Resurrection 'On the Fifth Day'?

Obtained from 'www.truthontheweb.org' (Not that I agree with all they teach). But this is a snip from a good article.

The Morrow After the Sabbath

"And ye shall count unto you from the morrow after the Sabbath, from the day that ye brought the sheaf of the wave offering; seven sabbaths shall be complete: Even unto the morrow after the seventh Sabbath shall ye number fifty days; and ye shall offer a new meat offering unto the LORD." (Leviticus 23:15,16)
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Now, those who hold to a Nisan 16th date for beginning the count, whether they reckon by actual new moons or the CRC, teach that the word translated "Sabbath" in verse 16 (shabbath--Strong's #7676) should actually be translated as "week." Such a translation is necessary for this type of Pentecost reckoning due to the fact that Sivan 6 does not always occur on the day after a weekly Sabbath (nor do Sivan 5 or 7, for that matter) as required by Leviticus 23:16. But, if shabbath should be translated "week" in verse 16, it should likewise be so translated in verse 15 regarding which day to begin the count. Such a systematic theology though damages their doctrine for it does away with Nisan 16 as a starting point (since with such a translation, the count does not need to begin on a day after a Sabbath either).
But, is it even true that shabbath should be translated as "week"?

7676 Shabbath "intermission, i.e., (spec.) the Sabbath." (Strong's Hebrew and Aramaic Dictionary of the Old Testament)
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The fact is, shabbath is never rendered "week" in Scripture, nor is it ever used to refer to the first day of the Feast of Unleavens as those who hold to a Nisan 16 Elevation Sheaf Day propose.
Now, some may ask, isn't Pentecost also called the "Feast of Weeks" though?

"Seven weeks shalt thou number unto thee: begin to number the seven weeks from such time as thou beginnest to put the sickle to the corn. And thou shalt keep the Feast of Weeks unto the LORD thy God with a tribute of a freewill offering of thine hand, which thou shalt give unto the LORD thy God, according as the LORD thy God hath blessed thee." (Deuteronomy 16:9,10)
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Yes, Pentecost is the Feast of Weeks, however, the word translated "weeks" in the Scripture above (as well as Exodus 34:22; Numbers 28:26; and II Chronicles 8:13) is NOT shabbath, but rather it is shabuah:
7620 Shabuah "lit. sevened, i.e., a week." (Strong's Hebrew and Aramaic Dictionary of the Old Testament)
Shavuah is the Hebrew word that means "week." If God intended for Pentecost to be reckoned without regard to the weekly Sabbaths, He would have inspired Moses to use this word, instead of Shabbath, in Leviticus 23:15,16.
For those who contend with the Strong's lexicon definitions given above:
Search the Holy Scripture to find wherein "Shabbath" is used in reference to a week and not the weekly Sabbath itself.
Search the Holy Scripture to find where the first day of the Feast of Unleavens is ever referred to as the "Shabbath" [Leviticus 23:15 & 16 both use the definitive article (i.e., "the"--as opposed to "a") in reference to Shabbath]. What is the only other reference to "shabbath" in Leviticus 23 prior to its use in verses 15 & 16? (the answer is found in verse 3). This contextual relation thus further shows what word ("the Sabbath" as opposed to "the week") and what day ("the Sabbath" as opposed to "the first day of the Feast of Unleavens") was meant by "shabbath" in verses 15 & 16.

 

De Sutton:
"Have you recognised whose it is? (sic)" "Sic" because of 'whose'? Please tell me, because mine was no typing error, and I would like to know what is wrong here?

 

Samuel Owen who quoted, "His body laid in the tomb for the first three days of this feast, from the 15th through the 17th of Nisan. "

I have very casually browsed through your last two posts, so had I searched carefully, I'm sure I would have found a lot else before I found this, above, very questionable statement.

As for this quoted statement, I challenge anyone in this world to present one Scripture in support of it. The statement is one big mistake composed of a lot of inaccuracies. I immediately realised, same old story all over. The author's research-input and the whole caboudle despite.

Ag, you know, I have said these things so many times before, it actually tires me physically to repeat and repeat them. Therefore please do me and maybe yourself the favour, and download at no costs whatsoever from http://www.biblestudents.co.za every imaginable aspect of the 'issue'. There are complete books, but also short extracts and articles.

