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More Seventh-Day Adventists

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by Ed Edwards, Jan 2, 2007.

  1. Gerhard Ebersoehn

    Gerhard Ebersoehn Active Member
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    Originally Posted by Shiloh
    I'm sorry........should I rip that verse out of my Bible?

    GE:
    No, rather get it into your mind and heart - which I can't see you have.
     
  2. Gerhard Ebersoehn

    Gerhard Ebersoehn Active Member
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    Meanwhile, if you go have a look at the context there, the poor women stand innocently by while the men devour one another over one of their old favourite bones of contention: Women with more brains and courage than they. Paul console the men: Women rather keep quiet for the sake of peace and unity (among these uncontrolable self-conceited bigheads).
     
  3. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    If you can't take the heat Shiloh - it is better to get out of the kitchen rather then twisting the bible around.

    In Corinth we are told "EACH ONE had a revelation".

    In 1Cor 12 we are told TO EACH ONE is given a gift.

    In the book of Acts we see Philips Daughters prohesying for the church.

    We also see Priscilla instructing Apollos!

    The "I will insult women in the name of scripture" model that you use above - is not supported by the NT text.

    But we do SEE the rule "you will be known by your love".

    How true that is friends.

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
  4. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    That's the guy!

    Also "Bible Readings for the Home".

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
  5. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    #1. It SHOWS that Christ entered heaven AFTER His resurrection to begin his work in the heavenly sanctuary -- it shows Him to be our "High Priest in HEAVEN".

    #2. Lev 16 SHOWS us the work of the HIGH Priest in the types of the OT was specific to the "DAY OF ATONEMENT" since that is what the entire chapter is about.

    Hebrews 4[/b]
    13 And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all things are open and laid bare to the eyes of Him with whom we have to do.
    14 Therefore, since we have a
    great high priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession.
    15 For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but One who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin.
    16 Therefore let us draw near with confidence to the throne of grace, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need.




    Heb 7]
    25 Therefore He is able also to save forever those who draw near to God through Him, since He always lives to make intercession for them.
    26 For it was fitting for us to have
    such a high priest, holy, innocent, undefiled, separated from sinners and exalted above the heavens;
    27 who does not need daily, like those high priests, to offer up sacrifices, first for His own sins and then for the sins of the people, because this He did once for all when He offered up Himself.


    In Christ,

    Bob
     
  6. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    The entire chapter describes the "Day of Atonement" and at the END the statement is made

    Lev 16
    32 ""[b]
    So the priest who is anointed and ordained to serve as priest in his father's place shall make atonement:[/b] he shall thus put on the linen garments, the holy garments,
    33 and make atonement
    for the holy sanctuary, and he shall make atonement for the tent of meeting and for the altar. He shall also make atonement for the priests and for all the people of the assembly.
    34 ""Now you shall have this as a permanent statute, to make atonement for the sons of Israel for all their sins once every year.'' And just as the LORD had commanded Moses, so he did

    A dead lamb by itself - without the work of the High Priest - makes no atonement -- you need the actual work described (typified) by what God tells us in Lev 16 to be done for this PROCESS to be complete.

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
  7. Shiloh

    Shiloh New Member

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    The most dignified way I can muster up ....... you SDA are nuts?
     
  8. Claudia_T

    Claudia_T New Member

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    I would say more like rude instead of dignified.


    But then again none of us act properly all of the time on this board.
     
  9. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    In Acts 7 -- Christ "stands at the right hand of God"

    To see the WORK of Christ as high priest -- read scripture

    Heb 9
    23 Therefore it was necessary for the copies of the things in the heavens to be cleansed with these, but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these.
    24 For Christ did not enter a holy place made with hands, a mere copy of the true one,
    but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us;
    25 nor was it that He would offer Himself often, as the high priest enters the holy place year by year with blood that is not his own.


    Hebrews 8
    1 Now the main point in what has been said is this: we have such a high priest, who has
    taken His seat at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens,
    2 a
    minister in the sanctuary and in the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, not man.
    ...
    5 who serve a copy and shadow of the heavenly things, just as Moses was warned by God when he was about to erect the tabernacle; for, "" SEE,'' He says, ""THAT YOU MAKE all things ACCORDING TO THE PATTERN[/b] WHICH WAS SHOWN YOU ON THE MOUNTAIN.''

