Prophecy concerning Israel

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Jedi Knight, Jun 29, 2010.

  1. Jedi Knight

    Jedi Knight
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    1946 Israel was "reborn" as a nation. What scripture in the Old or New Testement points to this as a fufillment and "Israel" being mentioned as part end time events or second coming. Over the years I have hear some pastors or bible teachers quoting Zechariah 12:10 "They will look on me, the one they have pierced,", as the end time when Israel will see Jesus......BUT I see in the gospel of John "John himself" mentioned this scripture as fufilled John 19:37 "and, as another scripture says, "They will look on the one they have pierced." while Jesus was on the cross. So is this a DOUBLE prophecy? Bad interpetation "not intentionally" by some readers?
     
    #1 Jedi Knight, Jun 29, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 29, 2010
  2. ReformedBaptist

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    I'm no good at these things yet, but I have the same questions. I do know that those who see Israel today as a fulfilllment of prophecy are in the camp of the futurists. I am not.
     
  3. thegospelgeek

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    Is 11:11

    Ez 36:24
     
  4. thegospelgeek

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    Not to be picky but it was May14, 1948 4:00 PM Israeli Time
     
  5. RAdam

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    Neither of those verses refer to the formation of the modern nation of Israel.
     
  6. Jedi Knight

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    Ok,the wheels were turning...right? :tongue3:
     
  7. thegospelgeek

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    I didn't say they were. They may and they might not. I just put them out there because people I know who are into such things think they do. Personnally, I do not really know.
     
  8. thegospelgeek

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    The only reason I knew was I had just finished a book about it a few weeks ago. Give it another month or so and I won't know.
     
  9. thegospelgeek

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    Out of curiosity, what do they refer to?
     
  10. Jedi Knight

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    lol funny! Well I see people with more "eyes wide open" to what might be going on in the world today. Some "even unbelievers" point to Israel being back in the land is on the "Top 10 List" of signs.

    :jesus:
     
  11. RAdam

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    Both texts are ultimately speaking of spiritual redemption by Jesus Christ.

    Isaiah 11:11 is referring to the days of Christ and the ingathering of His people to the gospel church.

    Ezekiel 36:24 is using the return from Babylonian captivity to prefigure redemption by Christ. This is seen by the verses that come directly after verse 24.
     
  12. thegospelgeek

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    No doubt Ez 36 prefigures Christ, but there is nothing that prevents it also reffering to the Jews who return to Christ in the latter days as some say.
     
  13. thegospelgeek

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    One of many questions I have about this is;

    Is the nation of Israel formed in 1948 a fulfillment of prophesy or is it an attempt of man to fulfill prophesy? Maybe Israel will fall only to be formed again at a later date. As you can tell I have many more question regarding Bible prophesy than I have answers. My only solid opinion on eschalogical (sp) views is that I feel many more have it wrong than have it correct.
     
  14. RAdam

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    The problem with that notion is that nation over there hasn't turned to Christ. They are a thoroughly secular nation.
     
  15. thegospelgeek

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    For those who consider this a fullfillment of Ez 36, it is only the first step in the process that will bring them to Christ. They do not claim that the return of Is. is a completed work as of yet.
     
  16. RAdam

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    Here's a big problem for them. Who is Israel? Who are Jews today? They are not the same race they were 2,000 years ago. They have been intermingled with other peoples, their geneologies are destroyed. Who are the Jews who are going to come to Christ? I've never been satisfied on that.
     
  17. Pastor Larry

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    Zech 12:10 has two parts: (1) they will look on me (2) whom they pierced.

    John 19:37 references only one of the parts, right? (Look at it ... It does ... They "pierced him.")

    The second part (actually the first) is found in Rev 1 where it says, "Revelation 1:7 BEHOLD, HE IS COMING WITH THE CLOUDS, and every eye will see Him, even those who pierced Him; and all the tribes of the earth will mourn over Him. So it is to be. Amen. "

    Clearly, the two parts are not fulfilled at the same time because in John 19, they didn't "mourn over him." That won't happen until his second coming.

    As for the events of 1948, I don't think it has much relevance to prophecy since the prophecies of Israel concern the physical descendants of Israel. This is the consistent testimony from Gen right on through. There are too many passages to list here, but it is inescapable as one reads the OT that the people who were evicted from the land will be the same people who are restored to it under their King, Jesus.
     
  18. just-want-peace

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    That's because you are trying to understand through human intellect!
    Do you think God cannot tell who are Jews & who isn't?
    Even in the old days, many non-Jews lived in Israel, so them being there today is no conflict.

    What other nation has "been destroyed, ceased to exist for ~ 2K years, and been re-birthed" as the same nation (ethnically) again.

    Throughout the scriptures Israel is "God's Chosen" whether we like it, understand it, or comprehend it, so just because you aren't "satisfied" on that, (or any of us for that matter don't "get it"), doesn't deter God from accomplishing it.

    Bolded mine
     
  19. RAdam

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    Israel hasn't been rebirthed as a nation. That nation may have the same name but it has no relation to OT Israel, at least not right now. Look at it. The temple mount is dominated by Muslims. The Israelis are in spiritual darkness, unable to understand even the most basic Messiniac prophecies. That is a nation, not built by God, but by man.
     
  20. Winman

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    Many Jews are actively preparing and seeking to rebuild the temple right now. You would be amazed if you actually studied it out, they have been making all the temple vessels for years, stunningly beautiful.

    http://signsofthelastdays.com/archi...-censors-for-the-coming-rebuilt-jewish-temple

    http://www.templeinstitute.org/bezichin.htm

    http://www.templemountfaithful.org/index.htm

    This is just one of many sites you can find on the subject. You may not believe the Jews are going to rebuild the temple, but the Jews themselves do believe.

    Here is a photo gallery of many of the temple vessels the Jews have already made in preparation of the temple to be rebuilt.

    http://www.templeinstitute.org/vessels_gallery_a1.htm
     
    #20 Winman, Jun 30, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 30, 2010

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