Number Of His Name

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by antiaging, Jun 28, 2008.

  1. antiaging

    antiaging
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    Revelation 13:17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

    Revelation 13:18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.


    These protestant bible scholars believed that the pope is an antichrist or that the antichrist would be the last pope:
    Martin Luther, John Calvin, John Wesley, Cotton Mather, John Knox, Wycliffe, Tyndale, Finney, Moody, Spurgeon, Sir Isaac Newton, and Fox.

    During the Reformation, Martin Luther noted that "Benediktos" added up to 666 in Greek gematria, and he thought it might refer to a Pope named Benedict or to Benedictine monks.

    Β
    ε
    ν
    ε
    δ
    ι
    κ
    τ
    ο
    σς
    TOTAL
    2
    5
    50
    5
    4
    10
    20
    300
    70
    200
    666

    Benedict xvi is the pope now.
    However I believe from what the bible says that the Ezekiel chapters 38 and 39 prophecy must happen before antichrist comes to power over the 10 nations of the EU, the revived Roman empire. The Ezekiel prophecy is about nations, Russia, Iran/Iraq, Ethiopia, Germany or France uniting in a coalition to attack Israel. That is not about to happen yet, although the middled east is moving in that direction. Recently Israel threatened by a military exercise to attack Iran's nuclear facilities and Russia warned them to back off. If Israel does attack Iran, this could make Russia angry enough to form the coalition to attack Israel in just a few years, while Benedict is still pope. This guy pope Benedict was a Hitler youth and grew up in a country where the catholic Govt. of Germany was murdering people of other religions in the holocaust. [I read that the third reich was the most catholic controlled Govt. Germany ever had.] Before he became pope, he was the head of the modern "office of the inquisition" which now has another name, something like the society for the propagation of the faith or something like that. Seeing his background it seems to me that he could have the mentality of the antichrist.
    The antichrist is supposed to obtain the kingdom by flattery, Dan. 11. Is pope Benedict using flattery on the leaders of the European Union? If the Ezekiel prophecy happens soon enough, he could be the antichrist.!! We will need to wait and see. I know he is an old man, but aging can be greatly slowed down by vitamins, calcium and alot of sleep. He could last a long time.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
     
  2. Amy.G

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    Oy Vey.....................:sleeping_2:
     
  3. Born_in_Crewe

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    Just a mischievous thought...if someone assasinated the current Pope and he was the anti-christ, what would happen then? :tonofbricks:
     
  4. antiaging

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    The real antichrist cannot be assassinated. According to the book of Revelation the beast and the false prophet are going to be cast alive into the lake of fire.

    Revelation 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.
     
  5. rbell

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    I think Louis Farrakhan preached this same sermon at the million man march.

    Fortunately, my trust is in God, not pagan numerology.
     
  6. mrtumnus

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    There's a lot that could be said here, but for one thing, I'd quit reading the sources you are. Germany was a Protestant country by a factor of about 2/3 well before, during, and after Hitler. Hitler was voted into power by this majority Protestant country. The home of Martin Luther, remember? The man whose writings on the Jews are seen by historians as being a contributing factor for creating the environement that allowed the Holocaust to occur. From wiki, speaking about his treatise "On Jews and Their Lies":

    The prevailing scholarly view[8] since the Second World War is that the treatise exercised a major and persistent influence on Germany's attitude toward its Jewish citizens in the centuries between the Reformation and the Holocaust. Four hundred years after it was written, the National Socialists displayed On the Jews and Their Lies during Nuremberg rallies, and the city of Nuremberg presented a first edition to Julius Streicher, editor of the Nazi newspaper Der Stürmer, the newspaper describing it as the most radically antisemitic tract ever published.[9]
     
  7. antiaging

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    The catholic vote is what swept Hitler into power when the pope said he was backing Hitler. See google for online book, The vatican in World politics by Avro Manhattan and read the chapters about Hitler, Germany and the vatican; it's all documented. Hitler was a born catholic.
    The holocaust was against the members of the Jewish religion, not the Jewish race. General Milch of the SS was Jewish, but not the Jewish religion. Goebbles and Eichman were Jewish descent but not Jewish religion. Thousands of Jews were in the German army; Jewish descent not Jewish religion. It was the religion of the Jews that was persecuted in the holocaust. Race was the cover story that was to be put out if Hitler lost the war.
    Get on Google and read The vatican's holocaust online: The persecutions in Catholic croatia were purely because of religion; race had nothing to do with it.
    Heindrich Hemler's uncle, the Jesuit father Himler was a high ranking member of the SS. He was found dead in the cell at Nuremburg before he could go to trial.
    Monseignor Tiso, of Slovakia was hanged as a war criminal because he supplied the first contingent of Jews from his country to Auscwitz.
    Check the sources you have been reading, since the vatican has been trying to cover their involvement with Hitler ever since he started losing to the Russians, around 1941 or 1942.
    Buy book, The secret History of the Jesuits; there is a website with excerpts from it online.
    Vatican hid 1000 catholic Jews, in the vatican for the duration of the war, so that they could say they also helped the Jews. ---They were roman catholic Jews.
    Then there is the high ranking arch bishop that provided money for the SS members to escape to catholic countries of South America after the war to escape prosecution. the ratline
     
