Mary Queen of Heaven? What?

Personally, I'm not concerned with how the early church worshipped if that worship contradicts God's word. It would have been wrong then just as it is wrong now.

 

Claims and practice are two different things.
Each time they claim it they have been proven wrong every single time.
Each time they have been proven how they adore, worship, and even make a god out of Mary. This cannot be denied.

 

BillySunday..,.

God says it.

Couldnt be clearer.

In the scriptures.

Just as clear as Faith in Christ alone for justification is proclaimed, the truth of the scripture being our only source of authoritative truth is proclaimed.

Praise God.

 

Lori...

Nonsense, Lori. Pure nonsense.

Catholics and Catholic sympathisers...including you...have consistently advocated adoration directed towards others than God Almighty.

Mary. Dead christians. Supposed *super duper* specially *holy* dead christians.

And dont come back with some sort of absurd and ridiculous *word games*, such as...

"Why, its not "Worship"...its "Veneration"! (*Wink Wink*, they'll fall for that!)

No...we wont fall for that. We are "people of the Book". The scriptures. We know better.

A pile of *you know what* stinks no matter what one calls that pile.

 

To answer TS' OP, no, I don't hold with the Rosary, for the reasons given by Doubting Thomas and also because it does not spring from the Tradition of the Undivided Church.

 

So we are lying when we say we DON'T worship Mary or the saints?? Typical accusation on this board.

I know who and what I worship and I would have never left the Baptist church to become a Catholic if I believed what you are saying. I have been following the BB for years and have read all the 'proofs' that DHK and people like yourself have posted and it always comes down to accusing Catholics of lying when we assure you that we DON'T worship Mary or the saints.

 

Well, then you should be able to show me from scripture where scripture says that about itself. (I.e. That scripture is the SOLE authority regarding matters of faith and morals for the Christian.)

Peace!

 

http://baptistboard.com/showpost.php?p=1537726&postcount=80

I did, on the previous page--post #80. Why don't you take the time to read it.

 

This is not a question of inspiration but rather one of authority - sole authority. Scripture never claims that about itself. History has a huge part to play as well.

First you say that “…prayer is to one and only: the Trinity”

And when someone shows you directly from scripture that your position is biblically wrong (the prayer to the angles in Psalms 103) you suddenly imply that it is now OK to pray to angels?

Well, angles are not omnipotent, omniscient and omnipresent either. So, how can they hear us? It is through the power of Jesus Christ. If Jesus can allow them to hear our prayers then he can allow the glorious saints in heaven to do so as well.

Peace!

 

Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Well DHK, by that logic the sole authority regarding faith and morals for Christians comes only from the Old Testament (Specifically Isaiah 8) as the New Testament was not even around. Care to try again?

 

I don't believe that to be Catholic dogma/doctrine.

The immaculate conception is Catholic Doctrine.

Well, those were your words - words have meaning. I was simply correcting you as you did for me earlier.

Saints aren't dead Trotter and if you believe that they are, then you have serious theological issues well beyond my power to address.

Ps. 103:20-21 disagrees with that.

I do not hold to a works based salvation. Now - write this 100 times.

He can Trotter as He is God.

Peace!

 

I never said that I was willing to "...go outside of God's word for salvation". I go to God for that. There are more straw men around here than in a Wizard of Oz marathon!

Seriously, what I am challenging here is the validity of the idea that scripture is the SOLE authority regarding faith and morals for Christians. Scripture does not say that it is. If one believes that scripture is that SOLE authority, yet scripture never says that about itself, then one has a serious theological dichotomy.

This Sola Scriptura idea comes from the Reformation and is a man-made doctrine.

Peace!

 

It is my understanding that Catholics only venerate Mary and the saints - adoration is reserved for God alone.

I believe the Greek is:
Dulia: veneration of the saints, honor betowed, etc.
Hyper-dulia: a higher form of veneration to Mary (still not adoration)
Latria: Adoration due to God alone

Peace!

 

Absolutely! Spot on!

 

how convenient for you to discover non-English words that allow you to worship someone, without having to use the English word "worship."

Label it what you will...it's still unbiblical.

 

The last time I looked, the New testament was written in "non-English" words - Greek.

What ever do you mean, rbell? The word "venerate" is English too. I used both.

Only God knows a person's heart - that excludes you, I, or anyone deciding on what is vernation (honor) and what is adoration (worship).

What pomposity!

 

Well, DHK you've yet to "prove" it. To be honest, most of what the people in this thread have done thus far is to give their opinion. However, opinions do not an argument make.

 

Then you understanding in likened to an Ostrich with it's head in the sand. I was raised under Roman Catholic teaching and they very much pray, seek after and DEPEND on her.
Tell some of them that Mary image was seen in a tamale or her image burned in a door ect ect. and see how many flock to see it. Satan the father of lies love to pervert the simple devotion to the Lord Jesus.