talking about man-made translations but, uh, the actual WORD of GOD!!

    BTW, it proves their mindset. The #1 mark of a cult (Josh MacDowell) is replacing the Word of God or adding to the Word of God with man-made writings
     
    #48 Dr. Bob, Apr 22, 2010
  9. TomVols

    TomVols New Member

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    Indeed....another fatal flaw of KJVO
     
    #49 TomVols, Apr 22, 2010
  10. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Winman and Cutter, FWIW, some brotherly advice.

    Study Koine Greek, you can do it:

    James 1:5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.​

    Then transfer to TR (Scrivener's, the one underlying the AV) Only, then at least you are dealing with the original languages which are the words of inspiration attested to by the KJV translators in their introductory To the Reader AD1611:


    HankD
     
    #50 HankD, Apr 22, 2010
  11. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    I cannot for the life of me figure out why Cutter thinks these very legit questions posed by Mexdeaf are so bad.

    Please attempt a response.
     
    #51 Rippon, Apr 22, 2010
  12. Cutter

    Cutter New Member

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    Probably because they are irrelevant. Instead of being full of questions I prefer to be full of faith. It produces a much happier and productive life. Try it sometimes. :smilewinkgrin:
     
    #52 Cutter, Apr 22, 2010
  13. jaigner

    jaigner Active Member

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    Amen, Cutter. What a novel idea.
     
    #53 jaigner, Apr 22, 2010
  14. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    No, they are quite pertinent. The questions just get under your skin.

    You could try to be more full of answers.

    Well la dee da!

    By the way, did any biblical character ever identify himself as being full of faith -- or did others report that of him?
     
    #54 Rippon, Apr 22, 2010
  15. Cutter

    Cutter New Member

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    You're funny. If anything gets under anybody's skin it is that you are incapable of accepting the fact that I do not owe you or anybody else on here anything, answers or otherwise.
    And I think Well la dee da is a very fitting benediction for your post. :laugh:
     
    #55 Cutter, Apr 22, 2010
  16. TomVols

    TomVols New Member

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    Rippon, you made a terrible mistake. See, you have to actually believe the Bible that contains the 1 Pet 3:15 admonition to "But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear" before you can do it. You have to believe this to be true, and Christ must be Lord to have an answer. Hence, those of us that do have this hope get so frustrated with those who do not.
     
    #56 TomVols, Apr 23, 2010
  17. Mexdeaf

    Mexdeaf New Member

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    Herein lies the hypocrisy of KJVOism-

    When they find something that does not fit their standard, WE are expected to investigate and try prove to their satisfaction that they are wrong- an impossibility. Why? Because ONLY their standard is "perfect".

    But when they are confronted with logic- Why would God allow His Words to be "lost" until 1611- which is what you MUST Believe if you proclaim that the KJV is the ONLY PERFECT TRANSLATION- they claim the question is not worthy of a response.

    Oh, and my faith? My faith is in God and Christ, NOT IN A TRANSLATION!
     
    #57 Mexdeaf, Apr 23, 2010
  18. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    I think we should go easy on winman and cutter, after all they are our brothers in Christ.

    Though we disagree with them, they both have demonstrated restraint to a great degree.

    Again, my advise FWIW is that they shift to the original language documents, then all they have to deal with is the scribal blunders.

    One day, should the Lord tarry, I believe the church(es) will shift attention back to the traditional text of the historic and apostolic churches of Asia Minor.

    Just my opinion.

    HankD
     
    #58 HankD, Apr 23, 2010
  19. Mexdeaf

    Mexdeaf New Member

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    "Restraint" to me would be holding to the KJV as one's preference and not trying to hack down other versions just because they don't agree with it.

    But that's MY opinion. :smilewinkgrin:
     
    #59 Mexdeaf, Apr 23, 2010
  20. Winman

    Winman Active Member

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    How could the word of God be lost until 1611? Do you think the translators of the KJV made scripture up themselves?

    It is you that is saying the word of God was lost until 1611, not KJVOs. And it is an illogical argument.
     
    #60 Winman, Apr 23, 2010
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