    #7 antiaging, Jun 29, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 29, 2008
  8. mrtumnus

    mrtumnus
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    Please explain how 1/3 of the population can 'sweep' someone into power?

    Before World War II, about two-thirds of the German population was Protestant and one-third was Roman Catholic. In the north and northeast of Germany especially, Protestants dominated.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Germany

    Especially when the 2/3 majority was voting for Hitler in much higher percentages than the minority Catholics?

    Although Hitler's political career began in Munich, in the elections of 1928 to November 1932 the NSDAP won a higher share of the vote in Protestant than in Catholic Germany. In the Catholic Rhineland and Bavaria (apart from Protestant Franconia) it polled disproportionately badly. In fact in July 1932 the Nazi share of the vote was almost twice as high in Protestant as in Catholic areas. The inability, of Nazis to attract the Catholic vote was demonstrated by the stable support for the Catholic Centre Party, which regularly gained between 11.8 and 12.5 per cent between 1928, and November 1932; and by that of its sister confessional party, the Bavarian People's Party (BVP), which stayed firm at around 3 per cent in those same elections.

    http://www.johndclare.net/Weimar6_Geary.htm

    So I am interested in your explanation of how Catholics, who were only 1/3 of the population compared to the 2/3 Protestant majority, and who voted for Hitler 50% less than Protestants, managed to 'sweep' Hitler into power?
     
  9. Zenas

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    Antiaging, I can't say whether you are right or wrong about Hitler's relationship with the Catholics. But don't think for a minute that Hitler and the Nazis were focused on the Jewish religion rather than the Jewish race. Hitler had a strong hatred of all Jews from the time he was a young man, as evidenced by this paragraph from Mein Kampf:
    Mein Kampf also leaves not doubt that Hitler was an avowed atheist.
     
  10. rbell

    rbell
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    ya'll quit confusing Antiaging with the facts.
     
  11. Amy.G

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    It's a good thing that Antiaging takes all those fountain of youth vitamins. He's gonna need em to counteract all that worry.

    [​IMG]
     
  12. standingfirminChrist

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    Here's something to think about....

    According to the verses in Revelation, it is not just the number of the beast that will be required, but also the name of the beast. This will be mandatory if one wants to buy or sell.

    The will be given 3 options. take the name of the beast, take the number of the beast, or die.
     
  13. Thinkingstuff

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    All these thoughts on the Anti Christ is nonsense! I tend to think John was referring to Trajan and Nero. Put enough work into it you can make anyone the anit christ.
     
  14. Amy.G

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    I have thought of that myself also, but I don't think it's a popular belief among Baptists, so don't tell anyone I told you that. :laugh:
     
  15. standingfirminChrist

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    John wrote that there are already many anti-christ's in the world already.

    Trajan and Nero were both anti-christ, but neither of them are the one who will sit in the temple showing himself to be God causing everyone to be identified by a mark on their right hand or forehead by his name or number.

    The problem with your theory that the anti-christ that John wrote about in Revelation being Trajan or Nero is the fact that they have been dead for centuries. And neither are said to have recovered from a deadly wound like John foresaw would take place.
     
  16. Thinkingstuff

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    Yeah, I'm not so sure I believe in the Rapture as presented by Darby or the SDA Millerites. I have a problem with a partial return of christ. I think reviewing revelations from a modern concept leads us into error. Studying Jewish apocalyptic literature leads gives a better perception of Johns Revelations. Always looking for the number of the beast etc... is a waste of time. An Anti Christ will make themselves known and be obvious to real christians. I think christianity spends too much time looking over their shoulder for the Anti-christ. There are enough anti christ in this present age to deal with such as the muslims Jeffers of the FLDS and many others. I'm much more interested in the final analysis of Revelations.
     
  17. Jarthur001

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    It matters little WHO the man is.....

    The point as seen in the number(666) is that it is a man.

    It is man vs God and most all of mankind will follow the "man" into war to do war with God and the saints.
     