I'll post you one page, I have found helped most people a lot.
I like 'The last week' pamphlet, best, for many reasons. Besides the history of this little pamphlet's origin which was very personal and intense for myself, it is short; it is purely Scriptures; it is plain language; it is clear uncomplicated fact. I love it, because I 'arranged' rather than 'authored' it. It is simple; it is spontaneous, and silently and gently convincing.

I may say these nice things about this little study, I say again, because it consists of the Scriptures only.

Please let me know if it was of benefit to you?

 

5.3.3.2.2.2.1.

From the first to “the third day according to the Scriptures”. . .​

. . . the first day, 14 Nisan, “Preparation of the Passover”, Thursday, begins :

“Evening” – Preparation for, and the Lord’s Supper

Mk.14:12, 17, Lk.22:7, 14, Jn.13:1-17:26 ​

“Night” – Anguish, Betrayal, Denial
Mk.14:26-42, Jn.18:1-27 (Mt.12:40 – retrospective prophecy)

“Early” – Trial, Delivered, Way to Cross
Jn.18:28-19:22

Middle Day – Crucifixion, Mocking, Darkness,

Mk.15:25, 29, 33, Jn.19:23-29

“The ninth hour”, Afternoon – Died, deserted

Mt.27:46, Jn.19:30, Lk.23:48
. . . the second day, 15 Nisan, Passover Feast, “The Fore-Sabbath”, Friday, begins:

“Evening” – Jews, “after this”, Joseph
Jn.19:31-40, Mk.15:42, Mt.27:57, Lk.23:52;
“Night” – Took the body down, prepared
Mk.15:42-46b, Mt.27:58-59, Lk.23:53a Jn.19:32-40
“Afternoon” – Buried
Mk.15:46c-47, Mt.27:60-61, Lk.23:53b-56b, Jn.19:41-42

. . . “the third day”, 16 Nisan, First Sheaf Wave Offering, “Sabbath”, begins :

“Began to rest”
Lukas 23:56c

“Afternoon” – Resurrection
Only Matthew 28:1-4 (Mk.16:9 – implied)

. . . the fourth day, 17 Nisan, Sunday, begins :
“The Sabbath past”
Only Mark 16:1

“Early darkness”, first sight of opened grave
Only John 20:1-2
“Deep morning”, planned visit, Marys, Salome and other women
Only Luke 24:1-11
“Very early dawn”, Marys and Salome affirm
Only Mark 16:2 further (Lk.24:24 – implied)

“Early”, Sunrise, first Appearance to Mary only
Only John 20:11-18 (Mk.16:9 – reference)
Early daylight – second appearance, to other women
Only Matthew 28:5-15
“Afternoon”, Appearance to two “disciples”
Only Luke 24:13-32, (Mk.16:12-13 – implied)

. . . the fifth day, 18 Nisan, Monday, begins :

“Being evening (that day having been the First Day)”, upper room
Lk.23:33 further, Jn.20:19 further, Mk.16:14
“So shall the Son of Man have been in the heart of the earth for three days and for three nights” when raised from the dead “for a sign”! Matthew 12:40.

 

"His body laid in the tomb for the first three days of this feast, from the 15th through the 17th of Nisan. "

"This feast" --
(1) The whole monthe of Abib? "Observe the month of Abib". Obviously not.
(2) The whole of 'Passover' as 'Feast'? the 'Season' of Passover 'Feast', INCLUDED the "Preparation of the Passover" and of its 'sabbath' Obviously not, for this statement isn't speaking of Nisan 14.
(3) The first day of Unleavened Bread Feast? Possibly; but only as the Feast of Unleavened Bread EAT, the first day of which, was Nisan 15, yes! But Unleavened Bread 'Feast' may also include it's "Day of de-Leaven" / "when they removed leaven" and if they did not, they had to be removed from the People by death!

Nisan 14 was the day "They had to SLAUGHTER the Passover (lamb)". Here one's count of the "three days and three nights" should start -- not from Nisan 15 when the lamb was eaten together with the first unleavened bread.

The right day to start with! Nisan 14, and not Nisan 15!

That is the first point.

