Question

Discussion in 'Music Ministry' started by RonJon, Jan 14, 2005.

  1. RonJon

    RonJon
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    All right,

    Here in Alaska a "Christian" rock group advertised a show that is coming soon, and will be at one of the biggest Baptist churches in Anchorage.

    Here's the dilemma, these "women" dress in ungodly clothing. They wear this revealing clothing, do antics on stage, dance around while singing, and this is all in a church auditorium.

    One point of view I have heard is that this kind of show will attract more people for Christ.

    Another point of view I have heard is that this is "a form of godliness". And from such we are told to turn away.

    I have already formed an opinion, but I'll hold off until I get a few replies.

    So tell me, what is your opinion on this? Either one of the two view I presented? Or another one? If so, please explain.
     
  2. DHK

    DHK
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    First, nowhere in the Bible is music used as a tool for evangelism. It is only used in the context of worship. To get the gospel out to others God ordained the method of "preaching the gospel."

    Secondly, the music you describe is nothing more than entertainment, and thus will attract people of other faiths, even the unsaved. Early believers did not set out to be entertained. They were persecuted for their faith, met in graveyards (the catacombs), had to hide for fear of their lives being taken, were used as human torches in Nero's garden, were thrown to the lions, burned at the stake, and suffered horrible persecution. Peter writes his first epistle to such believers undergoing persecution.
    Paul writes Timothy about the need for women to dress modestly. There are few versese in the New Testament that speak about music, but the ones that do speak very specific about the music that the believer should emphasize in his life:

    Ephesians 5:19 Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord;

    Colossians 3:16 Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly in all wisdom; teaching and admonishing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing with grace in your hearts to the Lord.

    Does the group teach and admonish one another in psalms, hymns, spiritul songs--music that they can sing with grace in their hearts to the Lord?
    Does the music make melody in their hearts to the Lord? Does it make melody in your heart to the Lord?

    Or is it all plain old entertainment, done out of the flesh?
    DHK
     
  3. SpiritualMadMan

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    What is the name of this Group?

    All that calls itself Christian is not neccesarily 'Christian'...

    And, all that violates our personal standard of Holiness isn't neccesarily 'not' Christian...

    My feelings on this remain muted, somewhat, until I find out who we are talking about...

    DHK, I, and others have debated the use of Music as an Evangelism tool before...

    Suffice it to say I disagree with him... :D

    If the attire and deportment distracts from the Serious Presentation of the Gospel when it is time for the Serious Presentation of the Gospel then I would not invite such a 'group' to my own church...

    However, if they can bring in the lost and then fade into the background while a Serious Presentation of the Gospel is given I would be inclined to make use of that 'draw'...
     
  4. chipsgirl

    chipsgirl
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    If you are uncomfortable don't go.
     
  5. SpiritualMadMan

    SpiritualMadMan
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    Chipsgirl:
    Well....


    Duh! :D


    (A word so simple it must be a good one!)
     
  6. Ben W

    Ben W
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    Yet who are we to Judge others?

    If they are evangalising, are we doing any better?

    I might point out that a number of people that post here would say a woman was dressed in an "ungodly" fashion if she wore pants rather than a dress!
     
  7. untangled

    untangled
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    If the clothing is really an issue (i.e. not enough, too short, too little too tight) then bring it up before the pastor. However, if ungodly means jeans and a t-shirt then maybe you should hear them out. I must say, I have seen some Christian girls dressed up like prostitutes and someone needs to gently approach them. What do I mean? Skirts that are barely at their hips, white t-shirts with black or red bras, etc.

    In Christ,

    B
     
  8. Gregory Perry Sr.

    Gregory Perry Sr.
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    :eek:RonJon...I'm gonna state an opinion here that I already know will draw me some flak but the term "christian" rock rap,hip-hop,etc IS an oxymoron at best and at worst it is a tool of the devil to bring the world and it's fleshly ways into our churches to divide them.These styles of music(and probably a few more I failed to mention..jazz for one)find their origins in the flesh and a little study of history will show anyone that they were originated by LOST men who had NO LOVE or desire to please God at all.It is impossible to "christianize" them simply by adding a supposedly gospel message to them as they will still appeal primarily to the baser or fleshly side of man.Very little of this music even remotely approahes the bible criteria of "psalms,hymns,and spiritual songs....".It is NEVER RIGHT to do wrong in order to get a chance to do right.Making the methods and message more "palatible" to the world in order to reach them is simply WRONG.The end result is usually that the church becomes so worldly it is NO HEAVENLY GOOD.It's is called COMPROMISE.Not a popular message these days but nonetheless true.
    (at least in my humble opinion)
    God Bless You,Greg Sr. [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  9. SpiritualMadMan

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    One must be careful, though, with the 'Compromise' "Label"...

