MV's Salvation Requirements?

Discussion in '2004 Archive' started by Trotter, Aug 29, 2004.

  1. Trotter

    Trotter
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    The following was part of a post in a differnet forum here on the BaptistBoard.

    What I want to know is this: HOW?

    How do the modern versions (a.k.a. not KJV) change what it takes to be saved?

    Anyone care to fill me in?

    In Christ,
    Trotter
     
  2. michelle

    michelle
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    I have never claimed this, nor would I. In fact I know people who do use the mv's and have been saved by them. The gospel is still presented in them, just weakened in them.


    Love in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
    michelle
     
  3. Trotter

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    You are not the one who posted this, Michelle.

    But, since youe brought it up, exactly how and where is the gospel weakened in other versions? It is close enough to the topic to be included.

    In Christ,
    Trotter
     
  4. David J

    David J
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    Gee... does this sound weak?

    Jude 1:24-25(NASB)
    24 Now to Him who is able to keep you from stumbling, and to make you stand in the presence of His glory blameless with great joy,25 to the only God our Savior, through Jesus Christ our Lord, be glory, majesty, dominion and authority, before all time and now and forever. Amen.

    or

    Romans 10:5-13(NASB)For Moses writes that the man who practices the righteousness which is based on law shall live by that righteousness. 6 But the righteousness based on faith speaks as follows: “Do not say in your heart, ‘Who will ascend into heaven?’ (that is, to bring Christ down), 7 or ‘Who will descend into the abyss?’ (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead).” 8 But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart”—that is, the word of faith which we are preaching, 9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; 10 for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation. 11 For the Scripture says, “Whoever believes in Him will not be disappointed.” 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him; 13 for “Whoever will call on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

    or

    Romans 3:1-31(NASB)
    1 Then what advantage has the Jew? Or what is the benefit of circumcision? 2 Great in every respect. First of all, that they were entrusted with the oracles of God. 3 What then? If some did not believe, their unbelief will not nullify the faithfulness of God, will it? 4 May it never be! Rather, let God be found true, though every man be found a liar, as it is written,

    “That You may be justified in Your words,

    And prevail when You are judged.”


    5 But if our unrighteousness demonstrates the righteousness of God, what shall we say? The God who inflicts wrath is not unrighteous, is He? (I am speaking in human terms.) 6 May it never be! For otherwise, how will God judge the world? 7 But if through my lie the truth of God abounded to His glory, why am I also still being judged as a sinner? 8 And why not say (as we are slanderously reported and as some claim that we say), “Let us do evil that good may come”? Their condemnation is just.


    9 What then? Are we better than they? Not at all; for we have already charged that both Jews and Greeks are all under sin; 10 as it is written,

    “There is none righteous, not even one;

    11 There is none who understands,

    There is none who seeks for God;

    12 All have turned aside, together they have become useless;

    There is none who does good,

    There is not even one.”

    13 “Their throat is an open grave,

    With their tongues they keep deceiving,”

    “The poison of asps is under their lips”;

    14 “Whose mouth is full of cursing and bitterness”;

    15 “Their feet are swift to shed blood,

    16 Destruction and misery are in their paths,

    17 And the path of peace they have not known.”

    18 “There is no fear of God before their eyes.”


    19 Now we know that whatever the Law says, it speaks to those who are under the Law, so that every mouth may be closed and all the world may become accountable to God; 20because by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified in His sight; for through the Law comes the knowledge of sin.

    21 But now apart from the Law the righteousness of God has been manifested, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, 22 even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all those who believe; for there is no distinction; 23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 being justified as a gift by His grace through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus; 25 whom God displayed publicly as a propitiation in His blood through faith. This was to demonstrate His righteousness, because in the forbearance of God He passed over the sins previously committed; 26 for the demonstration, I say, of His righteousness at the present time, so that He would be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.

    27 Where then is boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? Of works? No, but by a law of faith. 28 For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law. 29 Or is God the God of Jews only? Is He not the God of Gentiles also? Yes, of Gentiles also, 30 since indeed God who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through faith is one.

