Qualified to preach?

Discussion in '2000-02 Archive' started by Kevin Brown, Oct 19, 2001.

  1. Kevin Brown

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    Is it possible for a man of God be called to preach when he is married to a woman who was once divorced (due to infidelity) and this being his only marriage? I know what the Bible says as far as both being adulterers. But I do not see that applying to preaching if it is the mans only marriage. Now obviously this would be a mute point if the man had been divorced. Am I seeing this correctly or am I missing something? Please help. :confused:
     
  2. Joey M

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    I personaly believe it is possible, though many baptist churches have a blanket rule on this matter and it may be hard for you to find one that would allow it.

    God speed.
     
  3. ellis

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    Matthew 5:32 grants a divorcee an exception from committing adultery in a new marriage if the divorce was for the reason of marital unfaithfulness on behalf of the other partner. This sounds like it applies to your case. If the man has never married, and the woman divorced her first husband because he was unfaithful toward her, then there's not a problem.

    Personally, I think the forgiveness of sin and restoration of the sinner takes care of divorce on any level. If two people marry, even if they've been divorced, and become Christians after their marriage, and remain faithful to each other from that point on, I believe that the Bible's teaching on forgiveness of sin erases their previous marriages and sins, and that there is no barrier to either one of them serving in the church, including the vocational pastoral ministry. They've been justified and sanctified and made as new, and their sins have been forgotten by God.
     
  4. Psalm145 3

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Is it possible for a man of God be called to preach when he is married to a woman who was once divorced (due to infidelity) and this being his only marriage? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    No! No man who commits adultery is called by God to be a Pastor.

    Luke 16:18 Whosoever putteth away his wife, and marrieth another, committeth adultery: and whosoever marrieth her that is put away from her husband committeth adultery.

    Romans 7:2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
    Romans 7:3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.

    The only time a person who has been married is free to marry another is after their mates death.

    1 Corinthians 7:39 The wife is bound by the law as long as her husband liveth; but if her husband be dead, she is at liberty to be married to whom she will; only in the Lord.

    God's Word is clear in these verses. I don't care what John MacArthur, Charles Stanley, Chuck Swindoll or any other "New Evangelical" preacher says; it is clear there is to be no remarriage until mates death.

    Many people read Matthew 5:32 and Matthew 19:9 and think it means there's an exception to this rule because it says "saving for the cause of fornication" and "except it be for fornication..." but we must remember we should never contradict a clear teaching of Scripture by passages that are not as clear. In these verses, Jesus was talking about the Jewish betrothal period where they were considered "married" before the actual marriage. In the case of fornication during this betrothal period the innocent party was free to marry another. This is not the case when people are actually married and divorced.

    This should be a strong warning to anyone thinking about getting married. Marriage is for life! So you'd better choose your mate well, and meditate on those words "'til death do us part" because if your mate leaves you, you are NOT FREE TO REMARRY!

    I know there are many people who are in this situation, but thank God that sins can be forgiven, praise the Lord! Even though they can be forgiven it still disqualifies them for the position of Pastor or Deacon.

    1 Timothy 3:2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife...
     
  5. Pastor Larry

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Psalm145 3:
    The only time a person who has been married is free to marry another is after their mates death.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Except when Paul says, "Are you bound to a wife? Do not seek to be released. Are you released from a wife? Do not seek a wife. But if you marry, you have not sinned; and if a virgin marries, she has not sinned." (1 Cor 7:27-28).

    Clearly, you have not considered all of Scripture.

    Did you know that God commanded divorce in some instances? It clearly cannot be all wrong all the time if God commanded it. I am not suggesting that any of those situations apply today. I am simply pointing out that your blanket statements do not correlate with the revelation we have on the matter. Paul is clear that when a person is divorced they are not bound (1 Cor 7:15). We can discuss what that means but it is perfectly consistent to say that he is not bound to be single, especially in light of vv. 27-28 where Paul specifically says that those who have been released from marriage are not sinning if they remarry. The command that it is better to marry than to burn does not only apply in some cases. It applies in all cases.

    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>In these verses, Jesus was talking about the Jewish betrothal period where they were considered "married" before the actual marriage. In the case of fornication during this betrothal period the innocent party was free to marry another. This is not the case when people are actually married and divorced. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    This is not as clear as you would like it to be. There is good reason to believe that this is not the case.

    As for the original question, it depends on a number of factors such as time, location, church, etc. In most cases, probably not but I would not make a blanket statement about it.
     
  6. John Wells

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    Thank you Pastor Larry. You are absolutely correct. Back to ZBC's question: I agree with Joey that even though scripture says what Pastor Larry brought out, many churches hold the standard higher than the Bible does.

    If you truly feel called, and I think that if it's genuinely from God you will KNOW IT and not just think/feel it, then you must be prepared after seminary, to experience rejection from some pastor search committees. God bless and lead you in all truth!

