ObamaCare Compared to RomneyCare

Discussion in 'Politics' started by FollowTheWay, Oct 6, 2013.

  1. FollowTheWay

    FollowTheWay
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    ObamaCare is very similar to the healthcare law introduced by the last Republican Presidential candidate Mitt Romney in Mass. Actual RomneyCare is in some ways more liberal than ObamaCare. I'm not aware of any terrible consequences in MA. Why do so many people expect dire consequences with ObamaCare?
     
  2. Revmitchell

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    There is a cast difference between doing this at the state level and on a national level. It is difficult ti understand why extreme left wing liberals cannot understand something so basic.
     
  3. FollowTheWay

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    What is the vast difference? In both cases the healthcare changes were made consistent with our democratic system of government. Maybe you like many of the radical right no longer believe in democracy. You just think that everything must go your way. Here's a clue. They won't.
     
  4. poncho

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    We never believed in a democracy. That's a fairytale concocted by collectivists that think an individual's inalienable rights should be sacrificed for the "greater good" of the group and the greatest group of them all is the state.

    The constitution guarantees a republican form of government to the states to protect the rights of the individual. Not a democratic system of government that usurps the individual's rights to transfer them to the "community" or "society" or the "environment" or any other group the collectivists think needs saving from the wicked individual and his radical notion of having inalienable rights.

    Don't you collectivists realize that groups are made up of individuals?
     
    #4 poncho, Oct 6, 2013
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  5. church mouse guy

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    Romney is a recovering liberal. He did not advocate Romneycare for the federal government. The Democrats have tried to pin the donkey tail on Romney and the GOP on this issue, but the GOP and the American people did not vote for Romney, and he is retired from politics. The real Mormon leader now is Harry Reid, a traditional confrontational Mormon, always unpleasant.
     
  6. Don

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    Not aware of any terrible consequences? How about Massacbusetts' elected officials complaining of the rising costs; and predicting that if they can't figure something out, by 2020 medical care will constitute 50% of their state budget, which means only 50% of the budget to meet ALL the other state funding requirements (roads, bridges, etc.)? That's 14 years from the implementation date.

    We're already seeing businesses turning our country into a "part-time worker" nation; and health insurance premiums jumping higher than anyone expected.

    Is this what you wanted from the ACA?
     
  7. thisnumbersdisconnected

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    Because Romneycare is not the ACA. It is far better, though it is still too much government regulation in a free marketplace for my taste. The ACA is going to close down major insurance companies, in many cases firms that have been on the financial landscape for over a century, because of the completely unreasonable and probably illegal interferences in the free market it imposes.

    Romneycare imposed high deductibles to maintain affordability, thus helping constrain medical spending by making health insurance consumers cost conscious. At the same time, it provides catastrophic coverage under the same policy purchased with the high deductible. It actually included a clause to reduce the high deductible in the case of critical care events, whereas the ACA puts all catastrophic care decisions in the hands of a bunch of bean-counters.

    Though Romneycare imposed a mandate on owning health care insurance, it didn't put the marketplace in the hands of the government, but left it in the free market where it belongs, thus encouraging individual responsibility to provide their families protection in the event of illness without getting the government involved in the market, where it does not belong.

    Romneycare has no employer mandate. There shouldn't be either an employer or individual mandate in my opinion, but lack of an employer mandate in Romneycare discourages bean-counters from getting involved in health care, as they tend to gravitate to situations where cost controls are of concern to the employer providing the coverage.

    There is no tax surcharge on higher incomes under Romneycare. There shouldn't be. No one should be punished for making money.

    Romneycare isn't the ACA, and vice versa. The claim that it is has been trumpeted by the Great Pretender and the media, but the claim is and of itself a bold-faced lie.
     
    #7 thisnumbersdisconnected, Oct 7, 2013
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  8. Salty

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    Think 10th Amendment
     
  9. FollowTheWay

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    Obamacare vs Romneycare

    President Obama has said that the Affordable Care Act (aka Obamacare) borrows heavily from similar legislation at the state level (aka Romneycare) implemented in Massachusetts in 2006 and passed by then governor Mitt Romney. We examine the similarities and differences between the two pieces of legislation, and also note how Romney's current healthcare policy differs from the 2006 law he passed.

    In many ways Romney’s healthcare plan was more liberal than Obama’s.
    1. The tax penalty was greater for not having insurance ($1,200 vs. $695).
    2. Employers with significantly less employees were required to provide insurance (11 vs. 50)
    3. Romney’s plan was free for anyone making less than 150% of the poverty level. (Obama’s plan wasn’t free for anyone but extended subsidies
    up to 400% of poverty level vs. 300% for Romney.