    That's why I wantde more information about the group so I could form my own opinion about them based on my understanding of God's Word...


    There are standards I won't 'brooke' violation of, at least not in 'my' church or where 'my' kids go...

    Unfortunately, 'my' personal standards are used by *all* others... :D

    So, I can get myself in a snit and 'stroke out'...

    Or, extend Grace until I have reason to believe they are intentionally violation the Spirit of Christian Liberty and willfully using Grace as an excuse to sin..
     
  10. RonJon

    RonJon
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    Okay, sorry but I had a misunderstanding, they are two women and two men.

    The band's name is Jump 5

    I know that many are not going to be in agreement with me, but I believe tight clothing to be revealing and ungodly. I've seen in the commercial someone doing backflips up on stage. The women wear form fitting and tight fitting jeans. I'm not condemning them for wearing jeans, but for wearing tight and form fitting clothing.

    I personally believe (Of course this is my opinion) that it caters to the flesh more than the spirit. Too many times these days the name "Christian" is put on anything. Once it's there, it's perfectly all right, so it seems.

    Believe or not, but I even heard of a "Christian Nudist Colony!"

    DHK, the music does contain Christian lyrics, of course, but I believe that the music arises the flesh more than the spirit.

    SpiritualMadMan, I don't know if a serious presentation of the gospel will be presented. I can't say for sure.

    Chipsgirl, don't worry, it is something that I will not be attending.

    BenW, I want make absolute clarification. The issue of "ungodly" I refer to is not pants, but rather revealing, tight, form-fitting clothing. I apply this to both men and women.

    Untangled, I know what you mean. I do realize that there is a fine line there, and I do my best to stay on the right side.

    Perry, You hit the nail on the head. And you're right, it isn't popular. Because if it was then the whole world would be doing it.

    SpiritualMadMan, I applaud you for resevering your further opinion in place of further information.


    I believe this to be an occasion of the flesh, but, of course, that is my opinion and personal conviction. However unpopular it may be.
     
  11. SpiritualMadMan

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    Went to the official Jump 5 site and heard some of their music and it was bright, contemporary, and off hand (with out reading all the lyrics) acceptable...

    All the on-line still photos show 'teens' dressed in acceptable contemprorary attire...

    As for a serious presentation of the Gospel I haven't read deeply enough into the site to glean a direction in that regard...

    After a *very* long time the video for 'Do Ya' finally came up...

    1. The lyrics are 'pap'...
    Of course it's not the only song they do.
    We used to call this stylistic presentation 'Bubble Gum' music...

    2. While there were a few chorus line dance moves there wasn't the usual 'hip grind' you see in secular music videos...

    3. The girls attire was generally presentable even when doing hand spings. (Oh... to be young again! Of course I was *never* able to do hand springs, though!)

    Generally, the 'draw' will be the late pre-teens and early teen crowd...

    Coupled with a skillful Youth Minister and a Clear Presentation of the Gospel it may well work...

    My own thoughts are that at the ages these kids are they will not have the absolute maturity to properly disciple others...

    I sincerely hope they are part of a Good Ministry Team because alone I think they may fall prey to the glitz and glamour...

    Also, apparrently, they have been doing Childrens Ministry since 2001 and as they have grown up a bit they have launched out into singing for an older crowd...

    For me... Not my tastes and the verdict is still out..
     
  12. Guitar25

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    in my opinion, and i know that ppl will disagree with me and thats alright, is that it doesn't really matter. If people are focusing on the clothes that they wear more then the message that they're putting across then i guess that's there problem. I'm not saying that they shouldn't wear that kind of clothing but still it shouldn't make the whole message they bring any different. I've heard Jump 5 and see pics, the clothes arent that revealing anyway. but regardless, its just my opinon
     

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