Reaction to CCM and TCM

Discussion in 'Music Ministry' started by drfuss, Dec 23, 2009.

  1. drfuss

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    On the Ccm thread, there is much discussion on Contempory Christian Music (CCM) and Traditional Christian Music (TCM). That thread deals with CCM concerning the pros and cons, good and bad, etc. Let's keep that type of discussion on that thread.

    On this thread, we assume that both TCM and CCM are in our churches and we will not discuss the merits of either. The issue on this thread should be: how should we (or do we) react to the type of music that we don't care for, but is in our church services anyway?

    My experience is that: those who like CCM tend to think TCM is boring; those who like TCM tend to think CCM is too repetitious and/or too much rock beat.

    So given the above, how should we (or do we) respond when we are explosed to the other type of music?
     
  2. SBCPreacher

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    I think that's one of the advantages of a balanced "blended" approach to planning music for worship. Personally, I can't stand Southern Gospel, but I can take it in short bursts in a blended service.
     
  3. drfuss

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    Interesting. I didn't consider Southern Gospel Music in the TCM/CCM mix.

    I consider Southern Gospel Music to be the Christian side of country music, which has been around for many years and therefore not recent contemporary music. I consider the contemporary music that I have to deal with to be the Christian side of rock and roll music.

    What types of music do you include in your blended approach besides Southern Gospel?
     
  4. SBCPreacher

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    Actually, I don't include SG. I use traditional hymns and choruses. Always some of both. Mainly in medleys:
    hymn, chorus, chorus
    chorus, hymn, chorus
    hymn, chorus, hymn
    etc.

    We learn a new chorus about every other month, and work it into the "rotation."
     
  5. drfuss

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    I think I would like the music in your service. My church has had your type of music for years. However, we got a young pastor who is trying to go more contemporary. There has been considerable resistance, so a compromise has been reached. We sing one traditional hymn, and then go to the contemporary courses, some with the rock beat and repetitions. Since the worship leader wants to go contemporary, he sometimes changes the music of the traditional hymn making it more contemporary.

    Few people are really happy with the music part of the service, because each has to put up with some of the other's type of music. In addition, since the worship leader wants to go completely contemporary, you can tell that his heart is not in the traditional music. Some people come in late to avoid the song service.

    We have three services on Sunday morning. We could have one or two completely contemmporary services and one or two one completely traditional services. With the three services, we already have three different congregations. Has anyone tried this approach? Has it worked out well? What do you think about this approach?
     
  6. rbell

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    I have to admit...we had an easy time of it at my church.

    We grew so much that we physically couldn't fit everyone in the Santctuary.

    So, we started a new service. The new service, at the new time, is more contemporary; the original one stayed more traditional.

    Of course...these are all moving targets. Some folks might think our traditional is contemporary. Others would say our contemporary was not "contemporary enough."

    I love the attitude of our senior adult minister. Because he teaches a SS class during our contemporary service (we have 2 services and two Sunday schools, both meeting back-to-back simultaneously), he seldom goes to the contemporary service. He will occasionally come in to help with invitations or make announcements.

    He will tell us that he doesn't enjoy the contemporary service that much. However, he says, "I might not enjoy it, but God is working through it...so I will support it with my prayers, and encouragement to others that attend it."

    Pretty good.
     
  7. JohnDeereFan

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    I have no problem being exposed to CCM. We just won't allow it in our church services.
     
  8. rbell

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    Only one problem: "CCM" is a moving target. How is it defined? What you call "CCM" another person won't.

    It's all perspective.
     
  9. billwald

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    For those who like traditional music

    For this season I suggest Michael Praetorius, "Lutheran Mass for Christmas Morning."
     
  10. JohnDeereFan

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    For the purposes of this discussion, if it isn't a hymn, it's CCM. The closest we ever came to CCM was a Squire Parsons song at a funeral.
     
  11. rbell

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    Well, then, define a hymn.
     
  12. Trotter

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    If you are using the redback hymnal, it would have to be something written before 1953, as that is the newest copyright on any of the songs. Of course, that was a renewal, so it ought to be pre-1950 to be safe.

    No one ever told me God stopped moving in the 1950's. I wonder if they told Him about it, as I still see God moving in the much of the songs and music of today. Huh... there He goes, stepping out of somebody's nice little box again...
     
  13. JohnDeereFan

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    Actually, I never said that God does not or cannot move through anything He wishes. I just said that we don't have CCM in our church.
     
  14. drfuss

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    I agree.

    JohnDeereFan's definition is not the same as mine. My definition of CCM includes:

    1. Where the drum beat or rock beat (rather than the words) plays a significant or dominat role in the song.
    2. Where the singer does not stay on the music pitch, but slides from note to note.