    [ October 20, 2001: Message edited by: John Wells ]
     
  7. ellis

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Psalm145 3:


    No! No man who commits adultery is called by God to be a Pastor.

    Luke 16:18 Whosoever putteth away his wife, and marrieth another, committeth adultery: and whosoever marrieth her that is put away from her husband committeth adultery.

    Romans 7:2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
    Romans 7:3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.

    The only time a person who has been married is free to marry another is after their mates death.

    1 Corinthians 7:39 The wife is bound by the law as long as her husband liveth; but if her husband be dead, she is at liberty to be married to whom she will; only in the Lord.

    God's Word is clear in these verses. I don't care what John MacArthur, Charles Stanley, Chuck Swindoll or any other "New Evangelical" preacher says; it is clear there is to be no remarriage until mates death.

    Many people read Matthew 5:32 and Matthew 19:9 and think it means there's an exception to this rule because it says "saving for the cause of fornication" and "except it be for fornication..." but we must remember we should never contradict a clear teaching of Scripture by passages that are not as clear. In these verses, Jesus was talking about the Jewish betrothal period where they were considered "married" before the actual marriage. In the case of fornication during this betrothal period the innocent party was free to marry another. This is not the case when people are actually married and divorced.

    This should be a strong warning to anyone thinking about getting married. Marriage is for life! So you'd better choose your mate well, and meditate on those words "'til death do us part" because if your mate leaves you, you are NOT FREE TO REMARRY!

    I know there are many people who are in this situation, but thank God that sins can be forgiven, praise the Lord! Even though they can be forgiven it still disqualifies them for the position of Pastor or Deacon.

    1 Timothy 3:2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife...
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Your interpretation of "scripture" is seriously flawed.

    First of all, the criterion by which all scripture is to be interpreted is Jesus. If you'd like a list of supporting scriptures for that, I'd be most happy to oblige. If Jesus sets an interpretive standard, then other scripture must reconcile to that standard. That is the interpretive mark by which "scripture interprets itself".

    Second, there is absolutely no evidence to support your claim that what Jesus was talking about dealt exclusively with betrothal. Certainly in the culture of the day, betrothal was as serious a promise as marriage, but the definitions are still the same.

    If we apply your interpretive methods to the Bible, then we will have a Bible that is absolutely full of contradictions. Evidence this board and all of the detailed, fragmented turns and dips that those who post must go through to argue their point in the face of most of the rest who find some way to disagree, except for the few who have been taught the same error.

    The Bible clearly and absolutely teaches us that when our sin is forgiven, God remembers it no more. It is thrown as far as the east is from the west. Therefore, it cannot interfere in a calling to ministry.

    Hold to the standard of the Bible, not to some church that has lettered, literalized and legalized a faith that was not intended to be done that way.
     
  8. ellis

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Joey M:
    I personaly believe it is possible, though many baptist churches have a blanket rule on this matter and it may be hard for you to find one that would allow it.

    God speed.
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    It may be hard to find a particular kind of Baptist church that would allow it. However, I've met many spirit-filled, effective, God-directed, God-blessed men in the ministry who were called to serve by the Holy Spirit at a later age in life because they didn't even become Christians until adulthood. Many of these men were divorced because before they came to Christ they didn't know what it meant to respect the sanctity of marriage. Now they have been restored to full fellowship with God and are able to respond to the call that he has placed on their life. His blessing on their ministry is obvious. Yes, all of them are Baptist.

    Don't let the angry frustrations of some of these self-appointed legalists who are mad at everything discourage you. If God has placed a genuine call to service in your life, there will be a place for you to serve, you can count on it.
     
  9. Joey M

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Don't let the angry frustrations of some of these self-appointed legalists who are mad at everything discourage you. If God has placed a genuine call to service in your life, there will be a place for you to serve, you can count on it. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Ellis, are you in some way refering to me, seeing you quoted me?
    If so, I said nothing of the sort. I know of some divorced pastors taht I believe are God called. I was merely stating a fact that it is hard to gain acceptence into alot of baptist churches as a pator being once divorced. :confused:
     
  10. Psalm145 3

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    I know that what the Bible teaches on the subject of marriage and divorce and remarriage is hard to accept by many people, but we'd better be sure we are not being presumptuous in this matter. It is clear there is to be no remarriage until mates death. If you are already in this situation, don't get divorced again.

    Here is a link to a booklet on the subject of Marriage and Divorce

    Also, here is a sermon in Real Audio called No Re-Marriage Until Mates Death

    2 Timothy 2:25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth

    [ October 20, 2001: Message edited by: Psalm145 3 ]
     
  11. Pastor Larry

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Psalm145 3:
    It is clear there is to be no remarriage until mates death. If you are already in this situation, don't get divorced again.
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Are you then saying that Paul was not telling the truth?? You make another blanket statement, refuse to deal with Scripture, and then claim you are right and you know what you are talking about. I didn't even list any tough passages; I listed a very simple one. Why not deal with it?
     