    6 But now He has obtained a more excellent ministry, by as much as He is also the mediator of a better covenant, which has been enacted on better promises.
     
    #69 BobRyan, Jan 5, 2007
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  10. DHK

    DHK <b>Moderator</b>

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    Concerning the atoning work of Christ, the most significant words in the Bible are found in John 19:30,
    It is finished!
     
  11. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    Considering His "Atoning SACRIFICE" completed ONCE for all at the cross - the most significant words in the bible

    1John 2:2 "AND He is the ATONING SACRIFICE for our sins and NOT for our sins ONLY but for the sins of the WHOLE WORLD" --

    Atoning sacrifice of Christ - full and complete at the cross!
     
  12. Claudia_T

    Claudia_T New Member

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    DHK

    That is true but could it be that you misinterpret what "It is Finished" really means?


    This is where the Great Controvery between Christ and Satan is spoken of... where it started. Consider that Satan started this entire thing by lying to the Angels in Heaven and deceiving them and then lying about God again to Eve in the Garden. This entire thing is the controversy between Christ and Satan ... Satan being who is the Adversary of God. Think about what really was finished at the cross. Besides the atonement. "For God so loved the world that He gave..."

    Genesis 3:
    3: But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.
    4: And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
    5: For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.


    what was finished?

    Gen:3:15: And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.


    "For God SO LOVED the world... that He gave His only begotten Son..."

    THE LIE of Satan exposed! he lied about God from the start in heaven and caused the Angels and Adam and Eve to believe the worst about God.


    Jesus bruised the head of Satan at the Cross!


    The whole thing is MUCH BIGGER than many suppose. Read back on what I said in a previous post about Joshua and the Angel.


    Rv:12:10: And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.


    Rv:8:5: And the angel took the censer, and filled it with fire of the altar, and cast it into the earth: and there were voices, and thunderings, and lightnings, and an earthquake.




    Claudia
     
    #72 Claudia_T, Jan 5, 2007
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  13. DHK

    DHK <b>Moderator</b>

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    You revert to your second authority again.
    The Great Controversy is a book of heresy written by a false prophetess. Women are always out of order aren't they? They are not permitted to have authority over a man, which makes the whole movement questionable in the very least.
    What does Satan and his fall have to do with this? Nothing.
    Satan was cast out of heaven because of his own pride; his own rebellion. It had nothing to do with Christ or the atonement. Christ did not come to atone for the rebellion of Satan. Satan did not start the fall of man. Satan drew about a third of the angels with him in his rebellion against God--nothing to do with Christ's atoning work.
    Finish your statement--For God so loved that world that--what? That he died for Satan and his demons?? I don't think so!! :rolleyes:
    Adam of his own will rebelled aganst God. Satan did not force his hand to sin. He chose to sin. Eve was not forced to sin. She was deceived. Satan had not much to do with it. She listened to Satan and was deceived by him. But it was her own fault. She could have taken steps to prevent herself from sinning against God. She chose to eat of that fruit. She didn't have to eat of it. She wasn't forced to. It was of her own will that she did it.
    In effect Satan has nothing to do with this.
     
  14. Claudia_T

    Claudia_T New Member

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    actually I reverted to the Bible. As did Bob.
     
  15. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    SIT / Stand

    Heb 1:3
    3And He is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of His power When He had made purification of sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high,

    Surely we can use the above as a wooden rule to insist that Christ is only sitting and that the High Priestly work of Christ has ended – for surely no priest can work while sitting.

    No! Scripture denies such a wooden rule --

    zech 6

    11 "Take silver and gold, make an ornate crown and set it on the head of Joshua the son of Jehozadak, the high priest.
    12"Then say to him, 'Thus says the LORD of hosts, "Behold, a man whose name is Branch, for He will branch out from where He is; and He will build the temple of the LORD.
    13"Yes, it is He who will build the temple of the LORD, and He who will bear the honor and sit and rule on His throneThus, He will be a priest on His throne, and the counsel of peace will be between the two offices."'

    Hebrews 8[/b]
    1 Now the main point in what has been said is this: we have such a high priest, who has
    taken His seat at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens,
    2 a
    minister in the sanctuary and in the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, not man.

    Acts 7 also shows that Christ is “STANDING at the right hand of God”
    Rev 1 also shows Christ standing.
     
