Matthew 25 Judgment of Goats and Sheep

Beth -- you are exactly right!! :applause: So here's a good KoH parallel passage: Mt 13:45-50. It is the judgment of the OT and trib SAVED Gentiles -- both dead (45-46) and living (47-48).

Notice in 45-46: "Pearls" are from the "sea" (of Gentiles) but are also "dead," so to speak. Christ, the "merchant man," sold all he had and [came back] and bought it!

Now 47-48: "Fish" are gathered by "net" (gospel) from the "sea" still alive," right? They are brought to the shore -- which I like to see as the "edge" of the kingdom of Christ -- to be judged. They have to be divided, like the sheep and goats in Mt 25, right?

So you are right on -- the parables interpret one another! So let's get the order and meaning of these judgments in Mt 25. Going backwards from the one we just studied, Mt 25:14-29 would parallel Mt 13:38-43 for the living trib saints and 13:44 the resurrection and judgment of the dead OT and trib believing JEWS.

So back up one more section -- Mt 25:1-13 -- and see that this is the church raptured and the rejection of the unbelieving "church" as seen in Rev 2:16, 3:3, etal.

skypair

 

Actually, both 'kingdom of God' and 'kingdom of heaven' are same meaning.

Kingdom means King dominates(rules).

Later I will show you verses to prove that both are same meaning.

For example - John 3:3-"Jesus answered and said unto him, 'Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." Christ means that, a person must be born again to be saved. Or, if a person do not want to be born again, then cannot have eternal life according John 3:16.

'Kingdom of God' & 'kingdom of heaven' both are pictured as salvation and eternal life with Christ.

Nowhere in Bible saying that kingdom equals with Millennial.

Daniel chapter 7 describes of kingdom, itself is an eternality have no end.

Later this week, I will show verses on kingdom, and also show verses of both words prove that they are both same meanings.

In Christ
Rev. 22:20 -Amen!

 

My grandfather (and a bunch of other preachers) preached in the early 1940's that Mussolini was the Antichrist. Through that experience he decided never again to make predictions not directly made in the Bible.

 

Said elsewhere/elsewhen //It says "all nations" meaning all people
will be judged based on what we have done for
the least of these my brethren.//

IMHO Matthew 25:31-46 says 'all nations' meaning each and
every nations that survives the Tribulation period.
For Jesus 'my brethren' is the physical nation of Yisrael.
Hense my statement: "Judged by their treatment of Yisrael"

Said elsewhere/elsewhen //MA 25 says nothing about "God blessing those who bless Yisrael and cursing those who curse Yisrael." //

You are correct, Matthew 25 doesn't mention this.

God said to Abraham when Israel was in his loins:

Gen 12:3 (KJV1611 Edition):
And I will blesse them that blesse thee,
and curse him, that curseth thee: and in thee shal
all families of the earth be blessed.

So i see nothing wrong with saying:
//WHY: The Lord God fulfills His promises: God will bless those
who bless Yisrael and curse those who curse Yisrael//

(free:
Heb 7:9 And as I may so say, Leui also who receiueth tithes, payed tithes in Abraham.
Heb 7:10 For hee was yet in the loynes of his Father when Melchisedec met him.

I note that this refers to the loins of Abraham,
forefather of Israel, forefather of Levi.
So any promise said to Abraham was also made to Israel.

So i see nothing wrong with saying:
//WHY: The Lord God fulfills His promises: God will bless those
who bless Yisrael and curse those who curse Yisrael//

Differencers betweeen the Matthew 24:31-46
Sheep & Goat Nations judgements:

A. NO resurrection
B. Living Nations judged'
C. ON THE EARTH (Joel 3:2)
D. No books mentioned
E. Three Classes names: 'Sheep', 'Goats', 'Brethren'
F. Time - before the Millinnial Kindom of Messiah Jesus


and the Revelation 20:11-15 judgement:
A. a Resurreciton
B. DEAD (people) judged
C. location not specified (heaven, hell, earth?)
D. Books Opened
E. One Class named : 'THE DEAD'
F. Time - After the Millinnial Kingdom of Messiah Jesus


