Pastors verses the media

Discussion in '2006 Archive' started by El_Guero, Sep 29, 2006.

  1. El_Guero

    El_Guero
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    Pastors verses the media.

    It was stated by a news media professional that Pastor Roloff was guilty of criminal behavior. I have never heard of any information that Brother Roloff was involved in illegal behavior. However, that led me to my OP and this question:

    Should we as Christians trust reporters that make their living making news more than we trust the Men of God that are paid to lead our churches? Is it OK for a news reporter to blame a Man of God for the offenses that someone under him committed? At what point does 'news' become slander?
     
  2. Grasshopper

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    First of all, is “man of God” even a scriptural term? Secondly, why do you assume the reporter isn’t a “man of God”? Thirdly, criminal behavior has a paper trail. It would easily be verified.



    Again, what is this “Man of God”? Who determines it? Was Jimmy Swaggert a “Man of God’? Am I a “Man of God”? Are you?

    If you hired someone and he commits a crime related to his employment are you in some way responsible? I think it depends on the circumstances.



    I guess when it is presented as truth when the reporter knows it is false. Slander is a legal term and has a definition.
     
  3. bapmom

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    Personally I don't trust the news over the word of any pastor....not right off the bat at least. There's got to be a significant paper trail, and more than one witness.

    Ive heard too many reporters make statements that I know are false, or in the least they portray things as fact when it cannot be proven.

    I also think it would be a very rare case when we could legitimately blame a pastor for the actions of those under him. Looking at the secular business world, we don't blame the CEO when an employee steals from a bank, right?
     
  4. El_Guero

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    Very good post!

    What got me started was the implication that Pastor Roloff was guilty because some of his employees were guilty . . . guilt by association . . . just really makes me sick.

    Guilt by conviction needs to be punished, but slander should be a crime as well - IMHO.

     
    #4 El_Guero, Oct 2, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 2, 2006
  5. rsr

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    News media professional covers a lot. Unfortunately, many in the profession are opinionists, not news reporters.

    Depends on their credibilty. Some yes, some no. During the Jim Bakker mess at PTL, for example, I think it's fair to say The Charlotte Observer was far more accurate than Bakker and his shills. Same with Robert Tilton, Benny Hinn, Paul Crouch, etc.

    Depends. Was it a one-time offense or was there a long-term pattern of offenses that the MoG should have noticed?

    Generally, slander or libel consists of disseminating "facts" that are not true that damage someone's reputation. Truth is an absolute defense in such cases, and some people have such poor reputations that they are virtually impossible to defame (Saddam comes to mind.)

    A related, but separate, action can be taken if the facts are true but are taken out of context and thus place the victim in a false light.

    For a public figure to successfully bring a slander or libel case, he or she must prove that the malefactor either knew the information was false or acted with disregard to the truth of the information.

    In addition, it is impossible to slander or libel a dead person. Just the way the law is.
     
  6. John Ellwood Taylor

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  7. Grasshopper

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  8. John Ellwood Taylor

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    Look at the Scrpitures listed and see if you can determine by it's usage what it means. If you don't want to look at all 73 instances may I suggest:
    Deut 33:1 of Moses
    The 1 Kings 13 reference to aone who speaks the word of the LORD
    2 Kings 1:10 of Elijah
    2 Kings 5:8 of Elisha
    2 Chronicles 8:14 of David
    2 Chronicles 11:12 of Shemiah who spoke the word of the LORD
    in the "Pastoral' epistles Paul disignates Timothy by this title 1 Tim 6:11
    2 Timothy 3:17 as well.

    It appears to me this is a special title used to designate thsoe who spoke the word of God.
    Today we call these men "Pastors/Elders".

    What do you think?
     
  9. Grasshopper

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    Then I think every Christian is a "man of God".
     
  10. El_Guero

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    Sounds like you are gonna wiggle women into the role of pastor even if the conversation starts with 'men of God' . . .

    Can we define men as males of the human race? Or is that too generic?
     
  11. Grasshopper

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    I happen to believe women can speak the Word of God and not be a pastor. Perhaps I'm just a liberal but it seems that anyone can open up their Bible and speak the Word of God. I don't need a preacher(none of whom agree with each other 100%) to tell me what the Word of God is.

    So relative to your post, "Man of God" means pastor.

    "Should we as Christians trust reporters that make their living making news more than we trust the Men of God that are paid to lead our churches?"