    #75 BobRyan, Jan 5, 2007
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  16. DHK

    DHK <b>Moderator</b>

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    Obviously you didn't. Neither did you respond to the post.
     
  17. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    In Corinth "EACH ONE" has a revelation according to Paul - not just "the biggotted men" of 1Cor 14.

    In 1Cor 12 EACH ONE is given a spiritual Gift for the building up of the Church.

    in the book of Acts Philips daughters prophesy for the NT church.

    In Acts Priscilla instructs Apollos --

    Just when biggotry thought it found a place it could hide in scripture -- it is fully exposed and debunked.

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
  18. DHK

    DHK <b>Moderator</b>

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    You can't prove any of the statements that you made as true. Take Scripture out of context and you can make it say anything you want it to. Psalm 14:1 states that "There is no God."
    You are doing the same thing. You are quoting parts of verses and taking Scriptures out of their context to try to prove a preconceived idea. What hogwash.

    In 1Cor. 12 "each one" does not mean "every one." There is a big difference. Not every one had a gift of prophecy or the gift of tongues. Paul was teaching just the opposite of what you are saying. You take a statement out of context and try and make it say something other than what it really says. Amazing!!

    Did the first century Christians in general, have the gift of prophecy. Considering this passage:

    1 Corinthians 14:34-35 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

    Considering that Paul bluntly tells them to "shut up." It is not even lawful for them to speak in the services of the church, I would say that none of them have the gift of propecy. That of course would include Ellen G. White. Even more so, since these gifts ended at the end of the first century.

    Philip's daughters prophesied. So they did. And Philip performed miracles. And Philip was carried away in the Spirit ending up in another part of the world. It was a period of transition where some very unusual things happened. The daughters prophesying was a part of the fulfillment of prophesy given by Peter in Acts 2.

    Concerning Aquilla and Priscilla, it doesn't mention one name or the other alone. It always mentions them both together. You cannot say dogmatically that a woman taught Apollos. Don't read into Scripture things that are not there.
     
  19. Claudia_T

    Claudia_T New Member

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    Actually, Satan has EVERYTHING to do with it... all the time, behind the scenes.... God gives us a glimpse of it in the book of Job... It is the Great Controversy going on between God and Satan at all times, though we cannot see it... Satan LYING about God's character...

    Job 1:
    1: There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job; and that man was perfect and upright, and one that feared God, and eschewed evil.
    2: And there were born unto him seven sons and three daughters.
    3: His substance also was seven thousand sheep, and three thousand camels, and five hundred yoke of oxen, and five hundred she asses, and a very great household; so that this man was the greatest of all the men of the east.
    4: And his sons went and feasted in their houses, every one his day; and sent and called for their three sisters to eat and to drink with them.
    5: And it was so, when the days of their feasting were gone about, that Job sent and sanctified them, and rose up early in the morning, and offered burnt offerings according to the number of them all: for Job said, It may be that my sons have sinned, and cursed God in their hearts. Thus did Job continually.
    6: Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them.
    7: And the LORD said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.
    8: And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil?
    9: Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, Doth Job fear God for nought?
    10: Hast not thou made an hedge about him, and about his house, and about all that he hath on every side? thou hast blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land.
    11: But put forth thine hand now, and touch all that he hath, and he will curse thee to thy face.
    12: And the LORD said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the LORD.


    Now re-read it all, Satan is saying God isnt really worth serving... people only want to serve God as long as He is blessing them and giving them things...
    that is what Satan is saying
     
    #79 Claudia_T, Jan 5, 2007
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  20. Marcia

    Marcia Active Member

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    Claudia, the fact that Jesus is our Advocate in heaven (and I am well aware of this and thought you would bring it up) does not mean he is still atoning for our sins. I don't think you understand what atonment means. Atoning and advocating are different.

    Jesus advocates for believers because Satan is accusing us every time we sin and fail, and Jesus steps in and says, "Wait a minute, I've paid for Marcia's sins and she is saved."

    Yes, we are to obey but obeying does not and cannot save us. And the blood is not applied to those who "endeavor to obey" but to those who have faith. Have you ever read Galatians? You should. Also, Colossians.




    If we could be saved by obedience, then Jesus died for nothing. He died because God knows we cannot be saved by obeying, being good, striving, etc. It is only by faith in the blood shed once for all on the cross when the atonement was complete.


    </SPAN></SPAN>
     
    #80 Marcia, Jan 5, 2007
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