Questions

Discussion in 'Calvinism/Arminianism Debate' started by The Biblicist, Dec 3, 2013.

  1. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist
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    1. Can anyone on this forum find any intermediate instrumental means used to create light in Genesis 1:3?

    2. Can anyone deny that Genesis 1:3 is what Paul draws from to describe the INTERNAL work of God in the heart in 2 Cor. 4:6 in direct contrast to Satan's INTERNAL work in man in 2 Cor. 4:4?

    Gen. 1:2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
    3 ¶ And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.


    2 Cor. 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
    5 For we preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus’ sake.
    6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.



    3. Can anyone find any text where the Greek term translated "draw" in John 6:44 is found where the object drawn does not effectual come to the one exerting the drawing power?

    4. Can anyone find any text where the Greek term translated "draw" is not found in the passive voice indicating that the object being drawing is passive in regard to the power exerted in this action?
     
  2. BobRyan

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    More word games??

    "I will draw ALL unto Me" John 12:32.

    The unregenerate heart is not "passive".

    According to Romans 8 the unregenerate heart is at war against God.

    And yet God draws it to himself.

    "God was in Christ reconciling the WORLD to Himself" 2Cor 5

    "We beg YOU on behalf of Christ - BE RECONCILED to God" 2Cor 5

    The drawing of God - enables choice - but does not cause the new birth until the one alone - and on the inside without Christ at all - opens the door to let Christ in.

    "I STAND at the door and KNOCK if ANYONE hears my voice AND OPENS the door I WILL come in " Rev 3

    "He came to HIS OWN and HIS OWN received Him not" John 1

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
  3. The Biblicist

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    If you cannot or will not address the OP in a reasonable rational straightforward manner than why waste my time and yours??? You talk about "games" your responses are irrational deflections that have no bearing on the OP.

    Readers, this is the precise kind of nonsense that I described in the op that was shut down. It is useless to deal with such irrational handling of God's Word.
     
    #3 The Biblicist, Dec 3, 2013
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  4. Van

    Van
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    Thanks for Truth

    I see where your sound rebuttal to the non-stop absurdity of Calvinism was met with shuck and jive once again.

    The this is akin to that and therefore this falsehood seems true argumentation goes on non-stop. God said let there be light and there was light. We can debate whether the light emanated directly from God or from some incandescent physical object till the cows come home. Still has no bearing on 2 Corinthians 4:4. Now the passage does address "adulterating the word of God."

    We have those who are perishing, referring to those who did not embrace the gospel, as embracing the treasures of this world, thus blinded by the god of this world. And in contrast, we have those who accepted the light of the gospel which gives the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Christ.
     
  5. The Biblicist

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    Neither of you have any substance to your arguments or I would address them. Neither of you even attempt to address the questions in the OP! You both simply reassert already proven false interpetations but neither of you will address the questions in the OP, so why bother even posting???? Everyone can see you have no better responses than he does and your only reason for posting is to support the unsupportable.

    Dear Readers, notice they cannot address the simple questions as to address them straightforwardly and honestly with objectivity would be to their own demise and THEY KNOW IT!
     
  6. The Biblicist

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    Again, is there anyone who will have enough honesty and integrity to directly address these questions straight forwardly????
     
  7. The Biblicist

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    The very same "ALL" previously defined by Christ in his defintive exposition on this very subject in John 6:44-65 where he explicitly lists "SOME" who were never drawn to him by the Father (vv. 64-65) thereby proving that "ALL" in verse 45a refers to the same "all" in verses 37-39.



    NOBODY SAID IT WAS! Indeed, I have consistently stated it is VERY ACTIVE as described in Romans 8:7-8 and in John 3:19-20 - ACTIVE STATE OF ENMITY - ACTIVE STATE OF RESISTANCE!

    Thanks for confirming the kind of ACTIVITY it is engaged in as the very nature of that activity demands it is PASSIVE in loving or submitting to God and that is the very passivity demanded by the words "NEITHER INDEED CAN BE. So they that are in the flesh CANNOT PLEASE GOD."