    Is a Man of God less likely to lie than just an ordinary Christian reporter?
     
  12. Scott J

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    We should prove all things and hold to that which is true.

    Neither pastors nor reporters are above conveniently distorting the truth... though I'd say its more standard fare for reporters.
     
  13. rsr

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    I have found it otherwise. But that's just me.
     
  14. North Carolina Tentmaker

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    I don’t know that it would be “very rare.” In a simple case of theft of course we would not blame the CEO. But, if the theft was covered up or if there were longstanding cases of criminal behavior that the CEO allowed to continue then yes, we have and do blame the CEO.

    Good examples of this are the cover-up of sexual abuse by Catholic priests or the emails Mark Foley sent to pages.

    Do I blame the Pope or the Vatican leadership because one priest assaults a young boy somewhere? Of course I do not. Do I blame them if for 40 years or more they cover the assault up, allow other assaults to happen, pay off witnesses to keep them quiet, and move the priest in question out of the country to avoid prosecution? Yes, then I do blame them.

    Do I blame the entire republican leadership of the U. S. house because Mark Foley sent some perverted emails to an underage page? No, but if they knew about it and covered it up that substantially changes the situation.

    When a pastor has a crime committed in is church by a staff member or volunteer he assumes great responsibilities. Certainly there can be cases where although they did nothing wrong personally to begin with by their inaction or blind eye they can inherit considerable legal and civil responsibility.
     
  15. El_Guero

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    Great post with alot of meat!
     
  16. John of Japan

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    Except for the part about trying to turn a "man of God" into a "woman of God." :laugh: :laugh:

    The term occurs only twice in the NT, both times to Pastor Timothy: 1 Tim. 6:11 and 2 Tim. 3:17. In both cases they refer to a man--a male--the masculine side of humanity! I defy anyone at all to find a single place in 73 times the phrase occurs in the Bible (thanks, John Ellwood Taylor) where "man of God" can refer to a woman. I think I'll fire up my Power Bible program and look (if JET doesn't mind me adding just a little to his good research). Let me see, in addition to the NT phrase applied to Timothy, we have: Moses, an angel, Samuel, Shemaiah, Elijah (many times), Elisha (many times), David, the interesting Igdaliah (in Jer. 35:4) and the occasional unnamed male prophet (such as in 1 Kings 13). Nope, no women in there! :tongue3:
     
  17. North Carolina Tentmaker

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    I don't think the focus of this thread was the possibility of women filling the role of pastor. Regardless of how you feel about woman pastors (I don't think its biblical by the way) there are some ministries (woman's ministries, children's ministries, homes for runaway girls/unwed mothers, schools, preschools, camps, etc.) that can be lead biblically by women. In these cases as administrator those women do take on responsibility for those ministries very much like a pastor does.
     
  18. El_Guero

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    The directions that threads can go . . .

    Pastors versus the media?
     
  19. Bartimaeus

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    Allegations are one thing, convictions are another.
    Was Lester Roloff ever convicted of any offense?
    If not, then why give him a trial here by allegations and incidents that occurred before and after his death?

    I know this... I was there. Bro Roloff was given hard cases that no one else wanted. Hard cases that the State of Texas couldn't and wouldn't deal with. A few of the boys and girls would slit your throat in the middle of the night if they had a knife and could get away with it. They were considered incorrigable. Yes, he was a hard man. A man that used corporal punishment yet a man that preached the Word of God. Don't forget about the multiple hundreds of young people who came through and went out saved, healed in spirit and soul and went on to be useful to the Lord and good citizens. Don't forget about the multiple hundreds of adult men and women who came through the Roloff Ministries and went out saved, healed in spirit and soul and went on to be useful to the Lord and good citizens. It was supposed to be Christian Boot Camp because of the hardness of their hearts and attitudes.

    Secondly.....the average IFB church today touts Lester Roloff as one of the IFB heros. His postion on the civil magistrate would burn the hides off the average IFB pastor. He would kick the CLA (Gibbs) and other groups that preach entaglement through the goal posts of life and seal it with sound Bible preaching. He was too strong for the average IFB preacher when he was alive and then after he's dead they want to honor him, WHAT A JOKE! If he were alive today he wouldn't even step a foot into their churches.

    Thanks Bartimaeus/Ky/Look Away!
     

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