Obey Them That have Rule....

Discussion in '2000-02 Archive' started by JN1633, Dec 7, 2002.

  1. JN1633

    JN1633
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    Hebrews 13:17...Obey those that have the rule over you....Ok, I have been taught and have heard preached in IFB churches that this means...basically if your pastor tells you to do it, then you should do it and you will be right with God, for your pastor watches for your soul as the rest of the verse concludes.My personal experience does not hold this to be true but would be interested in hearing other opinions and scripture about this teaching....

    [ December 07, 2002, 12:09 PM: Message edited by: JN1633 ]
     
  2. Refreshed

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    Hmmm. My Bible says "obey," not "remember." Could this be part of the problem? That clears up whether we should obey or not, right? Oh, by the way, I don't believe this means you obey in sin. That would be a silly assumption.

    Just my 0.02$ worth.

    Jason
     
  3. JN1633

    JN1633
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    oops sorry...my bible says obey also, was trying to do two things at once which my wife tells me that men can't do.....I had the quote right in the topic heading...sorry
     
  4. Abiyah

    Abiyah
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    Be persuaded, not by submission but by belief,
    not by opinions or traditions. Be persuaded by
    the Word of God as explained by your teachers,
    because they watch for your natural life in the
    body.

    This tells me that I must first seek a place of
    worship in which I can fully trust the teachings
    of the leaders; when I have, then I must submit
    to the Bible as taught. The verse is not about
    a teacher/leader telling a person what to do, if
    it is not a Bible teaching.

    In other words, my leader may tell me not to
    steal, not to lie, not to commit adultery, to dress
    modestly, etc., and I must follow. But if that
    leader tells me what to do above and beyond
    these, it is not a biblical mandate that I must
    obey.

    For examples, leaders have overstepped their
    bounds to tell me I must do a particular job
    when I know it is not in the best interest for
    myself and my loved ones or not to do a parti-
    cular job if it does not go against the the Bible.
    Leaders may not demand that I wear particular
    things or not wear particular things, unless they
    can prove what they say by the Bible.

    In the past, I have been told to come to church
    while sick-wrong. I have been told I could not
    wear my wedding band--wrong. I have been
    told I could not take my children bowling in a
    family-oriented bowling alley--wrong. That I
    had to keep teaching in spite of total burn-out--
    wrong.

    This verse is applicable only to biblical teaching.
     
  5. Pastork

    Pastork
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    I agree with Abiyah (as usual). As a pastor I like always to remember Jesus' special instruction regarding leaders in the Church. Jesus called the disciples to Himself and said to them, "You know that those who are considered rulers over the Gentiles lord it over them, and their great ones exercise authority over them. Yet it shall not be so among you; but whoever desires to become great among you shall be your servant. And whoever of you who desires to be first shall be slave of all. For even the son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give His life a ransom for many" (Mark 10:41-45). In my opinion, any way in which a pastor seeks to require obedience to something not expressly given in Scripture is by definition "lording it over" his congregation. One of the most important things a pastor can teach his congregation is how to properly submit to the Scriptures alone as their absolute authority. Any time he seeks to increase his own authority beyond what Scripture clearly dictates is a heinous sin against the Body of Christ. Such a man is like "Diotrephes, who loves to have the preeminence among them" (3John9) and should be avoided.

    Pastork
     
  6. blackbird

    blackbird
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    Get into Bible Study with your pastor--listen to his preachin' and then obey God!

    Your friend,
    Blackbird
     
  7. Justified

    Justified
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    If your Pastor is obeying God's Word and following God's Will, then there is no problems! [​IMG]
     
  8. HeDied4U

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    Justified said...

    The key word here is IF. I have been in churches where the pastor isn't always obeying God, but "obeying" whatever is in his own head. In such cases, abuse inevitably follows. At least as far as I have observed. In any event, I would not follow whatever he suggests.

    God Bless!!!

    Adam [​IMG]
     
  9. Don

    Don
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    I have a friend who had the opportunity to listen to two pastors, from the same seminary background, talk about how they had to rule their congregations with an iron fist....
     
  10. Ransom

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    JN1633 said:

    Ok, I have been taught and have heard preached in IFB churches that this means...basically if your pastor tells you to do it, then you should do it and you will be right with God, for your pastor watches for your soul as the rest of the verse concludes.

    What if your pastor is teaching false doctrine, or tells you to do something immoral or illegal?

    To say that you must obey your pastor, no matter what, and you will still be right with God, is to say that the pastor's authority is greater than God's authority.

    Decide for yourself whether it is better to obey men rather than God (Acts 4:19).

    [ December 09, 2002, 11:22 AM: Message edited by: Ransom ]
     
  11. Wisdom Seeker

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    Actually I have heard it explained that we are to obey all who have the rule over us...that includes...Husband, Pastor, Employer, Police, Government. Do it all as to the Lord...not such a tall order when you think of it that way.

    I will add that I don't believe that it means to obey blindly...there are ways to change things...when they are not according to God.
     
  12. Johnv

    Johnv
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    Pastors are supposed to be teachers. If I wanted a pastor who was a general, I'd have joined my local Salvation Army.
     

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