Next point: Where does being "In the heart of the earth" begin? In other words, What, constitutes, being "in the heart of the earth"?

 

"His body laid in the tomb for the first three days of this feast, from the 15th through the 17th of Nisan. "

Does "His body laid in the tomb" mean, Jesus' being "In the heart of the earth"? No. Then what? "In the heart of the earth" is symbolic language, so don't expect a literal "body laid in the tomb" its meaning, for it is not its meaning, because not literally! The only thing that could fulfill the true meaning of being "in the heart of the earth" shall correspond with Jonah's spiritual experience of having been in the fish. Jonah said he descended as it were into hell. In what does Jesus' experience correspond to Jonah's experience? In his suffering, truly through His tasting of hell's anguish from that "My hour has come" -- that was also the "hour of wicked men". Jesus' spiritual anguish marks the beginning of His being 'in the heart of the earth'. Of course his physical suffering was one aspect of this spiritual suffering of His. But the first day of the three days within which Jesus would suffer death and would be crucified and died, began with this His hour and the "hour" that He had to "Glorify" His Father in. The day of Nisan 14 is marked with it; not Nisan 15.

 

Nisan 14 was the day “They had to slaughter the passover (lamb)”, and, had to “remove leaven from all the land”! Here’s where one’s count of “This feast” and, the ‘three days and three nights’ of Mt12:40 should start— with this day with its beginning with sunset -- not from Nisan 15 in the night of which the lamb was eaten; not together and while at the same time the first unleavened bread was being eaten. The right day to start the (whole) ‘Passover-Feast’ with, is Nisan 14, and not Nisan 15. The right day to start ‘The-Unleavened-Bread’ with, is Nisan 15, and not Nisan 14.

That is the first point.

Next point: “So shall the Son of Man be in the heart of the earth, three days and three nights.” Where does being “In the heart of the earth”, begin? In other words, What constitutes, being “in the heart of the earth”?

“His body laid in the tomb for the first three days of this feast, from the 15th through the 17th of Nisan”? Does ‘His body laid in the tomb’ mean, Jesus’ having been ‘In the heart of the earth’?

“In the heart of the earth” is symbolic language, so don’t expect a literal “body laid in the tomb” its meaning, for it is not its meaning, because its meaning is not literal, but figuratively is, “in the heart of the earth”! The only thing that could fulfil the true meaning of being “in the heart of the earth”, will correspond with Jonah’s experience when literally in the fish he spiritually ( or figuratively) had been “in the heart of the earth”. One cannot live through something while being dead; so being “in the heart of the earth”, cannot have been when Jesus had been in the grave, dead. Jonah said he descended as it were alive, into hell. In what does Jesus’ experience correspond to Jonah’s experience? In his suffering the pangs of death, Jesus truly tasted of hell’s anguish alive. Jesus’ being ‘in the heart of the earth’ was His having tasted of hell’s anguish alive. Alive— from that “My hour has come” – His ‘hour’ that was also the “hour of wicked men”. Jesus’ spiritual anguish marks the beginning of His being ‘in the heart of the earth’; He had to bear the hour of God’s wrath on the wickedness of all men.

Of course his physical suffering was one aspect of this, Jesus’ spiritual suffering. But the first day of the three days within which Jesus would be crucified and would suffer death, would begin with this His ‘hour’, in that He would “glorify” His Father, willingly and consciously – working towards its fulfilment “according to the Scriptures” of the Law! The day of Nisan 14 is marked with this hour specifically as ‘Passover’; not Nisan 15. Nisan 15 is marked with something else as specifically ‘Passover’, which was its assignment to be ‘Feast’ of the eating of the Passover lamb, together with the first eating of or ‘feasting’ on unleavened bread – its ‘Feast’, called the ‘sabbath’ of the Passover and ‘sabbath-of-Unleavened-Bread-Feast(-High-Day)’. Nisan 14 was the first day of the ‘eight-days-Feast-of-Passover’; Nisan 15 was the first day of the ‘seven-days-Passover-Feast-of-Unleavened-Bread’. Any explanation of the Passover’s dates and days that not first of all explains the differences between Nisan 14 and Nisan 15, without further consideration or fear to miss out on something valuable, can be disposed of as erroneous and futile.

