Perseverance of the Saints - denied?

OR- we could just admit that these words are found nowhere in Scripture, and for both "Cs" and "As", this is a theological construct, and save time!

Ed

 

Or we admit there are contridictory statements in the Bible - fat chance of that!

 

OR!!!
You could quit misrepresenting Con# 2.

 

Sorry Brother BobRyan, but if one understands the element of
Greek Logic called (in Latin probably?) Reducto Absurdum,
then one will see that both Peter & Paul (an probably Mary
also ) taught Security of the Beleiver AKA: Perservation
of the Saints, AKA: Once Saved, Always Saved (OSAS).

And these two passage are the PROOF TEXTS for
Security of the Beleiver AKA: Perservation
of the Saints, AKA: Once Saved, Always Saved (OSAS)

 

How sad. How tragic. How flawed, to believe that I must persevere in order to be saved. How utterly contrary to scripture. How can anyone continue to struggle in that quicksand? How devastating to the newly born-again babe in Christ, to be told "It is only by your effort that you can continue in God's grace. Christ and the Cross weren't sufficient. Sorry."

"How will I know that I am not perservering?"

"You can't know. You'll just have to stand before God one day. He'll let you know."

How disgusting.

 

it sounds to me like you have to do something...


2 Peter 1:
1: Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:
2: Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord,
3: According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
4: Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
5: And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;
6: And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;
7: And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.
8: For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
9: But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.
10: Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:
11: For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

 

Bob Ryan can distort scripture 24/7/365 from now 'til Jesus comes, and it will still be distortion. He and Ellen White simply don't get it. It is all of grace, none of us.

 

Forget about Ellen White, what about what Peter said in the Bible?

Does this sound like it doesnt matter what we do?

2Peter 1:
1: Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:
2: Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord,
3: According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
4: Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
5: And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;
6: And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;
7: And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.
8: For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
9: But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.
10: Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:
11: For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

 

Please point out one verse in your reference which proclaims that I must perservere
in order to gain or retain eternal life. I promise you, you won't find it.

 

We perservere because we are saved;
NOT 'we are saved because we perservere'.

Jesus did/does the plerservering!!!

 

I think we could take all of Bob Ryan's scripture references, change them from the conditional quality he uses in applying them, to just the opposite. Where he questions the validity of OSAS, the scriptures he quotes attest to its truth. It's like conversation. In conversation, the tone of voice, the inflection, can change the meaning entirely. In the written Word, black ink on white paper, one discerns the meaning, the truth of each reference, spiritually.

When that fails, when readers fail to understand that, we get 300,000 denominations, along with a sizeable group of modern-day prophets who trot out their "new revelation." In the final analysis, the church of Jesus Christ is to be one in Him. That isn't going to happen when readers of scripture use their own intelligence to sort it all out, rather than the spiritual discernment offered by Christ.

:jesus: paid it all, all to Him I owe, sin had left a crimson stain, He washed it white as snow.

 

Spelling correction:

 

HP: How about this text? Col 1:21 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled
22 In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:
23 IF ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;

 

HP: We do not persevere on the account of our salvation. Perseverance is not an automatic result of coming to faith in Christ. We are admonished to continue in the faith in order to be found in Him in the last day. “If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;”

Of a truth, no one will persevere without the aide of the Holy Spirit, but just the same, perseverance involves voluntary acts of the will, formed intents, in agreement with obedience as required by salvations demands. We will not persevere ‘for the sake of our obedience,’ but neither will we persevere ‘apart from’ our willful obedience.

The shed blood of Christ is the only grounds of salvation and perseverance, but that in no way excludes our willful obedience from being required. That which God requires out of us for salvation or perseverance is always thought of in the sense of ‘not without which,’ not ‘that for the sake of.’ We will not persevere ‘for the sake of our obedience,’ as if our obedience is in any way seen as being meritorious in nature, but neither will we be saved apart from our willing obedience.

When you remove the element of man's voluntary formation of intents from the equation, you end up no where short of pure determinism.

 

Psa 2:11 Serve the LORD with fear, and rejoice with trembling.

1Co 2:3 And I was with you in weakness, and in fear, and in much trembling.

2Co 7:15 And his inward affection is more abundant toward you, whilst he remembereth the obedience of you all, how with fear and trembling ye received him.

Eph 6:5 Servants, be obedient to them that are your masters according to the flesh, with fear and trembling, in singleness of your heart, as unto Christ

Phi 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

 

Eph 6:18 Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;