  18. antiaging

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    Adolph Hitler said, "I reject that book by Rosenberg. It was written
    by a protestant. It is not a party book... as a catholic I never feel
    comfortable in the evangelical church or its structures... as for the
    Jews, I am just carrying on with the same policy which the catholic
    church has adopted for fifteen hundred years, when it has regarded the
    Jews as dangerous and pushed them into ghettos, etc., because it knew
    what the Jews were like. I don't put race above religion, but I do see
    the danger in the representatives of this race for church and state,
    and perhaps I am doing christianity a great service." ( "The Nazi
    Persecution of the Churches," by J. S. Conway, pp. 25, 26, 162)
    Adolph Hitler was catholic until the day of his death.
    Former Pope orders persecution of Jews:
    "We decree and order that from now on, AND FOR ALL TIME, Christians
    shall not
    eat or drink with Jews; nor admit them to feasts, nor cohabit with
    them, nor
    bathe with them. Christians shall not allow Jews to hold civil honors
    over Christians, or to exercise public office in the State. Jews
    cannot be merchants, Tax Collectors, or agents in the buying and
    selling of the produce and goods of Christians, nor their Procurators,
    Computers or Lawyers in matrimonial matters, nor Obstetricians; nor
    can they have association or partnership with Christians. No Christian
    can leave or bequeath anything in his last Will and testament to Jews
    or their congregations. Jews are prohibited from erecting new
    synogogues. They are obliged to pay annually a tenth part of their
    goods and holdings. Against them Christians can testify, but the
    testimony of Jews against Christians in no case is of any value. All
    and every single Jew, of whatever sex and age, must everywhere wear
    the distinct dress and known marks by which they can be evidently
    distinguished from Christians. They cannot live among Christians, but
    in a certain street, separated and segregated from Christians, and
    outside which they cannot under
    any pretext have houses"
    [Pope Eugenius IV, A.D. 1442, Bull. Rom. Pont., V.67]
    The Jewish holocaust was a Roman catholic inquisition that was done
    under cover of the Nazi party.

    Hitler was carrying on with catholic policy of persecuting Jews. Mein Kampf was written by a Jesuit priest named Staemfle that was killed in the night of the long knives. Hitler just endorsed the book. Look up Staempfle on google or read the book THE SECRET HISTORY OF THE JESUITS, by catholic French historian Edmond Paris. Paris said that.

    You say Hitler was an atheist. Charles Chiniquy in his book, 50 years in the church of Rome said that over 50 popes were atheists and infidels.
    The catholic church is full of atheists. That is what happens when babies are baptized. People belong to the organization that never did believe in God.
    I was catholic; grade school, high school college. Many of my catholic friends were atheists. I am not catholic anymore.
     
  19. antiaging

    antiaging
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    You want some facts?

    Martin Luther
    (1483-1546) (Lutheran)
    "We here are of the conviction that the papacy is the seat of the true and real Antichrist...personally I declare that I owe the Pope no other obedience than that to Antichrist." (Aug. 18, 1520)

    John Calvin
    (1509-1564) (Presbyterian)
    "Some persons think us too severe and censorious when we call the Roman pontiff Antichrist. But those who are of this opinion do not consider that they bring the same charge of presumption against Paul himself, after whom we speak and whose language we adopt...I shall briefly show that (Paul's words in II Thess. 2) are not capable of any other interpretation than that which applies them to the Papacy." Taken from "Institutes" by John Calvin.

    Cotton Mather
    (1663-1728) (Congregational Theologian)
    "The oracles of God foretold the rising of an Antichrist in the Christian Church; and in the Pope of Rome, all the characteristics of that Antichrist are so marvelously answered that if any who read the Scriptures do not see it, there is a marvelous blindness upon them." Taken from "The Fall of Babylon" by Cotton Mather
    John Knox
    (1505-1572) (Scotch Presbyterian)
    Knox wrote to abolish "that tyranny which the pope himself has for so many ages exercised over the church" and that the pope should be recognized as "the very antichrist, and son of perdition, of whom Paul speaks." Taken from "The Zurich Letters" pg. 199 by John Knox.

    Thomas Cranmer
    (1489-1556) (Anglican)
    "Whereof it followeth Rome to be the seat of antichrist, and the pope to be very antichrist himself. I could prove the same by many other scriptures, old writers, and strong reasons." (Referring to prophecies in Revelation and Daniel.) Taken from "Works" by Cranmer, Vol. 1, pp. 6-7.

    John Wesley
    (1703-1791) (Methodist)
    Speaking of the Papacy he said, "He is in an emphatical sense, the Man of Sin, as he increases all manner of sin above measure. And he is, too, properly styled the Son of Perdition, as he has caused the death of numberless multitudes, both of his opposers and followers...He it is...that exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshiped...claiming the highest power, and highest honor...claiming the prerogatives which belong to God alone." Taken from "Antichrist and His Ten Kingdoms" by John Wesley, pg. 110.

