Repentance needed for Salvation?

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by gekko, Jul 28, 2006.

  1. gekko

    gekko
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    hey all.

    at it again. sorry. :)
    ---

    just some questions here to try and clear some stuff up...

    is repentance a work?

    or is repentance a response?

    do we deserve God's forgiveness? no.

    God gives us the ability to repent - and God fogives us.

    we do not merit to deserve God's forgiveness do we?

    what do you think?
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    also: why would repentance be mentioned along with faith (repentant faith) at least thirty times in the new testament if repentance wasn't needed for salvation?
    ---

    so my question: is repentance a work?
    have you got scripture to support your answer?
    ---

    im just trying to clear some stuff up here.
     
  2. christianyouth

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    While gekko, your still going at it! :)

    IMO, Yes.
     
  3. StraightAndNarrow

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    Is anything required for salvation? You can believe that if you like. The Bible says otherwise. But of course it's easier to do nothing.
     
  4. gekko

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    ooh. so i can sit back watch some movies sip some teat - and i can have salvation?

    sweet. why didn't i know that before?
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    sir, i thought the scriptures pointed out that faith and belief are needed for salvation?

    im just wondering - is that a repentant faith?
    is that repentance a "work"?
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    what did you mean by the first part? haha. you lost me there.

    you think that repentance is a "work"? do you have any legit proof for that?
     
  5. Rex77

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    Is calling a Work?



    Ac 2:21 And it shall come to pass, [that] whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.

    Ro 10:12 ΒΆ For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.

    Ro 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

    Ro 10:14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?
     
  6. gekko

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    no rex... calling is not a work - its a response - not a work.
    ---

    lets put it like this:

    I come into class where my best friend is and punch him in the guts - i decide later that i want to be reconciled to my friend and i go back to my friend and say "friend - i am really sorry" - and my friend says "hey - i forgive you" - and he restores our friendship by granting forgiveness.

    would anybody hearing this situation say "boy - gekko sure did deserve forgiveness 'cause he said he was sorry" ?

    no. of course not.
    the same thing is true with repentance - we apologize because it is right - its not a work - its nothing that earns us forgiveness - its the correct response - its not a work, it doesn't merit salvation - it doesnt merit forgiveness - its the right response.

    if repentance is a work - then the NT shouldn't have put it in there 'bout 30 times.

    Jesus commands us to repent.

    its not a matter of "believe now - repent later"
     
  7. Helen

    Helen
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    Is repentance needed for salvation?
    Absolutely.

    Is it a 'work'? No. Christ did the work for us. However, there is effort involved, mentally. It is a response to the truth about yourself and a sort of mental 'throwing up' when you acknowledge what you are in your natural state. Then it is a desire to change. If you don't want to change, you will be allowed to continue down that same downhill road you are on. Christ does not force Himself upon anyone who doesn't want Him. And you can't even begin to want anything other than yourself until and unless you are heartily sick of yourself.

    To repent is to 'think again', literally. It is to WANT to turn around. We can't do it ourselves, but Christ knows our hearts and if that is what we want, He is there for us to accept or reject (and try to do it on our own, which most people who want to change end up doing, to their own destruction). If we are willing, He will give us a new life in Him and our lives will have that new direction.

    Repentance is the first, and necessary, step.
     
  8. pinoybaptist

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    Repentance is a gift of God to His child given after the fact of regeneration because only the regenerate is capable of Godly sorrow.
    True faith and belief in God can only come from a repentant heart, and a repentant heart is not found in the reprobate.
     
  9. Tom Butler

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    During a mission trip to Romania, I learned that Romanian Baptists call themselves "repenters," not "believers."

    What would we say about someone who says, "I am placing my faith in Jesus Christ, but I will not repent of my sins and turn from them."? Can we truly separate saving faith and a godly sorrow for sin?

    It's saying "I love you, Lord, but I will not follow you or obey you."
     
  10. TheRev

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    What reason does one have to call upon the Lord and exercise faith in Him if he/she doesn't recoginze his/her deplorable condition in the first place? I have no reason to get saved if I don't realize I need to do an about face and embrace the Savior. Seems logical that repentance is an attitude of the heart that ultimately manifests in a changed life. Is it a work? No. But if it is real good works will follow. :thumbs:
     
  11. webdog

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    On this rare occasion, I would have to say I agree. The timing of the regeneration is a different story, though :D
     
  12. LeBuick

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    I agree with response also, it is a responce to the goodness and call of GOD.

