Rededication ceremonies: Rooted in the Lordship Salvation controversy

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Herald, Aug 25, 2013.

  1. Herald

    Herald
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    I was first introduced to the concept of rededication at the Word of Life Island in 1984. I was 23 and attended Word of Life's College and Career program on the Island. I then started seeing more rededication ceremonies at youth rallies and church services.

    Part of "rededication" is rooted in the Lordship Salvation controversy. There is a segment within Christianity that believes it is possible for Jesus to be Savior without being Lord. In fact, this view is so pervasive that those who hold to it believe in an almost two step salvation process. The first process is justification by faith and the second is making Jesus the Lord of your life.

    Martin Luther said, "All of life is repentance." I will accept that as an axiom. If all of life is repentance we are constantly turning from our sin to God. But that is different than a formal rededication ceremony where we throw a stick in the fire or sign a commitment card that we put in the inside cover of our Bible. I would argue that these ceremonies actually add to the guilt that many Christians experience as their lives do not live up to the standard that was set for them; both by their own expectations and the expectations of those who advocate rededication.

    I open it up to the BB for discussion.
     
  2. quantumfaith

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    Herald, I do not understand the terminology or the concept of Lordship Salvation, but I do believe our life from the time we become a member of the household of faith, is a growing and maturing process. We grow, we learn, we sin, we repent, we learn and grow (hopefully) more. We do have seasons in our life even as believers.

    Andy addressed this a bit in his message today.

    http://northpointministries.org/messages/embed/bridging-the-gap/
     
  3. agedman

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    I don't have much of a problem with "rededication" ceremonies, as long as folks understand that the rededication is turning from sin, confessing guilt before God (and as necessary man) and putting a "stone of remembrance" as a life marker to look upon.

    Where I think preacher's often fail, is the lack of teaching the ongoing accountability factor.

    You mentioned guilt, and I think a case could be made that Paul also struggled with the guilt of not living up to expectations.

    Salvation isn't the "Texas Two Step" and it is important to note that the "experience of salvation" isn't for God's benefit.

    The believer "experiences" periods of growth as God leads them from teachable moment to teachable situations (recall - tribulation works patience). Therefore, it would not be unexpected for a believer to have crisis moments in which the Holy Spirit impresses a life change upon them over areas of the flesh not yet controlled by the Spirit.

    That some may call these "rededication" is nothing more than what Paul spoke of in the letters. He called for the believers to be "filled with the Spirit" to "Let the love of Christ dwell in you richly" and other such encouragements.

    It isn't a matter of "Lordship salvation," nor is it "Letting go and letting God..." but of taking the Spiritual combat to the flesh by dying daily, giving the heart, mind, soul, and strength to the service and Love of Christ, presenting ourselves as "living sacrifices - our reasonable service."

    It isn't "salvation" it is being as Christlike a believer as possible as God leads from one situation to the next.
     
  4. Jerome

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    Is the OP referring to something like this???

     
  5. Iconoclast

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    No it was probably not jerome.....as when Spurgeon preached his sermon he prefaced it with these words :

     
    #5 Iconoclast, Aug 25, 2013
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  6. Herald

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    Quantum, a little background...

    The Lordship Salvation controversy reached its peak in the late 1980's. Some argue it was sparked by a book by John MacArthur titled, "The Gospel According to Jesus." In the book MacArthur took issue with the notion that you can accept Jesus as Savior while not accepting Him as Lord. Jesus becomes Lord at some point down the line when the new convert recognizes they have not yielded all of their life to Him. Enter in the rededication ceremony. These ceremonies are big in Christian youth camping (c.f. my experience at Word of Life). Some churches practice them at altar calls.

    MacArthur's book sparked a visceral response from some segments of evangelicalism; specifically fundamentalism. Charles Ryrie wrote a book in refutation of MacArthur's titled, "So Great Salvation". MacArthur differentiated between semantics and substance. It is possible for one to rededicate their life in the sense that they repent of their sins and walk in obedience to God. That really is the definition of repentance, not rededication. That is the semantical side of the argument. The substance part are those who truly believe Jesus possesses two separate offices - Savior and Lord - and it is possible to accept Him as Savior without accepting Him as Lord. The latter view is unbiblical. As God incarnate Jesus is always Savior and Lord. These are not separate offices.
     
    #6 Herald, Aug 25, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 25, 2013
  7. Herald

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    No. The OP is dealing with rededication as displayed in the Lordship Salvation controversy. The issue is not with the words rededicate or rededication, but how those words come to define a specific view of salvation and sanctification.
     
  8. salzer mtn

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    I don't hear much about re-capped tires any more but re-dedication reminds me back when people wore out their tires they could take them in and have them re-capped.
     
  9. DHK

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    Salvation is: "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ...
    Christ is not divorced from being Lord. He never is.
    In fact Christ is Lord of the unsaved and the saved alike. To think that a saved person who sins can dethrone Christ as Lord is absurd.
    Would a citizen of England by his wayward actions dethrone the Queen of England. No, but it might put the citizen in jail.
    What would you do that would that would get Obama kicked out of office?
    Christ is Lord. I am the citizen of His kingdom. If I disobey him I may be chastised by Him because I also am His child and He loves me. I cannot "make" Christ Lord. He already is. He always was, is, and always will be Lord. Nothing I can do or say will ever change that fact.