    Roger William
    (1603-1683) (First Baptist Pastor in America)
    He spoke of the Pope as "the pretended Vicar of Christ on earth, who sits as God over the Temple of God, exalting himself not only above all that is called God, but over the souls and consciences of all his vessals, yea over the Spirit of Christ, over the Holy Spirit, yea, and God himself...speaking against the God of heaven, thinking to changed times and laws: but he is the son of perdition (II Thess. 2)."
    You can add to those names these men that thought the pope is an antichrist:
    Wycliff, Tyndale, Sir Isaac Newton, Fox, Finney, Moody, Spurgeon.

    "It is the bounden duty of every Christian to pray against Antichrist. And as to what Antichrist is, no sane man ought to raise a question. If it be not Popery in the Church of Rome, there is nothing in the world that can be called by that name. . . . Popery is contrary to Christ’s gospel and is the Antichrist and we ought to pray against it." ~Charles Haddon Spurgeon, 1873 England’s Prince of Preachers Quoted by Ireland’s Ian Paisley Protest of the Pope in Parliament

    Pope's title vicar of Christ means antichrist by definition.
    JESUS CHRIST HAS NO VlCAR. Vicar, from the Latin "vicarius" means "in the place of" e.g. vicarius sacrifice of Christ being His sacrifice in the place of the sinner. Papal claims such as infallibility, Head of the Church, Holy Father, all seek to put the Pope in the place of Christ, which place only the Living Christ can have. This false assumption of Rome is expressly put forward in the Papal title "Vicar of Jesus Christ".
    The New Testament was written in Greek, and the Greek translation of " vicar of Christ" is "Anti (instead of)-christos", or in our English Bible, "Antichrist". The word "Antichrist" is not just a word of wild insult, but is a Bible warning of the false role assumed by the Popes of Rome as supposed vicars of Christ, (See 1 John 2:18 D.V.).
    The Greek word for "Vice President" is "Anti-Proedros"; Because Anti, which means opposite, also means "replacement" or "instead", as in Vicar or Viceroy or Vicarious.

    Anyone pretending to be a substitute for Jesus Christ on the Earth is by definition an antichrist. There is only one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus. He does not have a substitute, though some pretend to be.

    1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
    The office of Pope does not come from the bible. Roman Pontiff comes from the old pagan Roman religion. All of the Roman emporers following Julius Caesar were chief Roman Pontiff.

    The office of pope itself pretends to be a substitute for Jesus and therefore any pope is an antichrist.

    The Bull Unam Sanctam... Issued by POPE BONIFACE VIII reads as follows: "The Roman Pontiff judges all men, but is judged by no one. We declare, assert, define and pronounce: to be subject to the Roman Pontiff is to every human creature necessary for salvation that which was spoken of Christ 'thou has subdued all things under his feet' may well seem verified in me... I have the authority of the King of Kings. I am all in all and above all, so that God himself and I, the vicar of God, have but one consistory, and I am able to do all that God can do." "Christ entrusted His office to the chief pontiff;... but all power in heaven and in earth has been given to Christ;... therefore the chief pontiff, who is His vicar, will have this power." Corpus Juris chap. 1 column 29, translated from a gloss on the words Porro Subesse Romano Pontiff "We hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty" ...Pope Leo XIII "All the names which are attributed to Christ in Scripture, inplying His supremacy over the church, are also attributed to the Pope." Bellamin, "On the Authority of Councils," book 2, Chapter 17. "For thou art the shepherd, thou art the physician, thou art the director, thou art the husbandman, finally thou art another God on earth." Labbe and Cossart's "History of the Councils." Vol. XIV, col. 109 The title "Lord God the Pope" can be found within a gloss of Extravagantes of Pope John XXII, title 14, chapter 4, Declaramus.
     
  20. Ed Edwards

    Ed Edwards
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    From the O.P.: //However I believe from what the bible says that the Ezekiel chapters 38 and 39 prophecy must happen before antichrist comes to power over the 10 nations of the EU, the revived Roman empire.//

    I've talked to a Jewish Rabbinical Student who says the Teaching Rabbis (Pharisee Sect) teach that Ezekiel Chapter 38 and Ezekiel Chapter 39 are TWO different invasions of Yisrael. If so, Ezekiel Chapter 38 would refer to the invasion of Yisrael about the time of the appearance of the Antichrist; the Ezekiel Chapter 39 invasion of Yisrael would be the war after the Millennial Messianic Kingdom lead by Satan.
     

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