Regeneration and the Renewing of the Holy Spirit

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by Jerry Shugart, Dec 22, 2011.

  1. Jerry Shugart

    Jerry Shugart
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    In the following verse the Apostle Paul describes how he was saved:

    "Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Spirit" (Titus 3:5).

    Here Paul uses the word "regeneration" in regard to his salvation. This word is translated from the Greek word paliggenesia, which is the combination of palin and genesis.

    Palin means "joined to verbs of all sorts,it denotes renewal or repetition of the action" (Thayer's Greek English Lexicon).

    Genesis means "used of birth, nativity" (Thayer's Greek English Lexicon).

    When we combine the meaning of the two words we have a "repetition of a birth."

    It is obvious that the reference is not to a "physical" rebirth, or the repetition of one's physical birth. Paul could only be speaking of a repetition of a spiritual birth. And the words which follow make it certain that the "birth" of which Paul is referring to is a "spiritual" birth--"the renewing of the Holy Spirit."

    Since a person is "regenerated" by the Holy Spirit then that means that one must have previously been born of the Holy Spirit. That happens at conception.

    However, the Calvinists deny this truth and insist that an infant comes out of the womb dead spiritually!
     
  2. convicted1

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    "Re" means again. To be "re"generated, doesn't that mean alive again?
     
  3. billwald

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    The problem goes back to the beginning of Genesis. In the day that Adam sinned he didn't die thus either we misinterpret the Bible statement or God lied.
    I think God used hyperbole.
     
  4. The Biblicist

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    Spiritual death occurred in Adam thus eternal life was lost in Adam and so to be regenerated means to regain what was lost in Adam as "IN Adam ALL DIE" - 1 Cor. 15:22
     
  5. savedbymercy

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    I dealt with this before. Regeneration occurred with all the body of Christ at once when Jesus Christ their Head rose from the Dead. In other words, when He died, they died, when He rose, they rose. His resurrection was a regeneration. The word regeneration is the greek word paliggenesia, which is a noun ! It means:


    new birth, reproduction, renewal, recreation, regeneration

    a) hence renovation, regeneration, the production of a new life consecrated to God, a radical change of mind for the better. The word often used to denote the restoration of a thing to its pristine state, its renovation, as a renewal or restoration of life after death

    Christ in His Resurrection was restored to Life after death ! He said here Rev 1:18

    I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

    Now the word paliggenesia is made up of Two Words #1.palin which means:
    anew, again

    a) renewal or repetition of the action

    b) again, anew

    And the word genesis:

    source, origin

    a) a book of one's lineage, i.e. in which his ancestry or progeny are enumerated

    2) used of birth, nativity

    So His resurrection is called first begotten Col 1:18. Now His seed in Him rose together with Him Eph 2:6

    Now, all who rose together with Him in His regeneration, they each individually receive a New Birth, A Renewal of the Holy Ghost. Thats the difference !
     
  6. Jerry Shugart

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    Yes, Adam died spiritually when he sinned and since God is no respecter of persons He treats all men the same way so all men dies spiritually as a result of their own sin:

    "Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned" (Ro.5:12).

    A person perishes as a result of his own sin:

    "For there is no respect of persons with God. For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law" (Ro.2:11-12).

    A person must come into the world "spiritually" alive because in order for him to die "spiritually" he must first be alive "spiritually."
     
  7. The Biblicist

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    You missed my point in response to your former post! It is called "re-generation because mankind was formerly spiritually alive in pre-fallen Adam. It is called "re-generation" because it is always placed in contrast to generation by physical birth (Jn. 3:6-7 "again").
     
  8. percho

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    I say it is called regeneration because Jesus the Christ, the only begotten Son of God, the seed of Abraham died. He was dead and God the Father raised him from the dead (resurrected him) by his Holy Spirit thus renewing him with the Holy Spirit by giving him the promise of the Holy Spirit.


    If anyone needs scripture just ask.
     
  9. Jerry Shugart

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    Paul is speaking of how he was saved so what he says here has nothing to do with Adam:

    "Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Spirit" (Titus 3:5).

    Paul certainly is not speaking of a repetition of Adam's birth here!
     
    #9 Jerry Shugart, Dec 23, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 23, 2011
  10. The Biblicist

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    This is only true if Paul has no relationship with Adam in the garden of Eden! However, since Paul says he does have such a relationship and says he was "IN" Adam (1 Cor. 15:22) then he must have been "IN" Adam in the garden to be "IN" Adam at all!

    He was "IN" Adam when Adam was spritiually alive and he was "IN" Adam when Adam spiritually died and death of infants prove all mankind was "IN" Adam from the very beginning.

    Hence, your theory is wrong! Regeneration of Paul has reference to his loss of spiritual life "IN" Adam in the fall. How do you know that for sure? Because Paul also says, the "image of God" that God created Adam in, is renewed by regeneration (Eph. 4:24; Col. 3:10). Hence, regeneration renews us in the image of God that was lost by Adam in the fall and all mankind were "IN" Adam because Paul explicitly states that is where death is located

    "IN Adam all DIE" - 1 Cor. 15:22
     
  11. The Biblicist

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    You cannot deny that I Corinthians 15:22 says all mankind were "IN Adam" because that is where death is found "IN Adam ALL die."