 

Quoting Samuel Owen who quoted another, “On the evening of the 14th the Passover lamb was killed, cooked, and eaten during the night.”

This is not so simple! It here seems very simple because the author speaks as though from Exodus only, without having paid attention to what the rest of the Old Testament Scriptures say on the subject. It amounts to this, that it is true that “On the evening of the 14th the Passover lamb was killed”, but it is true while “evening” is correctly understood for ‘afternoon’, first of all, to distinguish between what was done before sunset and what was done after sunset; what, during daylight, and during night-time. Because the lamb in fact was “cooked, and eaten during the night” after sunset. Now this ‘eating’ or ‘feasting’ of the lamb during the night, is in all the Old Testament except Exodus, expressly stated done on “the fifteenth day of the First Month” – never, on Nisan 14, as in Exodus only.

This is a most basic and most important distinction one must never loose sight of (but always is overseen and deemed as of no consequence, either by ignorance, laziness, or prejudice). On Nisan 14 the lamb was killed – on the very day “they removed leaven from all the land”. So Nisan 14 before sunset had to be the day Jesus was crucified and died on. On Nisan 15 after sunset, “during night”, “the lamb was cooked and eaten” – and the process of its assimilation with the earth or back to the earth, was begun. The lamb’s eating was the beginning of the process, and the removal of the remains of it out of the land of Egypt was the continuing of its process of assimilation back to the earth; and its burning was the completion of its process of re-assimilation with the earth, or, of its ‘interment’— “dust to dust” – symbolic or figurative of Jesus’ interment or burial! This was Nisan 15 throughout, no longer, Nisan 14 as in Exodus!

Jesus could not be buried on the same day He was crucified and died on! It would be contrary its ‘Passover-appointment’. Therefore the quoted sentence, “On the evening of the 14th the Passover lamb was killed, cooked, and eaten during the night” from no point of view can be acceptable, either, meant it, “On the evening of the 14th the Passover lamb was killed” and “during the night” it was “cooked, and eaten”, or, everything “during the night”, as it stands, “On the evening of the 14th the Passover lamb was killed, cooked, and eaten during the night”. The lamb was never “killed, cooked, and eaten during the night”. It is a climactic conclusive lie of this ‘lot of research and homework’. Throw it in your rubbish bin!

 

I’m quoting Samuel Owen who quoted, “The day following Passover, the 15th of Nisan, began the feast of Unleavened bread. This feast covered seven days, from the 15th to the 21st of Nisan.”

Yes, and no. The ‘Passover Feast’, ‘covered’ more than just “seven days from the 15th to the 21st of Nisan”.

The ‘Passover Feast’, ‘covered’ also Nisan 14 – ‘covered’ also what this statement calls “Passover” as such.

As much as “this feast covered seven days from the 15th to the 21st of Nisan”, “this feast” also ‘covered’ eight days from Nisan 14 to the 21st of Nisan. Nisan 14 as much as for being the day of the slaying of the lamb, for being the day of the removal of leaven— ‘by ordinance’ –, belonged to ‘the Passover’! ‘Unleaven’ or ‘remove leaven’ and ‘slaughter lamb’ – Nisan 14 – equally belong to ‘the Feast of Unleavened Bread’ and ‘the Feast of Passover’. Just like any day of the eat of Unleavened Bread from the 15th to the 21st of Nisan belonged to “the Passover”, did the “Preparation of Passover” Nisan 14, belong to “the Passover”.

 

Quoting Samuel Owen who quoted, “[15th & 21st], were “High Sabbath” days, although they do not necessarily fall on the weekly Sabbath. “High Sabbath” days are mandatory rest days which occur during some feast days.” Only keep in mind “mandatory rest” is a relative idea; it does not exclude all and any labour, physical or not. In fact, Nisan 15 High Day of Passover, being ‘Passover’s sabbath’, was the day upon which God commanded the Israelites to leave Egypt – with all its implications as far as ‘mandatory’ work, was concerned!