    Jesus said,

    Lk 5:32 I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance

    Rm 2:4 Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?
     
  13. PeterM

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    IMHO the act of repentance is evidence that the saving work of regeneration has already occured in the heart and mind of the person. Repentance cannot bring about salvation as thay would be a work but it can be the necessary evidence that the person is undergoing the sanctifying work that can only begin AFTER justification.

    Blessings
     
  14. gekko

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    salvation consists both of a repentant faith and belief.

    its not "believe now - repent later because its evidence."

    no - God does not hear the unrighteous - repentance is part of salvation.

    its the correct repsonse - its not a work.

    the Lord gives us the ability to give that response - we dont merit forgiveness.

    its a response - not a work.
     
  15. J. Jump

    J. Jump
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    While I'm not surprised at the answers it continues to amaze me.

    Nowhere in Scripture is repentance said to be a gift.

    Who is the one that actually changes his or her mind? If it is God then repentance is not a work. If it is man then repentance is a work. Repetance is a (wo)man changing his/her mind. Repentance is a work.

    Repentance is not required for eternal salvation. IF repentance is required then Ephesians 2:8-9 and Acts 16:30-31 and Romans 4 are lies. And if repentance is necessary for eternal salvation then Christ's works are not as valuable as the Bible says they are.

    The Bible says believe and you WILL BE saved. Not shall be, not might be, not a possibility, but believe and you WILL BE saved.

    Why does Christendom try to complicate the simple message of grace through faith apart from works.

    If I change my mind about my sin and decide I'm not going to live that way then God owes me salvation because of my decision to "be good" from now on.

    Eternal salvation is based ONLY on the finished works of Jesus Christ in His substitutionary death and shed blood to pay the penalty of sin on behalf of the believing sinner.
     
  16. LeBuick

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    JJump, define the word repent? How does one repent?
     
  17. J. Jump

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    Great question! Repentance is a changing of one's mind in regard to the subject that is being discussed.
     
  18. Tom Butler

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    Actually there is.

    Act 5:30-31 30 The God of our fathers raised u Jesus, whom ye slew and hanged on a tree. 31. Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Savior, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sin.

    II Tim 2:24 In meekness instructing those who oppose themselves, if God peradventure [perhaps] will grant them repentence to the acknowledging of the truth.

    It, along with faith, is granted sovereignly and unilaterally, making our salvation all of God and none of us. This destroys any notion that repentance is a work.
     
    #18 Tom Butler, Jul 29, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 29, 2006
  19. LeBuick

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    Kind of like what happen to Saul on the Demascus road?

    If ones does not accept the word of GOD, he is said to be unrepentant. I still say repentace is not a work, it is a response to GOD moving in your spirit. The goodness of GOD leadeth to (not makes one) repententh...
     
  20. genesis12

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    Come on, guys. The Holy Spirit is the mover here, not me. If I'm sitting at this keyboard and come under conviction of my "lost" status, then I turn to Him. He has found me, and I respond. Even the ability to respond is a movement of the Holy Spirit. I can't simply decide to be a Christian. That's an intellectual argument. I'm sitting here at this keyboard and I decide "I think I'll be a Christian. OK, I will." That's MT. The convicting power of the Holy Spirit and my yielding to His grace through faith is all spiritual, never intellectual.

    I'm sorry for my sin / sins. I turn away from them. I call upon the name of the Lord, crying out for forgiveness, loudly professing my faith in Him and Him alone. I cry, "Lord, help my unbelief!"

    Or.... I become aware of my sinful estate through a movement of the Holy Spirit. Under conviction, I grieve. I thank God for His revelation of Himself to me. I say "Come into my heart, Lord Jesus." Whether I repent and turn (get convicted and ask Him in) or turn and repent (grieve and ask Him in) is six of one and half-dozen of the other. In either case I become a child of His, and that is cause for rejoicing, not cause for debate. The JOY now present in my life ends all questioning. It is time now to grow in His knowledge, wisdom, and strength, setting aside all childish arguments about HOW He became so real to me.
     
    #20 genesis12, Jul 29, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 29, 2006

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