    1. How did we get "IN Adam"??

    ANSWER: We had to be "created" IN Adam when Adam was created in Genesis 1:26-27, just as all "IN" Christ must be "created in Christ" (Eph. 2:10).

    2. Therefore, all mankind was "IN" Adam in Romans 5:12 when Adam sinned - You cannot possibly deny that.

    So for you to say that Romans 5:12 is misrepresented if it is interpreted to include ALL mankind IN Adam when Adam sinned is nonsense!
     
  12. savedbymercy

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    the bib

    What about those Jesus says this to ? Jn 8:44

    44Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
     
  13. Jerry Shugart

    Jerry Shugart
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    I said:

    Paul is speaking of how he was saved so what he says here has nothing to do with Adam:

    "Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Spirit" (Titus 3:5).

    Paul certainly is not speaking of a repetition of Adam's birth here!
    To this you say:
    So are you saying that the verse is speaking about Adam's regeneration?

    Of course Paul's words are about his own salvation and regeneration.

    I hope you continue to deny that so that all who are reading this thread can see that you will say anything, no matter how ridiculous, in order to cling to the ideas invented by Calvinism!
     
  14. mandym

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  15. The Biblicist

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    You are simply ignoring what I said instead of responding to it! Paul taught that all mankind are "IN" Adam (1 Cor. 15:22) and you cannot deny that with calling Paul a liar and without denying where death is confined in regard to mankind "IN Adam ALL die"!

    Paul, as well as you and I were CREATED IN ADAM in Genesis 1:26-27. Therefore we were "IN" Adam when Adam was spiritually alive and we were "IN" Adam when he died spiritually. Proof that we were "IN" Adam when he lived and died spiritually is that our own bodies come from Adam. That infants die for no individidualized action of their own.

    Hence, Paul's personal "re-generation" as an individual is in contrast to spiritual life and spiritual death "IN" Adam when the whole human nature lived and died "IN" Adam coporately.

    Furthermore, "re-generation" is always placed in contrast to PHYSICAL birth (Jn. 3:6-7 ("again" meaning as opposed to physical regeneration).

    Therefore, "by one man's offence MANY BE DEAD" as "IN Adam ALL die" but "re-generation comes "IN" Christ!
     
  16. Jerry Shugart

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    You are changing the subject. Here we can see that the "regeneration" is in regard to Paul and his fellow Christians:

    "Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Spirit" (Titus 3:5).

    Paul says that his salvation was made possible by "regeneration." He is not talking about Adam's regeneration. Here is what the word "regeneration" means as we apply it to Paul:

    The word "regeneration" is translated from the Greek word paliggenesia, which is the combination of palin and genesis.

    Palin means "joined to verbs of all sorts,it denotes renewal or repetition of the action" (Thayer's Greek English Lexicon).

    Genesis means "used of birth, nativity" (Thayer's Greek English Lexicon).

    When we combine the meaning of the two words we have a "repetition of a birth."

    So the words at Titus 3:5 are referring to a "repetition" of Paul's birth.

    And it is obvious that the reference is not to a "physical" rebirth, or the repetition of one's physical birth. Paul could only be speaking of a repetition of a spiritual birth. And the words which follow make it certain that the "birth" of which Paul is referring to is a "spiritual" birth--"the renewing of the Holy Spirit."

    This is so simple but since it contradicts the teaching of Calvinism you cannot grasp this truth. You cannot understand that the "regeneration" is speaking about Paul's regeneration despite the evidence!
     
  17. Jerry Shugart

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    Yes, but the "regeneration" spoken of in this verse is not speaking of a physical birth and a spiritual verse but instead a repetition of a spiritual birth:

    "Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Spirit" (Titus 3:5).

    Here Paul uses the word "regeneration" in regard to his salvation. This word is translated from the Greek word paliggenesia, which is the combination of palin and genesis.

    Palin means "joined to verbs of all sorts,it denotes renewal or repetition of the action" (Thayer's Greek English Lexicon).

    Genesis means "used of birth, nativity" (Thayer's Greek English Lexicon).

    When we combine the meaning of the two words we have a "repetition of a birth."

    It is obvious that the reference is not to a "physical" rebirth, or the repetition of one's physical birth. Paul could only be speaking of a repetition of a spiritual birth. And the words which follow make it certain that the "birth" of which Paul is referring to is a "spiritual" birth--"the renewing of the Holy Spirit."
     
  18. The Biblicist

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    You simply repeat yourself, ignore the evidence I placed before you, and presume a conclusion that ignores that another option fully satisfies that text!

    Hence, since you will not even consider the evidence placed before you, then the only rational response to you is Paul's words - if any man be ignorant let him be ignorant
     
  19. mandym

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    You are imposing on scripture that this is a repetition of a spiritual birth. Its not there. It is a repetition of a birth. Same as John 3
     
  20. The Biblicist

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    You are exactly right!

    Jn. 3:6 That which is [1] born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is [2] born of the Spirit is spirit.
    7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

    Jesus is responding to Nicodemus' question if he had to RE-enter his mother's womb a SECOND time!

    The response of Jesus is that there must be TWO births different in kind! The first is of the flesh while the second is of the Spirit. Nicodemus had been born of the flesh so Jesus told him not to marvel that he must be born "again" or according to the SECOND birth previously described.

    Hence, re-generation merely refers to another generation that is different in kind the first which is "of the flesh."
     

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