    IMO, Lordship Salvation is a false doctrine. It denies the doctrine of salvation. It robs the believer of any chance of personal growth because supposedly he is already totally committed, totally surrendered to Christ as Lord. He can't go any higher, any more sanctified or set apart than he already is.
    There is always room for repentance in the Christian life (which Lordship salvation denies). Why else would 1John 1:9 be written, and written to Christians--to confess our sins to Christ (repent of them), and he will forgive us. The entire Christian walk is one of daily repentance.

    Lordship salvation is maintaining salvation by works. One must always make sure that Christ is Lord. It is a denial of Eph.5:18--Be ye continually filled with the Holy Spirit--a verse that infers that there are times when one is not filled with the Holy Spirit or when Christ is not Lord (at least in the sense of the LS advocates).

    There are many reasons why Lordship Salvation is a false doctrine.
    There is nothing wrong with a person rededicating there life to the Lord.
    Why would there be? I don't necessarily think it has to be in a public ceremony, but dedication is an important part of the christian life.
     
  10. Herald

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    You misunderstand Lordship Salvation. It has nothing at all to do with what the believer does. It is about who Jesus Christ is.

    Jesus Christ is God. Jesus Christ is Savior. Jesus Christ is Lord. He does not become Savior and/or Lord because an individual makes Him so. He is those things by His very nature.

    As far as the individual believer is concerned, he is not relieved of his responsibility to live obediently. In fact, just the opposite is true. Those who believe you can accept Jesus as Savior without accepting Him as Lord diminish Jesus' attributes. They create a dichotomy that does not exist in scripture.
     
  11. Herald

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    When I was stationed at Offutt Air Force Base in Nebraska, I wanted to go home to New Jersey for Christmas. I was nearly broke and needed tires desperately on my 1978 Camaro Z28. I bought four Hoosier brand retreads (recaps as you call them). I made it to Des Moines, Iowa when the treads separated from the tire. I was almost stranded over Christmas at a gas station off interstate 80 were it not for Western Union.

    Okay, back to our regularly scheduled thread.
     
  12. Iconoclast

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    :thumbs::wavey::thumbsup:
     
  13. DHK

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    My post began with:
    Salvation consists of:
    Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved.
    That is what the Bible teaches. We believe on the LORD Jesus Christ at the time of salvation. We know who he is; if we didn't we could not be saved. One cannot be saved if he doesn't know who Christ is. There is no misunderstanding there at all.
    That is what I said in my post. That is not what LS necessarily teaches.
    First we all believe that in salvation we must believe on the LORD Jesus Christ to be saved, as per Acts 16:31. No need to suggest otherwise.
    Second, to believe that one can live a sinless life is a heresy that the Bible speaks strongly against. See 1John 1:8.10.
    That being the case there will be times of disobedience in the Christian's life, and therefore times of repentance. This is not a dichotomy. Neither is it an excuse to live disobediently. It is a fact in the Christian life that we cannot live a sinless life, and there is a process in the Christian life that takes place which is called sanctification.
     
  14. Herald

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    ..........
     
    #14 Herald, Aug 26, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 26, 2013
  15. Revmitchell

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    That is incomplete:

    Rom 10:9 because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
    Rom 10:10 For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved.


    Act_2:38 And Peter said to them, "Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
     
  16. Herald

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    Then what are you disagreeing with me for?

    Do you know what Lordship Salvation teaches?

    Go back and read what I wrote. What did I call a dichotomy?

    I know what sanctification is.
     
  17. Iconoclast

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    A man named Bob Lyle wrote this;


    Submitting to his Lordship is a part and parcel of the new heart and Spirit's work...Jesus indicated this very thing is indeed essential----

    43 For a good tree bringeth not forth corrupt fruit; neither doth a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

    44 For every tree is known by his own fruit. For of thorns men do not gather figs, nor of a bramble bush gather they grapes.

    45 A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good; and an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is evil: for of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaketh.

    46 And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?

    In verse 46...bearing fruit and obeying the word are not optional.Dispensational teachers not only error on eschatology.....but also 99 out of 100 times when they boast of "rightly dividing" the word....they quickly proceed to wrongly divide and fragment the word of God in a way that causes this kind of error.

    Jesus spoke of fruit coming forth as an expected result.Israel as a nation failed in this way.....Isa5...mt21:43
     
  18. DHK

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    This is reasonable but that is not what most LS advocates teach. The trite saying goes: Either "He is Lord of ALL or He is not Lord at all."

    Al Lyle pointed out "the actual practice of a committed life may not follow immediately or completely." However there are some on this board that actually believe that the day a person is saved they should forsake all and follow Jesus. That command of Jesus has to do with discipleship not salvation, and as Lyle said the willingness to commit one's life absolutely to the Lord immediately or completely may not follow salvation immediately. Normally it takes spiritual growth, maturity, sanctification. Would a mission agency call someone to the mission field who had just trusted Christ?
     
  19. Revmitchell

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    You do not know what you are talking about.
     
  20. Luke2427

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    Biblical lordship, as I understand it, works likes this:

    First of all it means you confess that Jesus Christ is Lord believing the thing that verifies his ultimate lordship- his conquest of death via his resurrection.

    Secondly, and as a necessary and natural outgrowth of the first element, it means that one is, throughout the entirety of his life, conforming to Christ's rule via growth in sanctification (i. e. knowledge of Christ and obedience to him).

    Without this lordship, one is not saved no matter what "prayer he prayed," what "five steps to heaven" he took, how many John R. Rice Gospel Tracts he read, etc...
     

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