Notes in the 1611 KJV

Discussion in 'Bible Versions/Translations' started by Deacon, Feb 21, 2007.

  1. Deacon

    Deacon
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    Can you help me?
    I could search for this myself but it's easier in a group.

    I'm looking for text critical notes in the original 1611 KJV (most particularly in the Gospels).
    Notes like "some manuscripts read...."

    I know that there is at least one (thot it was in Mattthew), but can't seem to find it.

    Do you know of any?

    Rob
     
  2. Ed Edwards

    Ed Edwards
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    Matthew 1:11(KJV1611 Edition):
    And ||Iosias begate Iechonias
    and his brethren,
    about the time they were caried away to Babylon.

    Margin note:
    || Some read, Iosias begate Iakim, and Iakim begat Iechonias

    Matthew 1:11(KJV1611 Edition, alternate reading):
    And Iosias begate Iakim, and Iakim begat Iechonias
    and his brethren,
    about the time they were caried away to Babylon.
     
  3. Ed Edwards

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    Luke X:22 (KJV1611 Edition):
    || All things are deliuered to me of my father:
    and no man knoweth who the sonne is,
    but the father: and who the father is,
    but the sonne, and he to whom the sonne will reueale him.


    Margin note:
    || Many ancient copies adde these words,
    And turning to his disciples he said.

    Luke X:22 (KJV1611 Edition, alternate reading):
    And turning to his disciples he said.
    All things are deliuered to me of my father:
    and no man knoweth who the sonne is,
    but the father: and who the father is,
    but the sonne, and he to whom the sonne will reueale him
     
  4. Ed Edwards

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    New Testament Translator Notes that start
    with 'Gre' or 'Gr' indicate a variance in the Greek sources
    (note that such a variance in the Textus Receptus
    among the Greek sources means that TR (Textus
    Receptus) is properally a plural: TRs


    Luke XII:20 (KJV1611 Edition):
    But God said vnto him, Thou foole,
    this night +thy soule shal be required of thee:
    then whose shal those things be which thou hast prouided?

    Margin note:
    +Gre,
    doe they require thy soule.

    Luke XII:20 (KJV1611 Edition, alternate):
    But God said vnto him, Thou foole,
    this night doe they require thy soule:
    then whose shal those things be which thou hast prouided?
     
    #4 Ed Edwards, Feb 21, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 21, 2007
  5. Ed Edwards

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    Luke XVII:35-36 (KJV1611 Edition):

    Two women shall bee grinding together;
    the one shall be taken, and the other left.

    36 ||Two men shall be in the field;
    the one shall be taken, and the other left.


    Margin note:
    || This 36 verse is wanting in most of the Greek copies


    Luke XVII:35-36 (KJV1611 Edition, alternate):

    Two women shall bee grinding together;
    the one shall be taken, and the other left.
     
  6. Ed Edwards

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    John XI:33 (KJV1611 Edition):

    When Iesus therefore sawe her weeping,
    and the Iewes also weeping which came with her,
    hee groned in the Spirit, and +was troubled,

    Margin note:
    + Gr. Hee troubled himselfe.

    John XI:33 (KJV1611 Edition, alternate):

    When Iesus therefore sawe her weeping,
    and the Iewes also weeping which came with her,
    hee groned in the Spirit, and Hee troubled himselfe,
     
  7. Ed Edwards

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    That looks like FIVE in the Gospels.
    There are a lot more 'Or' indicating alternate
    possible translations into English from the Greek.
     
  8. EdSutton

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    I admit I don't have one, but with all respect, get a 'real' copy of the original 1611 KJV (not some 17th or 18th century "Johnny-come-lately" Americanized or even British 'version'), and you will probably find what you are asking.

    I'm sure Ed Edwards could tell you where to procure a copy, since he obviously has one, and quotes from it very frequently.

    Ed
     
  9. Deacon

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    Thank you Ed.

    I'm studying through the Gospels and was sidetracked into looking at the textual notes in various versions after noticing differences in Mark 3:32.

    And a crowd was sitting around him, and they said to him, “Your mother and your brothers are outside, seeking you.”
    ESV

    A crowd was sitting around Him and told Him, “Look, Your mother, Your brothers, and Your sisters are outside asking for You.”
    HCSB

    MY "real" copy of the 1611 KJV is on-line @
    SCHOENBERG CENTER FOR ELECTRONIC TEXT AND IMAGES [LINK]

    Rob
     
    #9 Deacon, Feb 22, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 22, 2007
  10. Mexdeaf

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    Rob,

    Could you please re-post that link? For some reason my computer won't read it and I was unable to find it by a web search.

    Thanks!
     
  11. Ed Edwards

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    Mark 3:32 (ESV):
    And a crowd was sitting around him,
    and they said to him,
    Your mother and your brothers*
    are outside, seeking you.”

    Footnote:
    * Other early manuscripts add
    and your sisters

    Mark 3:32 (HCSB = Christian Standard Bible /Holman, 2003/ ):
    A crowd was sitting around Him
    and told Him,
    Look, Your mother, Your brothers, and Your sisters+
    are outside asking for You.”

    Footnote:
    + Other mss omit
    and Your sisters

    The KJVs Translators' notes do not
    exist at Mark 3:32.
     
  12. Keith M

    Keith M
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    According to the online versions at http://www.studylight.org sisters didn't appear in this verse until publication of the Mace New Testament in 1729. There is no mention of sisters in Wycliffe, Tyndale, Coverdale, Bishops', Geneva or 1611 KJV.
     
  13. EdSutton

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    Guess the "perfect" 1611 version was not so perfect, after all, since it 'needed'? "correcting", and in the text it followed, no less, hunh! :laugh:
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Ed

    P.S. Sorry for the 'hijack' bit, but I would not resist this opening. Carry on!
     
    #14 EdSutton, Feb 22, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 22, 2007
  14. Mexdeaf

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  15. Deacon

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    de nada :thumbs:


    What is interesting about the text in Mark 3:32 was that the phrase “and your sisters” is included in both the NA27 Greek text and the Majority Greek text
    BUT NOT INCLUDED in the either the Westcott and Hort Greek NT or the Stephen’s 1550 Textus Receptus.

    (The NA27 text does place it in brackets but a majority believed that it was original.
    It was placed in brackets, “in view of the weight of attestation for the shorter text”).

    I was wondering if there were any other places where the 1611KJV might differ from the Majority text and agree with Westcott and Hort’s GNT.

    I have also noticed that the HCSB is the only popular version to include the reading in the main body of its text; even the NKJV omits it.

    Rob
     

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