    There are a number of recent Christian songs that are not CCM according to my definition.

    For instance, I consider most of the older Southern Gospel songs not to be CCM; however, there is a trend among the younger singers to go more in the CCM direction.

    I suppose the broader question is what do we do (or should we do) when the music in the church changes to music shich makes us uncomfortable and hinders our worship.

    Those who support CCM tend to think this should not be a problem, but it is.
     
  15. nodak

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    DH and I have made the decision that for us, music of whatever kind must not be physically painful (setting up the endorphin releasing fight or fight syndrome and thus becoming a drug or opiate).

    We have also made the decision it should help prepare our hearts for the sermon, since the ENTIRE service is worship. We personally are not going to participate if we feel the purpose of the music is to mystically intimately connect with God. (YES, one should connect intimately with God--but just as between married folks, public displays of affection need to be tasteful.)

    If it meets those criteria, and is scripturally accurate, we will deal with it even if it isn't our favorite type. (Which if you are curious is old time music such as found in "O brother where art thou" and in other Christian mountain music, western music such as Riders in the Sky, and "traditional" Baptist hymnals.)

    One of the best suggestions I ever heard is this: whatever kind of music your church does, would the musicians be willing to do it if they were screened from sight? If not, it is appealing to their worldly nature no matter the music type. And would your congregation behave the same way in worship if they all wore sleep masks? If not, something is appealing to THEIR worldly nature or ego.

    And while there may be nothing wrong with culturally driven music, we won't participate if it suggests pagan worship--a real possibility for us with former "rez" residents.

    And with a brother long active in a bar-type dance band, we are very familiar with music (not lyrics, music) that is intentionally used in bars to stimulate carnal desires. And yes, some traditional "invitation" songs and much of todays ccm use those musical techniques, slides, beats, and bluesy notes. We won't do those.

    Beyond that, I believe it is equally wrong either to condemn all music with a living author/composer just because it is new, and to take the attitude "if I can't have my ccm I just won't go to church."

    Neither attitude is that of a mature believer. Neither is the attitude "but I already sang that song or learned that melody; I need something new." It is good, we believe, to have a "new song" but it is equally good to preserve the old paths.
     
  16. drfuss

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    You made some very good points.
    To me CCM is not the same as new mueic. For instance, a song of recent years is "People Need the Lord". That song has a good meaning and I have never heard it sung with a dominant rock beat.
     
  17. sag38

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    Nodak, sadly it sounds like you have been heavily influenced by Bill Gothard. Much of what you said about the music messing with endorphins, etc. is not based in fact but in opinion and a false teaching. Why would you malign God's work through a different genre of music that doesn't fit into your personal taste. It's sad when folks use personal preferences and false teaching to determine what constitutes legitimate worship music and a legitimate worship experience.
     
  18. drfuss

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    modak wirtes: "DH and I have made the decision that for us, music of whatever kind must not be physically painful (setting up the endorphin releasing fight or fight syndrome and thus becoming a drug or opiate)."

    I don't know about physically painful, but the music with the rock beat is irritating to me. In some CCM, the rock beat is dominant instead of the message. It you are saying that the beat should not be more inspiring than the message, I agree. Or put another way, if the message is not inspiring without the beat, is it really worship or is it just an emotional response to the beat?

    Anyway, the way I respond to CCM with the rock beat is I try to avoid it. I may have to skip the song service if it becomes only CCM with the rock beat. Some of those who like CCM with the rock beat, seem to have no concern about ruining the song service for those who don't.
     
  19. nodak

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    sag38, I'll show my ignorance, but who is Bill Gothard? What we are being influenced by can be found by the thread "sound check" in this forum.

    Physically painful has absolutely nothing to do with style of music--it has everything to do with volume for us. If you read that thread you will understand why yesterday was our last day at the church we've been attending.

    Don't let anyone kid you--as a runner when younger and as still very athletically active old codgers, there is a point just under "I can't stand this anymore" when you DO get a physical high. Just ask anyone who shot their moose too far from the dirt road!

    We are getting the exact same sense of euphoria when our song service ends. Yay! The torture is over and I survived it! And let me assure you, "Redeemed how I love to proclaim it" is just as much torture for me as "Let it Rise" if they both are about the level of a jet engine revving up next to your ear.

    When the music is so loud our five year old granddaughter claps her hands over her ears and dives under the pew until it ends, its tooooooo loud!

    And yet we took her to the local Christmas choir concert and she sat mesmerized for two hours.
     
  20. rbell

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    That's a shame. Volume can be corrected. Our services are very close in decibel levels (yes, we've checked).

    I'm sorry that you have not enjoyed your worship services.
     

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