 

Quoting Samuel Owen who quoted, “His body [His flesh] was laid in the tomb just before sunset, when the “High Sabbath” of the Feast of Unleavened Bread began.” Concerning this ‘question’ see above, p 15-16 above, re ‘in the heart of the earth’. Here, I pay attention to “laid in the tomb just before sunset’. In stead of repeating all the arguments, I shall only reiterate the outcome of those arguments, that the true texts of both the Hebrew and the Greek only confirm what is found in Dt21:23 even as translated, that the body “shall not remain on the tree all night”, but shall be removed before the sun has risen, or, literally, before “light / sunrise”, and not before sunset or darkness.

Yea, what is interesting in this very case at hand, the author while contradicting himself, confirms what I say, saying, “...before sunset, when the “High Sabbath” of the Feast of Unleavened Bread began”. Now when does a ‘day’ (of night and day according to the Bible now) ‘begin’? It begins as soon as the sun has set – not as soon as the sun has risen! Therefore how could the body be laid in the tomb before sunset yet when the day had begun? It doesn’t make sense because the whole concept and all its parts are plainly wrong. The correct facts are that the body was taken down in that beginning night of Nisan 15, before sunrise, and was laid in the tomb the same day after, so that Joseph could close the grave about three o’clock Friday “afternoon”— perfectly fulfilling the prophetic significance of both Dt21:23 and the Passover Law.

This overseen division between Day of Crucifixion and Day of Interment found in Mk14:12, Mt26:17 and Lk22:7 (see p 14 above), is surely the biggest flaw in all the known ‘chronologies’ of the ‘Passion week’. It is a trait of especially Ed Sutton’s theory, seeing he too places Crucifixion and Burial on the same day before sunset. How he gets past Mk.14:12/17, Mt26:17/20, Lk.22:7/13-14, Jn.13:1/17:26, only he will know or could explain.

 

Quoting Samuel Owen who quoted, “Firstfruits: [Lev. 23:9-14] During the seven day Feast of Unleavened Bread fell a Sunday.” Now this is the biggest nonsense out, and giving “Lev. 23:9-14”, is most assuming. Can’t these people think of anything genuine? In answer, I present the following, obtained from www.truthontheweb.org (Not that I agree with all they teach). But this is a snip from a good article.

The Morrow After the Sabbath
“And ye shall count unto you from the morrow after the Sabbath ...... see previous post

 

Quoting Samuel Owen who quoted, “In the year of the crucifixion, Sunday fell on the 18th of Nisan, three days after Jesus was put in the tomb.”

Dear Samuel Owen, you haven’t given us information on how or where this author got his ‘facts’ from! But I’ll tell you, he sucked it from somebody else’s thumb – not even from his own – both these statements, as a matter of ‘fact’!

(1) On what grounds the taking for granted ‘fact’, “In the year of the crucifixion, Sunday fell on the 18th of Nisan”? In which year was that? You are a gullible soul! You need to put in a lot more research, brother, this writer is deceiving you. He may call himself a Christian, but he teaches lies.

Consult ‘The Lord’s Day in the Covenant of Grace’, Book 1/1 for far more likely options. Personally, I reckon 30 AD the year of our Lord’s death and resurrection. Read Paragraph 5.1.1.6.1.4.1.2, ‘Possible Years of Christ’s Birth’, in which year according to the best of my knowledge the Bible as well as astrometric calculation, place 18th of Nisan on Monday. Jesus wasn’t raised on Monday.

(2) You above have told us, this quoted “article ... is a Thursday (Crucifixion) description”. According to you people three days after Jesus on the day that He was crucified was put in the tomb, would be Thursday “Nisan 14” (day one); Nisan 15 would be Friday (day two); Nisan 16 would be Sabbath (day three); Nisan 17, would be Sunday (day four). Jesus rose from the dead “the third day” – not, the fourth.

(3) The Scriptures for definite teach Jesus was put in the tomb on Friday. As I have shown you and you me, Friday was Nisan 15 – which gives Friday day one; Nisan 16 the weekly Sabbath day two; Nisan 17 Sunday day three “after Jesus was put in the tomb” – but, four days after He was crucified! How can we believe you?

 

Quoting Samuel Owen who quoted, “Pentecost: [Lev. 23:15-21] From the feast of Firstfruits, the Jews were to count seven Sabbaths, [49 days]. The Sunday following the seventh Sabbath, was the Feast of Pentecost, [which means “fiftieth”].” The underlying argument is the same as that for First Sheaf Wave Offering, just repeated, and therefore nothing the stronger except weaker for wear and tear.

