Miriam Carey

Discussion in 'News / Current Events' started by pinoybaptist, Oct 5, 2013.

  1. pinoybaptist

    pinoybaptist
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2002
    Messages:
    8,123
    Likes Received:
    1
    Miriam Carey was the woman shot at the Capitol by trigger happy cops. I hate to say that.
    I come from a Filipino family of cops and military men, and I was a cop for two years plus myself.
    Therefore my sympathies are ALWAYS with cops and my instinct is always to defend them and give them the benefit of a doubt.
    However, I can only look at this incident and come away saying the fatal shooting was uncalled for.
    Those who would defend the actions of these officers point out that the deceased used a deadly weapon, her car. That she deliberately rammed a police officer's car, and deliberately caused injury to officers, that the officers did not know there was a baby or small child inside the car, that they HAD to shoot when she GOT OUT of the car because they could not be sure if she had an IED strapped in the car, or a bomb strapped on to her.

    Well, here's a video of the incident, and although I'm sure you've seen this and others, I'd like to point out that (1) there is no way they couldn't have known about the child. They had the car surrounded from no less than three or four feet away and the windows were not tinted as far as can be made out, (2) in fact one or two of these officers had his hands on the door (rear) but before the driver pulled away, (3) seven or eight shots were fired at this spot of the incident (hidden from view) and it will be safe to assume the driver was wounded already at the resumption of the chase which ended in another area with more shots fired, according to witnesses, (4) if the car was rigged with explosives and the driver was intent on harming anybody, the explosives should have been triggered already before the chase began (a) from its point of origin, (b) at the point when the car was surrounded, or (c) at the instance those first 7 or 8 shots were fired.

    This was a mentally imbalanced individual, who was confused and afraid. Even if shots had to be fired, those shots could have been fired to incapacitate the vehilcle, not kill the driver. As for the car being used as a deadly weapon ? Maybe, but the question is why ? If driving a car constitutes possession of a deadly weapon that may or may not be used against an officer of the law, then we all are guilty and suspect and every officer should shoot down dead anyone who runs from a traffic stop and reason the same thing - fear that the car may be loaded with explosives.

    They are officers of the law, not executioners. Danger is always a part of their job. It is their job to suppose that there is the very real possibility that they may not come home alive, or at least whole, to their families, but the desire to come home safe at the end of the day should not be allowed to cloud their ability to determine the intent and person of whoever they come into adverse contact with, such as this one.

    This citizen did not deserve to be shot. What a hypocrisy it is to want to repeal death penalties and to reverse rulings imposed on criminals whose guilt were established in a court of their peers (whether rightly or wrongly) and yet be quick to authorize the death of somebody on suspicion that they might have a bomb on their bodies or their vehicles, and the desire to come home safe and sound to their families after taking on a job that works against that desire.

    sorry, this must not be tolerated, or justified at all.
    oh, by the way, from what I hear, she never exited with any firearm from her vehicle.
     
    #1 pinoybaptist, Oct 5, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 5, 2013
  2. thisnumbersdisconnected

    thisnumbersdisconnected
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2013
    Messages:
    8,448
    Likes Received:
    0
    Were you ever in a situation like that, facing down a dangerous suspect?

    If so, I believe you would come to a different conclusion. Had you been in such a situation, I believe you would know that concentration levels (as I've said elsewhere) narrow down to the suspect. Police, military personnel, whomever, see only the suspect. They don't see the peripherals, even when the "peripheral" is a child.

    Sorry, Pinoy, I agree with you almost always. But not this time.
     
  3. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    38,270
    Likes Received:
    777
    There is no evidence it was uncalled for.
     
  4. InTheLight

    InTheLight
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2010
    Messages:
    16,175
    Likes Received:
    610
    Agreed, these officers must have known there was a child in the car but that doesn't mean other officers at the other scenes knew it.

    Sorry, don't think so. It looks like the officers are firing to incapacitate the vehicle at this point. The car is rapidly accelerating away from the scene when you can hear 7 or 8 shots fired. They could have shot her dead just seconds previously to this, but didn't. Remember when this video was taken she had already rammed a security gate at the White House and clipped a Secret Service agent and a police officer with her car.

    How in the world could you know this?

    Yes, they tried this. Watch the video.

