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Discussion in 'Fundamental Baptist Forum' started by Phillip, Jan 23, 2012.

  1. Phillip

    Phillip
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    Are any of you familiar with the Ashcraft family that has a bunch of their generations working as IFB missinaries. I am just curious, they seem quite well known and I do want to know if they are KJVO?
     
  2. matt wade

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    For what purpose do you wish to know if they are KJVO?
     
  3. tinytim

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    prolly to make a choice about them... duh!... ROFL
     
  4. matt wade

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    So, you'd make a decision about someone's ministry based solely on whether they were KJVO or not?
     
  5. Jerome

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  6. Oldtimer

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    Possibly....

    It depends on how they make their stance.

    While I'm KJV preferred, I've seen some with the KJVO position so radical that I'd run from them. As the scriptures say, we'll know them by their fruits.

    Additionally, the choice of a Bible, can make a difference, IMHO. For example, if someone states their preferred Bible is the New World Translation or the New Jerusalem Bible that tells me a lot about their beliefs. Thus the basis of their ministry.
     
  7. Mexdeaf

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    The answer to Phillip's question at least in regard to Tommy, is- yes. I do not know the rest of the family as well. He's good people, though. Has a great church in Monterrey, MX.
     
  8. Phillip

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    Yes, I just very well might make a decision based on KJVO if the pastor is as radical as the one I have been watching for several months. Half of his message is related to the one and only perfect Word of God that has corrected all of the spelling and punctuation of the original manuscripts and that he has a hard time sending a missionary to China because the Chinese Bible that is standard was not translated directly from the KJV so it would be perfect too.

    This would not be the only decision I would look at, but it is one since I have noticed the militant stance of the KJVO group I've been involved with.

    I have NO problems with KJVP. I don't even have a problem with KJVO if they will not call an NASB (or others) straight from the devil and hell three times every sermon. Or call the NIV the Non-Inspired Version. When someone starts calling the Word of God as being written by Satan--yes-sir I would make a decision based on this. (Of course I'm talking about the basic good translations and not some like The Message, but when a Bible says Jesus is God then I could never say that the book came from Satan. It would be blasphemy at the very least.
     
  9. Luke2427

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    SURE!!!

    Seven years ago I'd have chosen not to support them if they were NOT KJVO.

    I bet you can relate to that choice.

    Today, chances are I'd choose to not support them if they ARE KJVO.

    They may be spreading the Gospel, and I say more power to them!

    But the type of Christianity that I have observed many KJVO people spread is not the type that I believe the world ever needs- in other words- its not a credible Christianity which can take the world for Christ.

    I bet you wouldn't support good Christian people who are missionaries who practice tongues, would you?

    I wouldn't either and for the same reason that I probably would not support a missionary who was KJVO.
     
    #9 Luke2427, Jan 26, 2012
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  10. Luke2427

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    See. This, Brother Phillip, is what I am talking about. This is why I do what I do.

    That kind of crud, imo, is evil. I doubt that the pastor you are talking about MEANS it to be. Rarely does anybody INTEND to promote evil.

    But evil like that ought to be resisted. And rather than good people criticizing and weakening the hands of those who aggressively resist it- they ought to cheer them on in the noble endeavor.

    Some learned Christian ought to confront that pastor and obliterate his thinking. That Christian would do the Kingdom of God a great good.
     
  11. Phillip

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    If the pastor would put 10% of the energy he uses to push legalism and spend less than 40% of his sermon cutting down modern Bibles I honestly think he would be a great pastor. He has energy, drive, motivation and a compass that needs to be calibrated about 90 degrees to get him back on course. I have no doubt the man is a born again Christian and means well; but, like others from the Bible school he came from are causing more harm to the name IFB or Baptist (period) than the New Mega churches we have that have put thousands into financing huge auditoriums, serve coffee in theater seating and preach the "seed/prosperity" sermons with very little gospel thrown in.

    Every time he's brought a young couple into the church he will find out they want to wear jeans to church because they don''t own better and he makes sure they are sent away while he commands his (elders---because they have been divorced they only have one deacon) to wear suits and ties to impress the 50 remaining members.

    He also will insist a young mother takes a belt to her child in front of other church members because the five year old opened a door to the sound room that was left unlocked and they weren't supposed to be in there; so she was commanded to whip the child with a belt in the front lobby before church started. He made me think of Nero standing back making sure his servants got enough licks in at both the right spot and with the right amount of pain.

    His son just broke his heart because he went to a Philistine school (which is anything but the one they started) and he is no longer KJVO. He's now losing sleep over this travesty of the loss of his son as a good preacher (who had about 300 in Sunday School last week while his dad had 50).

    It is hard to explain to people exactly what goes on in some of these splinter groups. There is one other positive I must say about him: he has a bigger ego than anybody I have ever met and he knows the Bible (KJB, excuse me) better than anyone. He'll tell you, just listen to one of his sermons.

    Actually, I'm not exactly sure if you are agreeing or being a little tongue-in-cheek with your response to my post, but it doesn't matter and I will not send a man like this to teach people Christianity until certain beliefs are adjusted; so to speak.

    If his only problem was KJVO. . . . I would probably say, go get em. But, the legalism this carries is from a much deeper well than just the KJVO problem.
     
  12. Luke2427

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    I was agreeing, Brother Phillip.

    I don't do tongue and cheek- not much anyway.

    God bless!
     
  13. DaChaser1

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    My limited dealings with KJVO baptists told me that they are pretty much under the burden of law keeping, and main emphasis is upon correcting those heretics amongs us who dare to actually use other English versions!
     
  14. Phillip

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    Thank you, sir. I do appreciate your post.
     
  15. dcorbett

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    I know the Ashcrafts - fed them lunch when they were at our missions
    conference. Of course, this is the younger generation of Ashcrafts -
    they are missionaries to Thailand. They are my facebook friends.
    Lovely family...and great soul winners.

    The original mission was in Mexico, Grand Dad and Dad were there.

    They are IFB missionaries. I am an IFB.

    Any other questions?
     
  16. tinytim

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    Yep, when someone preaches a false doctrine, I will not support them.
     
  17. Jerome

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    Branches of this Ashcraft clan are fueding over land left to them in Mexico by Grandad "Popsi":

    http://www.mthebron.org
     
  18. Phillip

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    Interesting. I know a doctor who is very nice man by that name. I think he is related, but he goes to a megachurch in Tulsa and I don't think there are any churches that big that are related to the IFB KJVO legalism group where I attended in our small town.

    The name reminds me of "experts at burning at the stake" :laugh: Just kidding, it is unique. The ones I have met are very nice; but, I have trouble understanding how people start believing in some of the things I've heard in the last year at the small church I have attended.

    It is NOTHING like a typical IFB; The local preacher is so in control he reminds me of a man named "Jones" who likes cool-aid brand drink with an added fizz. :saint: I did find out that all the SBC churches are liberals from, well I'm not even going to quote what he calls them and they are awfully conservative in this part of the country. When they added a drum set to the orchestra at our local biggest SBC church they became evil. Drums are from hell. I didn't know that. I thought they were from a factory in China.
     

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