 

Quoting Samuel Owen who quoted, “This feast commemorated the giving of the Law to Moses on Mt. Sinai. On that day God himself came down in a cloud on Mt. Sinai in fire and smoke and a blast of Gods trumpet, to establish His covenant with His people. This feast was also a prophecy of the coming of the New Covenant which was consummated on the same day, the Day of Pentecost, with a mighty rushing wind, tongues of fire and miraculous demonstrations of the Holy Ghost.”

This says nothing for Sunday and everything for the Sabbath as that day of God’s fulfilling his great promise on. Consult LD, Appendix to Part 3 / 1, page 2 – Pentecost – “Fiftieth Day” – ‘Lightfoot’ – Forty and ten days to Pentecost, p 321f, and many other places. How Pentecost is actually given by date of month and day, to have been on the Sabbath! See even Book 4 of LD, Jonathan Edwards, Sermons on 1Cor16:2, there considered.

 

God willing, to follow, very interesting points regarding Channukah

 

Quoting Samuel Owen who quoted, “Pentecost: [Lev. 23:15-21] From the feast of Firstfruits, the Jews were to count seven Sabbaths, [49 days]. The Sunday following the seventh Sabbath, was the Feast of Pentecost, [which means “fiftieth”]. This feast commemorated the giving of the Law to Moses on Mt. Sinai. On that day God himself came down in a cloud on Mt. Sinai in fire and smoke and a blast of Gods trumpet, to establish His covenant with His people. This feast was also a prophecy of the coming of the New Covenant which was consummated on the same day, the Day of Pentecost, with a mighty rushing wind, tongues of fire and miraculous demonstrations of the Holy Ghost.”

“The Sunday following the seventh Sabbath, was the Feast of Pentecost, [which means “fiftieth”].” You see, this is what I call arrogance; it shows above anything else, fearless disrespect for the Scriptures. Such disrespect for the Scriptures, it follows naturally, springs from shallow knowledge and understanding, which is evident just by looking at, “Pentecost: [Lev. 23:15-21] From the feast of Firstfruits, the Jews were to count seven Sabbaths”. What’s wrong with “Pentecost: [Lev. 23:15-21] From the feast of Firstfruits, the Jews were to count seven Sabbaths”, you ask? When a person write articles like this, he should know what he’s talking, and to so casually use the denomination ‘feast of Firstfruits’, is inexcusable. The “Lev. 23:15-21 ... feast of Firstfruits”, or the “Lev. 23:15-21 ... Firstfruits” isn’t just any ‘firstfruits’. It is the First Sheaf Wave Offering Before the LORD, and nothing generally above or short of it.

Show me where it is written “From the feast of Firstfruits, the Jews were to count seven Sabbaths”, and I retract what I have ever written. The author of this article’s indifference guarantees there are misconceptions a coming with a speed, or rather, have come upon the reader already. ‘The Jews’ were not supposed “to count seven Sabbaths ... from the feast of Firstfruits”; they were to count, I quote, “from the day after” ‘the feast of Firstfruits’, or, more correctly, I quote, “from the day after the sabbath” which was the ‘sabbath’ and ‘Feast’-day proper of the Passover, not the Sabbath of the week! How many times more must I tell you this? The Passover’s ‘sabbath’ could fall on any day of the week. It is clear from the Bible, and it is clear from Old Testament Jewish tradition. There is no shred of evidence to the contrary. How many times have I challenged people like you to present just one case in favour of your pet theory? And I don’t use the words ‘no shred of evidence’ with the same apathetic nonchalance some of the great thinkers on this forum do.


“This feast commemorated the giving of the Law to Moses on Mt. Sinai.” Exactly. It occurred – its days and dates are there for the record – on the Sabbath, not on Sunday. Let me show you.

 

Therefore it is not in total contradiction with the Midrash to assume the Sabbath for the fiftieth day after First Sheaf 16 Nisan, on condition the event on the fiftieth day – Pentecost - wasn’t the giving of the Law but the giving of the Holy God in Spirit and the Power of his mercy, and on the further condition the date was two days BEFORE 7 Sivan, namely 5 Sivan.

Table cannot post (I'll try a picture later on DV)
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