    Suspect rams a barricade at the White House, is told to halt but flees the scene injuring an agent. Suspect is then stopped and surrounded by officers with guns drawn. She flees again amid gunfire, drives several blocks away at high speed jumping curbs and crossing medians where she again rams a barricade and again attempts to flee. So you are saying that this suspect who has defied orders to halt three times and has rammed into barriers at both the White House and Capitol building should not have been fired upon?

    I'm not understanding you. She did exit the vehicle leaving her child behind. I have not heard whether or not she was armed, only that she did not fire shots.
     
    #4 InTheLight, Oct 5, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 5, 2013
  5. pinoybaptist

    pinoybaptist
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2002
    Messages:
    8,123
    Likes Received:
    1
    at which point whoever KNEW could have warned others.

    No, they were not. look again. you cannot incapacitate a vehicle by holding on to it. if they could shoot somebody in a moving object then they could shoot out a tire, and don't give me that thing about a flat tire not stopping a car. the point is they demonstrate restraint from deadly force by FIRST shooting at a tire or the tires.

    Aimed DIRECTLY at the subject. and that is the whole point of my objection. DID SHE HAVE TO BE KILLED ?

    So she rammed a security gate. she could have been drunk, she could have been on drugs, she could have been crazy (which she was), she could have been a terrorist, she could have been miley cyrus twerking them with her car, she could have been anything and anyone. does ramming a gate at the white house entitle her to a hail of lead ? so she clipped the officers with her car. was it an intentional swipe ? or did it happen because she was turning her car ?


    How in the world did somebody say the car could have been rigged with explosives. why is a car rigged for explosives. for a fireworks display so everybody can have fun ?

    huh ?

    she was mentally imbalanced. while no one knew that at the time, why should LAW ENFORCERS assume she was not and that she was intent in committing a crime under full control of her faculties ?

    she rammed BARRIERS. not the white house itself. that alone should be clue to supposedly calm and trained GUNMEN that something is wrong with her sense of judgment.

    and I have not heard whether she exited the vehicle. all news I've read so far did not indicate she did. and even if she did, and they chose to fire, they still shouldn't have shot to kill.
    the kill was uncalled for at that point if she exited pecially if she exited unarmed.
    what it tells me is they shot her because she injured two of their own.
    that's what this is all about and I am afraid some people are correct when they say this country is fast turning into a police state.
    now, as it is turning out, except for her being depressed and on medication she is an upstanding citizen.
     
  6. pinoybaptist

    pinoybaptist
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2002
    Messages:
    8,123
    Likes Received:
    1
    yes, twice. and the suspects were armed, and shooting both times. I have a right kneecap that hurts in the winter from a healed crack and don't ask me why it hurts.
    And I've had a driver of a passenger vehicle try to ram me and my traffic sergeant with his vehicle and I'm glad to say we didn't shoot him down, even if he was a confirmed felon.
    But it took a while for his swollen eyes to heal, and he needed a set of upper dentures afterward.
    Would you agree that was better than snuffing him out ?
    At least now he enjoys his grandchildren.
     
  7. pinoybaptist

    pinoybaptist
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2002
    Messages:
    8,123
    Likes Received:
    1
    Our guys in Vietnam were operating in territories here everybody wanted them dead, and no unarmed civilian necessarily equates to friendly, but was My Lai justified ?

    What makes the White House perimeter special that anyone who acts or is thought to be acting aggressively within those perimeters is in danger of getting shot dead ?

    The fact is that if this woman was suspected to really be an actual danger to Obama or those senators they would have been whisked away already by their security detail and one terrorist in a car wouldn't be able to get to them. didn't they need to capture this "terrorist" alive so she can be interrogated and any plot which, again, may have skipped the community's radar be brought to light ?

    see ?

    this response was more police deadly than terrorism preventive.
     
  8. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2010
    Messages:
    18,904
    Likes Received:
    94
    One would "Think" that a Capital District Police Force could have quickly assessed the situation (perhaps calling in for Identity of Driver & Mental Records to earmark the problem) & also cordon off roads/ perhaps with devices that would disable the vehicle. Otherwise disable it by a few well placed rounds in the motor block & tires. Again I said THINK....thats the operative word. I dont have "Certainty Knowledge"
     
  9. pinoybaptist

    pinoybaptist
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2002
    Messages:
    8,123
    Likes Received:
    1
    The evidence is a dead body of an American woman now with known delusional post partum depression, and a family of upstanding American citizens, one of whom is a retired NYPD cop, asking why ?
     

Share This Page

Loading...