Rapture question.

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Doeroftheword, May 29, 2009.

  1. Doeroftheword

    Doeroftheword
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    I turned over to the Sky Angel channel on Dish network and they had a preacher there who was discussing the end times and specifically The pre tribulation and the talk about the elect in the tribulation. This Man insisted that the reason for the message of the rapture was the fact that this girl had a dream and one of her parents were gone and one was left and then came the tribulation and now pastors are using it as a scare tactic to get them saved. He contended that the rapture happens in between the 3 1/2 years of peace and the 3 1/2 years of tribulation. I was laughing all the way through this cause I am a pre-tribulation believer However, I have heard someone say from a former church I went to say that the elect in Matthew 24 was Christians so My question is if the deceiver is allowed to deceive many through the anti Christ wouldn't the Holy Spirit have to leave earth for him to do this on a large scale and if that is the case how is anyone saved durring the tribulation? Just a thought and question
     
  2. Jon-Marc

    Jon-Marc
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    The scripture in Matthew 24 is often misused in reference to Christians being Raptured, but it is about Christ's return to the earth AFTER the tribulation to set up His 1,000 year reign. At that time He removes all unbelievers and casts them into hell. He binds the devil for the 1,000 years.

    The Rapture is mentioned in 1 Thess. 4:16,17. It is believed by many Christians to happen just prior to the tribulation, and by some to be halfway through the tribulation. Some believe it will be at the end of the tribulation, and some believe it to be a lie.

    I believe that it will usher in the tribulation as the anti-Christ steps in to explain to the world what happened to their missing loved ones. A lot of people believe in space aliens. That would be as good an explanation as any.

    A "secret' Rapture as some believe? I don't see how it could be secret when loved ones, friends, and co-workers will be vanishing right before people's eyes. Every baby in the world will vanish--as well as those who were born mentally deficient, or who haven't reached the point of understanding. God is a loving and just God and won't allow anyone to perish who isn't mentally capable of understanding.

    Some might be asleep, but the whole world doesn't sleep at the same time. Cars, airplanes, buses, and trains that are controlled by Christians will be crashing. The time of the Rapture will be pandemonium.
     
  3. menageriekeeper

    menageriekeeper
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    No, the Holy Spirit doesn't appear to have to leave the earth in order for the Antichrist to deceive on a large scale. Somewhere there is a passage in the Bible that says something like the deception would be so great that even the "elect would almost believe" what the Antichrist was saying. Let me see if I can find it.

    Okay here it is: For false Christs and ad false prophets will appear and perform signs and miriacles to deceive the elect--if that were possible. Mark 13:22
     
  4. OldRegular

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    Actually part of Matthew 24 describes the destruction of the temple by Rome in 70AD, the remainder describes the return of Jesus Christ in power and great glory. At this time there will be a general resurrection of all the dead followed by the Great White Throne Judgment, the New Heavens and Earth, and the TRIUNE GOD dwelling with his redeemed.

    So the rapture question is moot.
     
  5. Me4Him

    Me4Him
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    The "TRINITY" doesn't just explain God, it explains the scripture as well.

    God is Jesus. Jesus is God, Holy Spirit is Holy Ghost/Comforter,

    They all are "ONE",......BUT",

    You'll have to "divide them" into their separate parts to understand the scriptures.

    God tried speaking "DIRECTLY" to Israel at Mt Sinai, it scared them to death they told Moses to let God speak to him then he could tell them what God said,

    This is one reason why God (Holy Spirit) sent "prophets" to speak for him to Israel.

    When Jesus came, God (Jesus) spoke "DIRECTLY" to anyone who would listen to him through the "Comforter", Holy "GHOST OF JESUS".

    Heb 1:1 God, spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
    2 (God) Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son,

    Joh 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name,

    OT people didn't have a "Comforter" to led/guide them, they had "prophets".


    Ec 4:1 So I returned, and considered all the oppressions that are done under the sun: and behold the tears of such as were oppressed, and they had no comforter; and on the side of their oppressors there was power; but they had no comforter.

    If you'll notice in the above verse, no comforter equals "POWER" on the side of the oppressor,

    but with a Comforter, "POWER" is on the side of those indwelled by the comforter,

    This is why satan can never "prevail" over the church, obviously, the only way Satan can prevail is with the "Comforter", "taken out of the way".

    2Th 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, (Rapture)

    2Th 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. (Comforter/Rapture)


    8 "AND THEN" shall that Wicked be revealed, (first seal opened/AC/white horse)

    whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

    Christians ask how can a person be saved without the "Comforter/Holy Ghost",

    Jews ask how can a person be saved without following the law/offering sacrifices as prescribed in the OT.

    Obviously, neither side understands the "TRINITY".
     
  6. OldRegular

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    No one can obfuscate Scripture like Me4Him except possibly Ed Edwards who has disappeared!
     
  7. HankD

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    Eschatology: Things to come.
    Generally this is an unresolved issue in contemporary church theology.
    pre-trib, mid-trib, post trib, amil, pre-mil, post mil, dispensationalism, preterism, partial-preterism are all major themes in the various views
    with a myriad of permutations.

    You won't find an all inclusive answer.

    You will probably have to chose the one that answers most of the questions to your satisfaction.

    Many choose "pan-millenialism": It will all pan out in the end.

    These threads concerning things to come often times do not end well.

    HankD
     

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