    Obama’s plan was more liberal in some ways.
    1. Insurers required to cover pre-existing conditions without qualification whereas Romney’s plan can limit coverage of certain conditions to 6 months.

    All in all I’d say the plans were very similar. Of course all Romney could say during the election was that Obamacare was significantly more liberal than his and would be repealed immediately after he took office.
    [FONT=&quot][/FONT]
     
    #9 FollowTheWay, Oct 7, 2013
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  10. FollowTheWay

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    I wanted the complete bill. The final product was seriously flawed by the Republicans' changes. However, something is better than nothing. Thousands of lives will be saved by this law. I know 2 of them personally.
     
  11. poncho

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    Nine out of 10 doctors say medicine is on the wrong track, most think about quitting and find it hard to practice ethical medicine. They say government is most to blame for the mess, but are quick to add neither Congress nor the President - can be trusted to fix things.

    An overwhelming 9 of 10 doctors say that current changes make them think about quitting. Only 5% say that they are "re-energized" by changes in the medical system. These are all-time high numbers since the 1960's.

    “The numbers of doctors who are ready to throw in the towel are stunning,” said Kathryn Serkes co-founder and Chair of DPMA and author of the survey, which concluded on May 26. “These results are particularly enlightening about the shaky future of private practice – it may go the way of Marcus Welby and the old country doc, “ said Serkes. “Private practice doctors say they are an endangered species whose existence is threatened by poaching by corporate medicine, insurance and government,” said Serkes. “This is a slow-motion medical disaster in the making.”

    The survey includes 699 doctors, 23% Primary Care Providers (Internal Medicine, Family Practice), 10% General Surgery, 11% Hospital-based specialists and 56% Office-based specialists in active practice across 45 states.

    http://www.doctorsandpatients.org/


    Interestingly, nearly 75 percent of the doctors surveyed said less government, rather than more government, would help fix the existing problems with the medical system. These problems presumably include things like government oppression against so-called alternative and non-mainstream medical treatments and procedures, as well as the persistent dilemma of "too many hands in the financial cookie jar," which raises medical costs for everyone.
     
    #11 poncho, Oct 7, 2013
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  12. Don

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    Please, by all means, share how the ACA has saved lives. I also encourage you to check out the San Jose news where supporters of the ACA received mail today informing them how much their insurance premiums have sky-rocketed (one ACA supporter stated that his has jumped to $10,000 a year).

    Your short-term vision with no regard for the long-term repercussions is disappointing.
     
  13. thisnumbersdisconnected

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    At the time the ACA was passed, the Dems had majorities in both the House and the Senate. The Republicans made no changes, because they couldn't. You're misrepresenting the truth. Epic fail.
     
  14. Don

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    Please educate us. What changes to the ACA did the Republicans make that substantially flawed the original that Pelosi said we didn't know what was in it, that we would have to pass the bill to find out what was in the bill?
     
  15. FollowTheWay

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    We fought a bloody war over State's rights 150 years ago. Do you want to do that again? I stand for the United States of America. What do you stand for?
     
  16. FollowTheWay

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    I have a friend who used to sing for the Metropolitan Opera and worked for Disney at 250K/yr. Then one day he fell down on concrete and was in a coma for 6 months. When he woke up he was paralyzed. Since then he's had $6M worth of operations. His Disney insurance shut him off (the Death Panel) and finally medicaid shut him down. He needed another operation to save his life. he wouldn't have gotten that except for the passage of ObamaCare.

    So, you want to murder him by taking away his only chance at survival?
     
  17. poncho

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    The states created the federal government and gave it limited power.

    Your arguement seems to be that the creation is greater than it's creator and has every right to eat it. The tenth amendment wasn't repealed when Lee surrendered to Lincoln's "48ers". The states have every right to tell feds to stuff it. Take a good look at how the feds are treating senior citizens and veterans right now. They've all been loyal to the United States their whole life. Look how they're being treated. It's shameful.

    If the feds will treat these loyal Americans like criminals or cattle they'll give your loyalty the same respect. Being "part of the team" ain't going to win you any special treatment.
     
    #18 poncho, Oct 8, 2013
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  18. FollowTheWay

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    My roommate in college went to Med school. Both he and his wife were doctors and practiced in a small town in VA. He retired at age 63 to his farm. What was killing him was the high cost of malpractice insurance and reduced Medicare payments. If the Republicans had cooperated with Obama we could have gotten a Medical care bill that addressed these and other concerns. Instead for totally political reasons they simply chose to oppose change rather than participate in it.
     
  19. poncho

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    Is that what Obama promised, a medical care bill that addressed all these problems? I got one question for you and I hope you think it over real careful.

    How many promises that Obama and the democrats made to you have they kept?

    Forget all the talking points and excuses. How many promises have they kept?
     

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