OK, Govt. LIED, folks, LIED about jailed border agents

Discussion in '2008 Archive' started by LadyEagle, Feb 6, 2007.

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  1. LadyEagle

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  2. El_Guero

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    They broke the law and concealed evidence.

    Should they be in jail for more than 3 months - no.

    But, did they make a mistake bigger than a speeding ticket? Yes.


     
  3. Martin

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    I read that the guy who was put in jail has been assaulted by fellow prisoners. I have not followed this closely enough to know exactly what happened here however I am afraid that it is just another example of how this administration punishes those who are really trying to defend this country. People should not be thrown in prison for being too cautious nor for making a mistake in that context. If some jail time is required, because of technical laws etc, then they should be protected from other truly violent criminals. This I believe is common sense. The benefit of the doubt should be with the law enforcement officer (of whatever type) and not with the illegal immigrant or terrorist. George W Bush is no conservative. I am starting to get tired of my brothers and sisters in Christ supporting this president as if he is a conservative evangelical (he is not). He has given us NO reason to support him folks! We better wake up and stop being so easy to fool.
     
    #3 Martin, Feb 7, 2007
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  4. pinoybaptist

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    Broken laws ?
    I think at most what they had broken was their agency's regulations.
    I read somewhere that Border Patrol manuals simply say that discharge of firearms should be reported, either in writing, or verbally, to a supervisor.
    One or both ,of them did just that.
    And then again think about it.
    There were other Border Patrol agents involved in the chase, all of these heard gunfire, some of these testified to seeing the two discharging their firearms, therefore all of these agents, from Ramos and Compean to the other agents, were bound by what their manual directs: Report discharge of firearms to their supervisors.
    If the two go to jail charged with concealing a crime with non-report of incident as one of the factors, then all of them ought to be in jail.
    I don't know if there is a Texas law that says infraction of governmental agency rules constitute a State or Federal Crime.
    Anybody here know ?

    And then let's review the facts of this case:

    1. Ramos and Compean were Border Patrol agents of good standing for years;
    2. Aldrete-Davila is a known felon;
    3. Ramos and Compean were out there protecting the Border as their job requires;
    4. Aldrete Davila on the other hand was out there driving a van loaded with drugs worth a million dollars in the streets of America, and which destroy the fiber of our society - the youth;
    5. Ramos and Compean were law enforcers;
    6. Aldrete Davila was a criminal at most, a lawbreaker at best;
    7. Since Aldrete Davila was able to flee to Mexico nobody could state for
    sure whether or not he was armed at the time of the shooting, and if
    the two border patrol agents were justified or not in fearing for their
    own safety during the chase.

    Personally, I would think Aldrete-Davila did have a weapon on him of some kind. Maybe he had no intention of shooting it out with US law enforcers, but he'd be naive to be carrying that much load of dope worth that much money and not think other bad guys won't try to hijack him. Who does he think he is - the Godfather ?

    Those guys shouldn't be in jail.
    But, guess what, it looks like Aldrete Davila will even make money out of this.
    Last I heard, he's suing the US for violating his rights.
    His evidence ?
    Why, we just put those two law enforcers in jail, didn't we ?
     
  5. The Galatian

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    Last time I checked, altering evidence at a crime scene is a felony. A law enforcement officer lying on a report of of such an incident is a felony.

    I thought the sentences were too harsh, but they definitely deserved to be arrested and convicted.
     
  6. donnA

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    oh no, didn't you hear, thats only for some people, like us common folk, not law enforcement, law enforcement can do whatever they like, they aren't responsable......................:BangHead:
     
  7. The Galatian

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    Not this time, anyway...

    Personally, I thought the sentence was more severe than they deserved, but then I don't have all the facts.
     
  8. DeeJay

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    If there is new evidence that says these Agents DID report the shooting to their supervisor, and the supervisor advised to clean the crime scene. Then they should be let out of prison pending a new trial. The supervisors should be fired and possably tried criminaly.

    If (and it sounds like it happened) somebody from the department lied to congress and or to the court. They should be fired and put on trial. Border Patrol policy should be rewritten to make it absolutly clear that everything like this MUST be reported in writting.

    In any department I have ever known, You could not even use less-lethal weapons like OC (mace) or a batton without reporting in writting. If an officer failed to report ANY use of force they would be fired and probably tried for assault.
     
  9. DeeJay

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    LE
    You are putting more spin on this then Rush and Sean put together. When you say the Goverment lied, you mean that a (one) person from a department lied to congress (also the goverment) and another person from that same department cleared it up to the congress.