    Two differnt verses dealing with two different subjects. The first deals with the "world" whereas the second deals with "YOU" the ones hearing this read in the assembly at Corinth who were not reconciled with God or with each othe but in complete and utter division.

    A verse jerked out of context and used as a pretext to support false doctrine. He is directly talking to those who are being threatened by chastening (v. 20) or children of God as "chasten" is NEVER applied to lost people EVER in Scripture.

    Of course I realize you are incapable of perceiving and accepting truth. Only God can enable you to see but the good news is that IF He ever does it will be through repetitious exposing you to His truth with hope he will quicken your understanding thus enabling you to see.
     
  8. The Biblicist

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    Bob and Van have tried their best to derail the thread. They refuse to address the questions of the OP either directly or honestly. So their posts are obvious attempts to derail the thread.
     
  9. quantumfaith

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  10. BobRyan

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    That is true. "He is the light that coming into the world enlightens every man"

    "He came to His OWN and His OWN received Him not" john 1

    The problem is not that God arbitrarily selected against some and in favor of others is giving light. The problem is that "Men loved darkness rather than light for their deeds were evil" John 3

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
  11. BobRyan

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    More word games??

    "I will draw ALL unto Me" John 12:32.

    The unregenerate heart is not "passive".

    According to Romans 8 the unregenerate heart is at war against God.

    And yet God draws it to himself.

    "God was in Christ reconciling the WORLD to Himself" 2Cor 5

    "We beg YOU on behalf of Christ - BE RECONCILED to God" 2Cor 5

    The drawing of God - enables choice - but does not cause the new birth until the one alone - and on the inside without Christ at all - opens the door to let Christ in.

    "I STAND at the door and KNOCK if ANYONE hears my voice AND OPENS the door I WILL come in " Rev 3

    "He came to HIS OWN and HIS OWN received Him not" John 1

    Your stunt of pretending not to understand how the reference to the "Drawing of ALL unto ME" and yet "His OWN received Him not" relates to your "all drawn come to Christ"( fully debunked claim in the OP ) - is not as compelling an argument as you may have at first imagined.

    Who do you imagine to be confused or befuddled by your pretending you do not understand the details presented??

    Me??

    You??

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
  12. The Biblicist

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    Still no attempt to answer the very questions contained in the OP.

    In post #7 I address every single statement you make and dispose of it as complete eisgesis and give contextual based reasons to demonstrate it.

    Your response is to simply ignore all evidences and repeat like a dumb mindless parrot the same disproven statements WHICH HAVE NO BEARING ON THE OP at all.
     
  13. BobRyan

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    Your own OP asks about the drawing of God and then makes up the fictional idea that "all drawn will come to Christ" (a point where you simply "quote you" since you have no text saying it).

    The texts I provided in response fully debunk your speculation.

    "I will draw ALL unto Me" John 12:32.

    The unregenerate heart is not "passive".

    According to Romans 8 the unregenerate heart is at war against God.

    And yet God draws it to himself.

    "God was in Christ reconciling the WORLD to Himself" 2Cor 5

    "We beg YOU on behalf of Christ - BE RECONCILED to God" 2Cor 5

    The drawing of God - enables choice - but does not cause the new birth until the one alone - and on the inside without Christ at all - opens the door to let Christ in.

    "I STAND at the door and KNOCK if ANYONE hears my voice AND OPENS the door I WILL come in " Rev 3

    "He came to HIS OWN and HIS OWN received Him not" John 1

    ==============================

    But of course you find a way to breathe life into your failed idea by insisting that you do not understand the point of the post.

    how sad.

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
  14. The Biblicist

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    DEAL with the OP directly if you dare! So far you are not brave enough to deal with a single solitary question directly, honestly or objectively.

    You simple repeat errors that have been proven to be errors. You are not mature enough to objectively deal directly with this OP and every reader of this thread can easily see that.
     

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