The three classes of people:
1 Corinthians 10:32 (KJV1769):
Give none offence, neither to the JEWS,
nor to the GENTILES, nor to the CHURCH OF GOD

Other supporting scriptures:
2 Cor 5:10, 1 Cor 3:11-15

The Judgement of Believers for 'works':

1Co 3:11-15 (KJV1611 Edition):
For other foundation can no man lay, then that is laide,
which is Iesus Christ.
1Co 3:12 Now if any man build vpon this foundation, gold,
siluer, preciousstones, wood, hay, stubble:
1Co 3:13 Euery mans worke shall be made manifest.
For the day shall declare it, because it shall
bee reuealed by fire, and the fire shall trie
euery mans worke of what sort it is.
1Co 3:14 If any mans worke abide which he hath built thereupon,
he shal receiue a reward.
1Co 3:15 If any mans worke shall bee burnt,
he shall suffer losse: but he himselfe shall be saued: yet so, as by fire.

If any man builds upon the foundation good things,
then He is REWARDED.
If bad things then he shall NOT BE REWARDED (suffer loss)
but STILL BE SAVED.

Hello, this is JUDGEMENT but a way milder judgement
for believers than that WHITE THRONE JUDGEMENT
where ALL there will be tossed into everlasting hell fire


The five crowns are part of this judgement.
(Note that these crowns are rewards, NOT punishment)

1. incorruptible crown
The Victor's crown
1 Cor 9:25-27

2. crown of life
Martyr's Crown
Rev 2:10

3. crown of glory
Elder's Crown
1 Pet 5:2-4

4. crown of righteousness
For those who Love His Appearing
2 Timothy 4:6

5. Crown of rejoicing
Soul Winner's Crown
1 Thess 2:19-20

 

If you'll check back, you'll see that I said we shouldn't be dogmatic on most prophecy. My view fits my prophetic scheme, yours fits yours.

The disciples weren't Christians yet! Christ hadn't died and risen yet, and the word hadn't been invented yet. :smilewinkgrin:

You've given several opinions here you can't prove, just as I've given my unprovable opinion. I'm content to leave it at that.

So you believe that every mention of servants of the Lord applies to us, too? What about context?

Let me get this straight. You believe we lost our salvation if we aren't hospitable??? Never heard that one before!

Sorry, it says nothing about individuals in the passage, just nations.

 

Wow!

This is a very good thread....you folks got me really studying! Skypair, thanks, I will also look up those parallels.

Has anyone studied Jesus coming with angels as opposed to His Coming with the saints? Matthew 25:31 ¶ When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:

It seems interesting that He comes with the holy angels when He separates the sheep and goats....Do you think this is consistent with His Second Coming, before the first resurrection?

Your sis in Christ,
Beth

 

In one place it says He comes with "10,000's of His saints" (Jude 1"14) and in another "with His angels" (Mt 24:31). I don't believe the 2 are contradictory. All believers are "angel spirits" (cf. John's letters to the "angels" of the churches, "we entertain angels unawares," etc.). But some of those coming back with Christ will be the pretrib raptured church (Rev 19:7-8, 14) in PHYSICAL bodies while others will be the spirits of the OT and trib saints in SPIRITUAL bodies to "gather" and reinhabit their earthly bodies in the "first resurrection" -- the "resurrection of the just."

skypair

 

Don't bother trying to prove a falsehood, DPT. The kingdom of heaven is Christ's kingdom which He will "deliver up ... to
God" after the MK, 1Cor 15:24-26. Then all will be the kingdom of God, 15:28.

Ya see, DPT, there is no death nor sin in the kingdom of God but there is in the kingdom of heaven/Christ. The souls of the saved are in the kingdom of God, yes -- they are sinless and live eternally. Plus that is where the Holy Spirit abides in us. But our spirit and body still abide in the kingdom of Christ, this earthly kingdom, until the rapture.

