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Discussion in 'Sports' started by TomVols, Oct 14, 2007.
I thought the Reds might be moving in the right direction and then they go and hire Dusty.
Good luck with that :laugh:
It's official. The Reds have no desire to move in the right direction. None. I've spent all day trying to find the silver lining, but can't. Someone help me :tonofbricks:
The team has local ownership, you would think they would do more to make them winners. I'm almost regretting the decision to let my wife turn me into a Reds fan!!!!
Tom, look on the bright side, you still got the Bengals :tonofbricks:
The last time the Reds were in the World Series was under Lou Pinella. Dusty Baker has managed the Giants to the World Series and the Cubs to the playoffs.
What makes you think he won't lead the Reds to the playoffs? Who else were they going to get, Pete Mankanin? Don't get me wrong, this interim manager did a good job, but I think he would round up like Dave Miley and Jerry Narron. Without a job in the middle of next year.
They need to make some changes, and this is one of them. The Reds need help in their pitching and the way things have been going, that is not happening.
Just something to think about.
I see a Griffey Jr, Sosa and Bonds outfield in '08 :laugh:
I watched Baker manage the Cubs, and it was not pretty. Baker is clueless when it comes to pitching. He has no idea how to handle a pitching staff. If pitching help is what the Reds need, they made a terrible choice IMO. If I were the Reds I would have went after Joe Girardi.
I agree with you, Joe Girardi would have been a better selection, but with the Yankees deciding what to do about Joe Torre, and who knows if Dusty was the first choice. The Reds could have tried to get Joe or Don Mattingly, and the Yankess could have said no.
We'll see what happens.
Bonds and Sosa to the Reds, KNOW WAY!!!!!! raying:
Bonds needs to go to the AL and Sosa needs to stay in the AL. The only time we need to see them is in another uniform. :thumbs:
Baker had no reign over the clubhouse in SF or ChC. Baker let the players run the ship. Also, as has been pointed out, Baker doesn't get that pitching wins games. You cannot bash people in GABP. You'll get bashed to death. Plus, Baker has been a tad racist and arrogant in the past, two things that will not endear him to the conservative, working class fans of Cincinnati. I see this as a train wreck.
I thought Brenly would be a good choice, and Mattingly would fit in well in Cincy though he would've been waiting for the Yankee job (as would Girardi, who was my second choice behind Mike Scioscia (I know, a Dodger in Cincinnati makes me shudder)).
I hope I'm wrong about Dusty. At least Mackanin got something out of the players. Dusty hasn't exactly extracted the talent from his players IMHO.
Not only is Dusty a bad manager, he's a former Dodger to boot.
The Reds need to upgrade their pitching, but Dusty Baker is not going to help in that regard. He pretty much ruined the careers of Mark Prior and Kerry Wood. If I were Aaron Harang or Bronson Arroyo, I'd be on the phone with my agent desperately pleading with him to get me out of Cincinnati before Dusty made me throw 200 pitches a game.
Here's a smattering of Dusty from one of the best websites ever.
It's believed that Dusty was the first one to talk about "clogging up the basepaths."
And, just to keep piling on, because it's fun.
Actually, the Yankees were/are very much about on-base percentage and walks.
Tom, I feel sorry for you and every fan of the Reds who are going to be watching their beloved team be destroyed by a terrible manager over the next 3 years. I can't figure out why any GM in his right mind would hire Dusty Baker. It can't be money, because there's no way that Mackanin would have made more money than Baker will. Truly baffling.
The only thing I can figure is (1) After Miley and Narron, no way the Reds were going to elevate an interim to full-time manager, and (2) The other big names weren't interested/available, and (3) The Reds want to keep Dunn/Griff/et.al and they think (erroneously) that Baker will relate well to them the way Mack did.
Of course, Dunn has been castigated in the past, and his homer tear this year has earned him some forgiveness. Junior has rehabbed his image with the fans. Maybe Baker will endear himself to the Queen City.
I agree with you to think of a former Dodger in a Reds uniform. I looked at the photo and thought "How wierd is that?"
I was really pleased with the Reds hiring Dusty Baker. He is a proven winner in my books. He took the Giants to the world series and the Cubs to the playoffs. What have the Reds done during that time span? They made the playoffs in '95 and lost to the Mets in a one-game playoff to make the playoffs back in '99. Since then it has been a downward spiral. Managers don't win games, players do...and the Reds haven't been "stocked" like most teams, given that they are a smaller-market team. They have tried pitchers that are either on their way out, past their primes, or high draft picks that were busts, in hopes of them proving their draft status. This is why they have lost for so many years, not just because of their bad managers. Dusty Baker is the best available choice given the Reds frugal owner. Joe Giradi, Joe Torre, or even Don Mattingly would have cost more $$$ they would have been willing to shell out. I have a GOOD feeling about Dusty!! Go Reds!!
That is true to a point, BUT having a good manager does make a big difference. Look at Leyland in Detroit and the way he brought that team along. Look at Pinella with the Cubs this year. While I agree the players make or break the team, a good manager that knows how to handle players makes a difference too.
I disagree. I think you could have had Joe Girardi or Bob Brenly for probably the same money and either one of them are better managers IMO. Brenly has a World Series ring, which is something Dusty doesnt have.
As as been pointed out on this thread already. Dusty has won some games and done some nice things, however he has two major flaws IMO that is going to hurt the Reds:
1. He is too much of a players guy. He ends up letting the inmates run the assylum, and it comes back to bite him.
2. He has no clue about handling a pitching staff.
But when it is all said and done, as a Cubs fan, I am great with the hire of Dusty :applause:
First, you say Dusty is a proven winner, then you turn around and say that managers don't win games. Which is it?
The Oakland Athletics are a small-market team and they went to the playoffs for 4 straight years from 2000-2003 and were in the ALCS in 2006. Small-market teams can win.
Mattingly would have cost more than Dusty? Why do you say that? Mattingly hasn't managed at the major league level yet. You might have a point with Girardi, but unless Dusty's contract terms were released and I missed it, there's no basis in fact to say that about Girardi. You can't really say it about Torre either, although we know Torre made more $$ than any other manager.
I think you're the only one. I feel sorry for Reds fans.