    31 Do we then nullify the Law through faith? May it never be! On the contrary, we establish the Law.

    Hummmm... sounds like I read a liberal bible! Sigh... and the KJVO lies continue to spread!

    Michelle,

    Have you ever read from a NASB(1995)? If not then how can you judge it?

    I used to be a KJVO for over 7 years therefore I have read both the KJV and NASB. Now tell me with full examples where the gospel is weak in the NASB?

    *PLEASE NOTE that the NASB IS NOT AN UPDATED KJV! The NASB is a translation taken from Greek and Hebrew! So let's not chase that KJVO rabbit ok.
     
  5. Daniel David

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    I would agree with Michelle that a lot of MVs twist and pervert the gospel texts and/or are ambiguous.

    However, the MVs that are of accurate representations of the originals do not muddy the waters.

    Michelle would believe the NASB and ESV and NKJV weaken the gospel because she doesn't have a clue about theology.
     
  6. David J

    David J
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    Some MV do, but faithful modern translations do not. The lesser versions are still the word of God. Some translations are just better than others. I do not recommend translations like the LIV etc...

    I'll agree that Michelle and many other KJVOist are clueless about the NASB, ESV, HCSB, and NKJV.

    Let's not give KJVOist a chance to hijack this thread. I would like to see where the NASB takes a doctrine out or weakens the gospel.
     
  7. Priscilla Ann

    Priscilla Ann
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    I was saved after a period of time spent studying an NIV bible. It was a translation that I could consistently read and understand, and it remains my first preference. The best translation for me is the one I read.
     
  8. Daniel David

    Daniel David
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    We should already know their cut and paste answer from www.kjvoswhobondtogetheragainstteamsatanandhisnewversions.com (note: the above site does not really exist but should).

    They will say that it removes "Jesus" so many times, "Lord" so many times, "blood" so many times, and blah blah blah. Nevermind that the KJV added those words.

    I used to be KJVO. It is like a light at the end of the tunnel. A train light that is.
     
  9. michelle

    michelle
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    --------------------------------------------------
    You are not the one who posted this, Michelle.
    --------------------------------------------------

    Trotter, please calm down. I wasn't implying nor did I mean you were talking about me specifically, and I wasn't accusing you of that. I am sorry if you thought I was. I apologize if you did. I was just stating what I have said, not said, and what I believe. I know you weren't accusing me, because you said someone else from another thread had said this. I just wanted to let you know what I thought about this.

    As far as your questions on how they have weakened the testimony, this has been discussed many times, and many links have also been given if you really desire to know how.


    love in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
    michelle
     
  10. David J

    David J
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    I'm waiting for examples in full context Michelle....

    What about strickly dealing with the NASB. Please refer to my note about the NASB in my earlier post.

    Thank you.
     
  11. michelle

    michelle
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    --------------------------------------------------
    Romans 10 NASB

    9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;
    --------------------------------------------------

    Since when is Jesus AS Lord? Jesus IS Lord.

    Scripture says this:

    Romans 10

    9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.


    love in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
    michelle
     
  12. Daniel David

    Daniel David
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    Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

    That was even better than I thought. That has to be the best one I have ever seen.

    Okay, okay. Let me illustrate the insanity of Michelle's theology:

    I can speak of Jesus as the King. I can also say that Jesus is King.

    I can speak of Jesus as the Lord. I can also say that Jesus is Lord.

    I can speak of Jesus as the redeemer. I can also say that Jesus is the redeemer.

    HELLO MICHELLE! If you are trying to disprove the NASB to us, remember that you are speaking to people who can think and not those who attend KJVO conferences.

    Nyuk nyuk nyuk nyuk nyuk nyuk nyuk

    Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
     
  13. David J

    David J
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    LOL...good one Michelle but try again. I understand the English language [​IMG]

    Jesus as Lord: He is the Lord
    Jesus is Lord: Jesus as the Lord

    Does anyone else see a problem with our sister's example but me?