  12. Raulf7

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    No sinner should be allowed in a Church!
     
  13. Psalm145 3

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    1 Corinthians 7:15 But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases: but God hath called us to peace.

    This passage says absolutely nothing about remarriage. What does it say? It says, "A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases" This is not saying the believer is free to be remarried. It simply means the Christian is freed from his or her marital obligations. The man does not have to continue trying to provide for the unbelieving wife who has departed. The woman is not obliged to continue to perform the wifely duties to the unbelieving husband who has departed.

    1 Corinthians 7:27,28 Art thou bound unto a wife? seek not to be loosed. Art thou loosed from a wife? seek not a wife. But and if thou marry, thou hast not sinned; and if a virgin marry, she hath not sinned. Nevertheless such shall have trouble in the flesh: but I spare you.

    Just because a brother or sister is not under bondage does not mean they are loosed. The only way a person is "loosed" is by the death of the mate (Romans 7:2,3). Paul (under divine inspiration) is simply saying that those who are "loosed" (loosed does not mean divorced) are not sinning if they choose to remarry, but they shall have trouble in the flesh.

    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Did you know that God commanded divorce in some instances? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Matthew 19:8 He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so.

    If you want to be like one of those hard-hearted Jews, go ahead, it would not be wise, though.

    Romans 14:12 So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.

    [ October 20, 2001: Message edited by: Psalm145 3 ]
     
  14. Brian

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Raulf7:
    No sinner should be allowed in a Church!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Umm why not? In most cases you need to bring sinners to where the preaching is like church. In my humble opinion it is best to go and witness and preach the Gospel. My experince has been that once you witness to someone you invite them to church and in that environment is where most people get saved. Also I'm quite certain that there are only two types of people lost sinners and saved sinners. Without sinners churches would be empty.
     
  15. Kevin Brown

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    Brian you are right on the money brother! We are all sinners. Some just being saved by God's wonderful grace.
     
  16. Pastor Larry

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>This passage says absolutely nothing about remarriage. What does it say? It says, "A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases" This is not saying the believer is free to be remarried. It simply means the Christian is freed from his or her marital obligations. The man does not have to continue trying to provide for the unbelieving wife who has departed. The woman is not obliged to continue to perform the wifely duties to the unbelieving husband who has departed. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    This is a possible interpretation but it seems far from the normal meaning of the words and it is not what most knowledgeable writers hold. To be "not bound" seems to mean exactly that. He or she is not bound; he is free. The passage says nothing about marital obligations. That is something you are reading into the text from your presuppositions about what it should say.

    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Just because a brother or sister is not under bondage does not mean they are loosed. The only way a person is "loosed" is by the death of the mate (Romans 7:2,3). Paul (under divine inspiration) is simply saying that those who are "loosed" (loosed does not mean divorced) are not sinning if they choose to remarry, but they shall have trouble in the flesh.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    This statement ignores the plain meaning of the text. On what basis are you saying that "loosed" from a marriage does not mean divorce? You will have to defend that with more than an "I say so." There seems to be no other possible meaning here. In the verse, one is either married or loosed from it. Look at it: If you are married do not seek to be loosed (divorced, freed from the bonds of marriage). If you are loosed (freed from the bonds of marriage) do not seek to be married. but if you do you have not sinned. I do not know how it gets any clearer to say that remarriage after divorce is not sin. Sometimes, we just try to hard to make the text say something it doesn't while ignoring the plain meaning of what it does say.

    I have no problem with people who do not get remarried after divorce. But it is simply not in line with Scripture to say that they cannot get remarried.
     
  17. Psalm145 3

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> On what basis are you saying that "loosed" from a marriage does not mean divorce? You will have to defend that with more than an "I say so." <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Romans 7:2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.

    Is she loosed from the law if she is divorced? How is she "loosed" from the law? if the husband be dead!
    God says so!

    A divorced woman and a widow are two different things.

    1 Corinthians 7:39 The wife is bound by the law as long as her husband liveth; but if her husband be dead, she is at liberty to be married to whom she will; only in the Lord.

    Mark 10:11 And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her.

    Mark 10:12 And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery.

    Luke 16:18 Whosoever putteth away his wife, and marrieth another, committeth adultery: and whosoever marrieth her that is put away from her husband committeth adultery.

    Exodus 20:14 Thou shalt not commit adultery.

    Deuteronomy 5:18 Neither shalt thou commit adultery.

    1 John 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

    1 Samuel 15:22 And Samuel said, Hath the Lord as great delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices, as in obeying the voice of the Lord? Behold, to obey is better than sacrifice, and to hearken than the fat of rams.
     
  18. PackerBacker

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    Raulf7,

    Are you serious or are you just goofing around. If serious, please define what you mean.


    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Raulf7:
    No sinner should be allowed in a Church!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
     

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