Separate names with a comma.
Discussion in 'Politics' started by LadyEagle, May 19, 2008.
New York Times Op-Ed:
Snipped.... Interesting Read...
One cannot be an apostate from a religion which they never followed.
I read this article earlier today. And I don't think either way it matter if was a muslim or not, (for the purposes of this topic, not the election). No matter what he does on this topic as president it won't work out well for him. Muslims consider him muslim, because in their culture religion is passed down through the father, his father was muslim, in Islam it means he is muslim. Now he either favors them, and it looks bad, or he doesn't favor them and it goes bad. If he doesn't favor them(which I doubt since he has said he would), it could go bad for our country again.
Either way, it might be bad. he's in a real mess on this one, and in this one, with the muslims, it doesn't matter what the truth is. they, like so many here, beleive what they want to believe.
Wasn't there the claim by him on a school record of being muslim?
No, I have
No, I have not read of such.
So what? He is running for president of the United States, not for the kingship of Saudi Arabia.
So what? If he was, and I did read that he was, from his primary school record, he would still be considered such, and subject to Muslim law, in the eyes of Islam. That's what......There is far too much bad baggage in his life, more so than even hillary, and I'm still amazed that the general population and more particularly some in the Christian community that will bend over backward in his support.
He was enrolled in two schools in Indonesia that listed his religion as "Islam".
There has been another op/ed with the same title as the one the OP linked to:
I have no idea if he is or isn't an Islamic apostate - on another board, some imam told me he couldn't be unless he had practiced Islam as an adult. It is a serious matter, apostasy is what got Anwar Sadat assasinated back in the 1970s.
BTW, for someone who obtained his office without opposition: for some one who has no significant accomplishment: his 'success' and rise is astonishing..... or else he's the puppet of successful promotions backing his ascendance.
I don't consider his background and heritage an accident: Nor his confusion of religion or identity: nor the promotion to positions by others and not personal accomplishment: nor his disregard for Israel: Principalities and powers working behind the scenes....I strongly suspect..... his meteoric popularity and power of persuasion, without really saying anything of substance, to account for the faith of those in him who follow him..... as though under 'a spell'......
I know this is not objective, but I suspect evil behind him. I hope he's not 'sold out to the devil'.
No, it's space aliens. He sold his soul to space aliens!!
As do I...
I do not see the logic in this at all. Let's say that my father was a member of a crazy deluded religous cult which held to the belief that any children born into that cult cannot renounce their cult status.
Does this mere declaration somehow deprive me of my free will to forge my own way in the world, including renouncing membership in that cult? Of course not.
Likewise, Mr. Obama's values, mindset, and religious affiliation are in no way determined by some "rule" that makes the absurd declaration that if you are born a muslim, you cannot renounce the beliefs of Islam.
Remember you are dealing with hyper-right-wing republicans here. <edited out>.
Actually I'm following the instruction of my master who admonishes 'broad is the way to destruction and many that follow: but narrow is the path and few there be that find which leads to life everlasting.'. If he is a muslim or not....it is not my business; I do feel that he is without excuse regarding which god he has allegiance to. However, when someone rises to position without personal accomplishment..... it is by a power or wind behind the sailing of their kite: whether it is of good or whether it is of evil.......I have no ability to judge except by their works and by the testimony and lives of those who follow them.....and also the popularity of the masses........ Jesus was recognized early in his youth as having favor with God and man and yet had no or little recognition among the noteriety of his day: Contrast this with all persecuted Christians and all the apostles: Their experience confirmed the resistance of the world and its followers, particularly of those in power, to the submission to the God who created the world and in whose hands they committed their lives.
Obama? Well, I don't see any promotion of his own personal statis as a significant personal accomplishment of God's favor or Obama's talent and skill..... and when watching those who so readily promote him, I find myself totally and completely unimpressed by the spiritual creditials and life style/testimony which he and they possess.
It seems clear to me there is an evil wind behind his sails..... I cannot define any better or attempt to justify my personal conviction: I leave that for others more astute than I. I cannot lose consciouness of the fact that we fight not against flesh and blood ......but against principalities, and powers in high places....... And the aspiring for ruling power (or government office) in this world is beyond mere talent, knowledge, experience, accomplishment, recognition and support: The position of power in office represents the spiritual condition of the people who promote and support them in power: It is deeper than the flesh. It is a matter of spiritual condition as to whom we are drawn to and support and bring to power.
I'm not persuaded that Obama knows what and in whom he believes and entrusts the keeping of his soul: I have yet to be persuaded by any other, that he has made such revelation to them: Until such, I don't know who is his master, but can be almost certain beyond doubt, who it is not..... regardless of a few sacrificial words of appeasement which leave questions open. Jesus, himself, said 'Not everyone who says Lord, Lord, will enter the kingdom of heaven......but" ......now fill in the blank! Are we doing the will of Jesus' Father?
Apostate to Islam is not my concern: Relationship to God is. In the latter is significance.
There are people who think he may be the AC.
Is the point being made that he is more likely to be assassinated in office because radical muzlims consider it their obligation to kill the apostate, and it's their opinion, not his, that determines that he is one? If so, bear in mind they have not been successful in more 9-11 type terrorist activities in 7 1/2 years.
Yes, that is the point exactly. True, no more successful terrorist attacks on American soil, but there have been in a lot of other places such as Great Britain and France and a President Apostate could be more of a target for a potential hit than an infidel President during world travel.
Yes, what I wonder is if he's an apostate toMuslims - I get conflicted answers, but if they think he is in apostasy, he'll need extra security.
Quite a few, but I'm not among them. He DOES fufill some of the requrements for an Anti-Christ:
1.- He will come as a man of Peace (Obama promises peace in Iraq)
2.- He will come mounted on a white mare(Obama mother is white who had African husbands)
3.- He will come to deceive( Obama says he's a Christian but in fact he was born a Muslim, and practices Gnostic Christianity at best)
4.- He will make himself the most powerful man on earth, if elected.
5.- He will try to destroy the Jewish People and Israel( foreign policy again )
6.- He will present himself as good and righteous but in fact he's Satan himself.
The Anti-Christ is also supposed to have some Jewish and/or Muslim blood. And then he does reside in the "60606" zipcode, but he wasn't even born there, and thousands of other people live there as well.
He's waaaaaaaaaay too transparent (to me) to be the AC - very few are supposed to be able to "know" it when they see him, his charisma would be greater if he were, and if he had the Mark of the Beast on his and or forehead, it would be known all over. So, nah.
There are people who would say anything against Senator Obama in order to hurt his chances at election.
People would would proclaim that are guilty of guesswork, conjecture, and sensationalist fear mongering.
There are PLENTY of substantive reasons not to vote for Senator Obama, why are they so rarely addressed? Why this stuff over and over?