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No dead babies, little children, infants in Hell?

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by jdlongmire, Jul 9, 2008.

?

Concerning Infants and Little Children dying in infancy:

  1. All are elect

    25 vote(s)
    67.6%

  2. Some are elect

    2 vote(s)
    5.4%

  3. Scripture is not clear on this

    8 vote(s)
    21.6%

  4. I am unsure

    2 vote(s)
    5.4%
Top Posters
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  1. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    Tell you what...if you truly wanted to go through this to learn, you would answer my question. If we are taking Psalms literally now (which to me is a "hoot")...are we sinners at conception (Psalm 51) or at birith (Psalm 58)? If it's as literal as you say..."Houston we have a problem"

    I'll be back later to tell you what I feel the true meaning of Psalm 51 is...
     
    #161 webdog, Jul 13, 2008
  2. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    Did you know you were a sinner before salvation??

    BBob,
     
    #162 Brother Bob, Jul 13, 2008
  3. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    Everyone knows they're sinners.Even those who are never saved know they are sinners.The magnitude of the issue is,of course, not realized.
     
    #163 Rippon, Jul 13, 2008
  4. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    An infant knows it's a sinner :confused:

    If they can know complex thought processes like God's Law...how come they don't know other complex thought processes?

    My son, who's going on 3 is having a hard time understanding pooping on the potty instead of his diapers, and knowing when he has to go. I just told him he's a sinner and he said "yeah"? and laughed while grabbing his Mr. Potatohead.
     
    #164 webdog, Jul 13, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 13, 2008
  5. jdlongmire

    jdlongmire New Member

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    yes, because I had Law preached to me, as well as grace. Paul only had Law before Christ and he believed he had it "down pat".
     
    #165 jdlongmire, Jul 13, 2008
  6. Amy.G

    Amy.G New Member

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    HA! :laugh:

    Kids are great!
     
    #166 Amy.G, Jul 13, 2008
  7. Jarthur001

    Jarthur001 Active Member

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    conception
     
    #167 Jarthur001, Jul 13, 2008
  8. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    jdlongmire or James, are the "elect" saved by Grace through faith??

    BBob,
     
    #168 Brother Bob, Jul 13, 2008
  9. jdlongmire

    jdlongmire New Member

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    yes - that is what Scripture teaches
     
    #169 jdlongmire, Jul 13, 2008
  10. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    So, you "elect" babies have "faith"?

    You all made that up, to get away from your forefathers preaching that the road to hell would be lined with baby bones. You say all babies that die are "elect". You made that up also. If not give scripture where babies have grace "through" faith?

    The original doctrine of your forefathers was that babies go to hell, at least one said the road to hell would be paved with baby bones, the best I remember. This generation of "reformed" have changed that doctrine, because it was running away the sheep.

    BBob
     
    #170 Brother Bob, Jul 13, 2008
  11. jdlongmire

    jdlongmire New Member

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    yes - saving faith, just as John the Baptist had in the womb.

    Luke 1

    41When Elizabeth heard Mary's greeting, the baby leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit. 42In a loud voice she exclaimed: "Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the child you will bear! 43But why am I so favored, that the mother of my Lord should come to me? 44As soon as the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the baby in my womb leaped for joy. 45Blessed is she who has believed that what the Lord has said to her will be accomplished!"

    are you holding the sins of the fathers against the children?

    besides, most reformed theologians hold to at least the children of the elect are elect and many more hold to the election of all infants, dying in infancy - even Calvin:
    from Boettner's The Reformed Doctrine of Predestination
    Ch. 11 - Infant salvation
     
    #171 jdlongmire, Jul 13, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 13, 2008
  12. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    ....................
     
    #172 Brother Bob, Jul 13, 2008
  13. jdlongmire

    jdlongmire New Member

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    You and I and all Mankind, post-fall, are conceived as a sinner. I was referencing the idea that you are bringing up things that the old reformers believed.

    Are you familiar with the term and idea of semper reformanda?
     
    #173 jdlongmire, Jul 13, 2008
  14. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    What if in the semper reformanda, you add to scripture that infants have faith, and have no scripture for it?

    BBob,
     
    #174 Brother Bob, Jul 13, 2008
  15. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    SFIC didn't answer this post of mine. Quoting from the NIV this time :"Therefore, my brothers, be all the more eager to make your calling and election sure..."( 2 Peter 1:10)"Examine yourselves to see whether you are in the faith;test yourselves."( 2 Cor.13:5)

    So,SFiC, how you you apply these verses?Can they be applied to anyone today?
     
    #175 Rippon, Jul 13, 2008
  16. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    So Psalm 51 is literal...and Psalm 58 is figurative :confused:

    The point of Psalm 51 is David speaking of his life being so vile and corrupt it seems he was born that way. His sin was brought to the surface, and he saw how truly sinful he was. That is called hyperbole, which is rampant throughout the Psalms and Scripture.
     
    #176 webdog, Jul 14, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 14, 2008
  17. standingfirminChrist

    standingfirminChrist New Member

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    The very fact that David said of his son when he died "He cannot return to me, but I can go to him" shows that all babies who die in infancy go to heaven.

    Had David merely meant the grave when he made this statement, he would have continued to refuse food or to have committed suicide right then and there.

    Had David thought that child of his went to hell, then after making the statement "I shall go to him," David would have quit serving the Lord and would have fought against God's people.

    He did not do either.

    David knew that child was in heaven with God... as all children who die in infancy are.
     
    #177 standingfirminChrist, Jul 14, 2008
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