    You make it sound like a Goverment wide conspiricy to lie to the public. If that was the case they are doing a poor job of it. If the GOVERMENT lied we would not know about the information.
     
  10. Petra-O IX

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    Aldrete Davila was admitted to an Military hospital at El Paso after the incident with the agents. The bullet ddn't even match the weapons that were fired from the agents guns. There is talk about a Congressional Pardon for the two agents, if that is possible. I am ashamed of our government for not supporting these agents instead they are being unfairly punished for protecting citizens of the United States.
     
  11. 2 Timothy2:1-4

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    If these men were falsely convicted based on false evidence I doubt it could have occured by one single person. The fact that a criminal was given amnesty to testify against United States agents is in itself suspect. The whole thing just smells bad.
     
  12. pinoybaptist

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    Where was the crime scene ? Aldrete Davila wasn't there. He was in Mexico where I understand our FBI agents went to fetch him. The van was there, loaded with drugs, which Aldrete Davila was driving. Now that is a crime.
    So, they picked up their shell casings.
    So what ?
    Maybe they were going to load it again ?
    They did report the incident to their supervisor, the supervisor did not ask them for shell casings.
    Who knows if they would have turned over those shell casings if the supervisor had asked ?
    There are a lot of questions that come up here.
    Now, will somebody explain why Senators of the United States, or congressmen, have to file a request for the papers regarding this case thru the Freedom of Information Act ?
    This is beginning to smell rotten.
     
  13. Filmproducer

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    Just wanted to point out that he refused protective custody! The entire family was on Lou Dobbs last night, and the reason he was not in protective custody was so that he could have direct contact with his family. While his assault is a terrible thing, I'm sure the penal system would be able to better protect him if he would not have refused protective custody.
     
    #13 Filmproducer, Feb 7, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 7, 2007
  14. LadyEagle

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    That's right. That's why I said our government LIED. The whole thing has been fishy from the get go. Now, the government agency has testified before Congress and funny thing, some of the so-called evidence they supposedly had has never come forth, even though they have had months. Which means there probably wasn't any to begin with and the whole thing has been trumped up. I remember a former Congressman from Ohio who had a bunch of trumped up stuff against him and he is still in the pen. It's not the first time our government has corrupt people working in it who have biases and are out to get somebody and succeed.
     
  15. DeeJay

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    NO, They are police officers. EVERYTHING about their training says preserve a crime scene. To pick up shell caseings is so much against there training that it alone is evidence to me that something was wrong. NOW if there supervisors told them to then there supervisors are covering up the incident. Maybe out or lazyness not wanting to do paperwork.

    As to the reloading. They are law enforcement officers, Not duck hunters.


    With what is comming out now. It seems the supervisors wanted to burry the incident. Again Cops dont pick up shell casings.

    Again you have Police and duck hunters confused. Cops dont remove evidence from crime scenes. This will destroy any case against the suspect.
     
  16. pinoybaptist

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    The crime scene. Where is the crime scene ?
    There is no crime scene.
    Picture cops chasing bank robbers in a 15 mile highway, firing their guns at the robbers' car's tires.
    So, you got a 15 mile crime scene ?

    Where is the crime scene ?
    Who are the criminals, and who are the victims ?
    Aldrete Davila is the criminal here, not the Border Patrol guys.
    Aldrete Davila is the one who drove the crime vehicle here into the US from Mexico, not Ramos and Compean.
    Aldrete Davila is the one who ran away from pursuing law officers, not the other way around.
     
  17. LadyEagle

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  18. donnA

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    apparently we all think it's ok for some people to commit crimes. now we just have to figure out which ones.
     
  19. DeeJay

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    If..When that happens the entire 15 mile strech would be shut down and pictures of the shell casings would be take they would be collected by evidence the cars would be photographed and towed, interviews of the wittness done and the crime would be reported. THEN the crime scene would be relesed and opened. IT happens just like this everywhere in America everyday.

    This happened last year here in SLC where they shut down something like 25 miles of highway becasue of a shooting between gangs.

    Now lets look at your synerio and imagin this. THe Police Officer witness a bank robbery in progress. He chases the robber for 15 miles shooting his weapon, but fails to stop the robber. SO he picks up his casings and does not tell anybody. SOUND RIGHT. no.

    [/quote]
     
  20. DeeJay

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    http://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/nij/178280.pdf

    This is from the National Institute of Justice. They are considered the authority for departemnts when making policy. The policys they institute are considered the standard for law enforcement and the courts use their policys to determin if a departments policy is a good one or not.

    The last quote establishes where and what is a crime scene. Yes it could include a 15 mile strech of highway.



     
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