The kingdom of God was among us when Jesus came. He neither sinned nor would He have died had He not given His life for us. The kingdom of God is, for now, "above" from whence it will come down in the New Earth.

skypair

 

Actually, I agree with DPT here, as do most dispensational scholars. The reason is that the term "Kingdom of Heaven" occurs only in Matthew, and in many cases it occurs in exactly the same contexts as "Kingdom of God" does in the other Synoptic Gospels. Therefore, Matthew had to be translating the same Aramaic original of Christ as Mark and Luke did. See p. 279 in the monumental The Greatness of the Kingdom, by Alva McClain (one of my grad school texts), and p. 144 in Things to Come by Dwight Pentecost.

 

No doubt that the kingdom of heaven is a subset of the kingdom of God. But it's character CAN be distinguished from the kingdom of God which is precisely why Matthew uses the terminology he does.

The much larger point, though, is this -- the true kingdom of God is PERFECT. When we pray for it in the Lord's Prayer, it is not for Christ's kingdom come but specifically God's kingdom, the NH/NE. In fact, the Lord's Prayer is the one meant to be prayed in Christ's kingdom which will be the MK!

But I would also point out the DPT's intepretation takes dispensations out of the plan of God so he would, naturally, want to see it that way whereas the book of Matthew, being addressed nominally to the Jews, makes it that much more significant that Jesus was revealing to them a separate dispensation.

So if you are going to maintain with DPT that we are all "church," I guess that is where blurring the distinctions gets you.

skypair

 

No, it's not a subset of the kingdom of God, they are the same. Observe these places where Matthew uses KofH and the others use KofG in the exact same context: Matt. 5:3 and Luke 6:20, Matt. 3:2 and Luke 10:9, Matt. 11:25 and Mark 4:11, etc. etc.

Matthew saying "Kingdom of Heaven" is what is called a rhetorical device, using Heaven to mean God. It is quite common in various languages. In English we say "Heaven knows" when we mean "God knows." It Chinese Tien (Heaven) is an ancient word for God. The normal word for the monotheistic God in the time of Confucious was Shang Ti, but in his writings Confucious called God Tien.

It would take far too long to discuss all of this--I took a grad school class called "Kingdom of God" that was excellent. I'll just say, I don't see how you can prove Biblically that the KofH and KofG are different.

The only thing I am agreeing with DPT on is that the KofH and the KofG are the same. And this does no damage whatsoever to normal dispensationalism. And I am a pre-trib, pre-mil dispensationalist.

 

Thanks for the info. Sorry you miss my point.

Let me, perhaps, refine my assertion for you -- is it EVER said that the kingdom of heaven exists IN heaven? Not that I know of.

skypair

 

Why in the world would Bible have to say, "The Kingdom of Heaven exists in Heaven"???? If as I say Heaven in this case is a rhetorical device meaning God, then it exists wherever God is. If God is King, He is certainly king of Heaven.

 

Why??? Mainly because all the times that KoH is used it speaks of earthly scenes, events, or parables.

Again, you apparently do not perceive the issue of KoH being a "subset" of KoG wherein many things true about the KoH are true about the KoG but not vice versa (in the same way, Christ is a "subset" of God which also includes the Father and Spirit, no?).

AND it shows that you don't realize that there IS the distinction between the physical kingdom that Christ has and will deliver up to His Father (1Cor 15:25-28) and the Father's spiritual kingdom -- into which God will soon to "adopt" the Son's physical kingdom by the raptures (in both cases, Christ delivers them "up" to the Father).

God's kingdom now is spiritual and will be physically, completely, 100% perfect in the New Heavens and New Earth. Do you agree with that?

IOW, John, this is NOT too fine of a point to be made. It is critical for much theology and eschatology.

skypair

 

I don't have time to answer the rest of your post (it's Sunday morning), but this is not true at all. Go back and examine the 32 times KofH is used in Matthew (and only in Matthew). Many times it is used of an unseen kingdom: Matt. 5:3 (clearly spiritual), 5:10, 5:19, etc.

And you need to deal with the fact that only Matthew uses the term KofH. Why is that??

 

Sorry, that's all I have time for too. There is God's kingdom and there is Christ's kingdom.

"And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time is at hand. He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still." Rev 22:10-11

skypair

 

Sunday evening, late: a smoking gun passage that KofH and KofG are the same. Christ used both terms in Hebrew parallelism to teach the same truth:

Matt. 19:23-24--"23 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven. 24 And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God."