    Next example please! Now remember to post in full context and not the copy and paste KJVO distortions.

    Thank you.
     
  14. michelle

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    --------------------------------------------------
    Romans 10 NASB

    11 For the Scripture says, “Whoever believes in Him will not be disappointed.” 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him;
    --------------------------------------------------

    So now, the believer who believes in Jesus Christ AS LORD will not be disappointed? No, this is not what the scripture says. Also, this passage makes it sound as if we are not dissappointed if we believe because those who believe abound in riches. The scriptures say this:


    Romans 10

    11 For the scripture saith, WHOSOEVER BELIEVETH ON HIM SHALL NOT BE ASHAMED.
    12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all IS RICH unto all that call upon him.

    We shall not be ashamed whoever believes on Him, because it is the Lord who is rich to all that call upon him. Meaning, there is nothing that keeps the Lord from offerring his grace toward all men, as He is valuable or abounding to all. Not abounding in riches. He is sufficient or the price paid for all. This is why previous to this verse, we are told that there is no difference between the Jew or the Greek.

    Love in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
    michelle
     
  15. Ed Edwards

    Ed Edwards
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    To answer your question, Jesus is as Lord
    from the day I was saved. When i confessed
    Jesus as Lord, then He was Lord for me.
    Before I confessed Jesus as Lord, He was
    not Lord for me.

    If you condemn the NASB here you
    must praise this scripture (to avoid
    the appearance of being a hypocrite):

    Romans 10:9 (HCSB = The Holman Christian Standard Bible)
    if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.

    [​IMG] Praise Iesus! [​IMG]
     
  16. David J

    David J
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    Main Entry: dis·ap·point·ed
    Function: adjective
    1 : defeated in expectation or hope
    2 obsolete : not adequately equipped
    - dis·ap·point·ed·ly adverb

    or

    Main Entry: ashamed
    Pronunciation: &-'shAmd
    Function: adjective
    Etymology: Middle English, from Old English Ascamod, past participle of Ascamian to shame, from A- (perfective prefix) + scamian to shame -- more at ABIDE, SHAME
    1 a : feeling shame, guilt, or disgrace b : feeling inferior or unworthy
    2 : restrained by anticipation of shame &lt;was ashamed to beg&gt;
    - asham·ed·ly /-'shA-m&d-lE/ adverb

    Yet again you fail to grasp the full context. I have not been disappointed since I accepted Christ. Are you saying that the word disappointed is wrong? Again read the passage in full context!

    Seems that disappointed covers a bit more than the word ashamed....

    Try again my dear...

    Next example please.....

    Thank you.
     
  17. michelle

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    Sorry Ed. Jesus isn't AS Lord to me. Jesus IS Lord to me. Jesus Christ is my Lord. Jesus Christ is not AS my Lord.


    love in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
    michelle
     
  18. Marcia

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    Michelle, this is just a simple matter of grammar. They mean the same thing.

    I know Jesus as (my) Lord because Jesus is Lord.

    You changed it. It does not say you know Jesus "is as Lord." It says to know "Jesus as Lord." Do you not know Jesus as your Lord? Of course you do! If he's your Savior, He's your Lord, and you know him as Savior and as Lord.
    Do you deny that?
     
  19. michelle

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    Sorry David. The context of the scriptures is not speaking of being disappointed. It is speaking of not being ashamed. You in the above post, indicated the definitions of each word meaning. Read in context of that passage. Of the NASB, and then the context of the KJB and you will see a big difference. I also clearly explained it to you, to which you also ignored.

    I do know a bit about the NASB because I have a Bible Study class at a different church, that uses an NASB for the study on the book of Revelation. I do not use the NASB that they give, I use my KJB, but I have noticed quite a few differences and changes that do not settle well with me. I am not going to go into it though. You know why? Because none of you even care. It would only be wasting my time, as is evidenced on this very thread, and that was only two things that I found, and I haven't even read the entire post yet. I am sure I could and would find more.


    love in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
    michelle
     
  20. Askjo

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