Rev. Hill executed for killing abortion Dr.

Kiffin said:

I remember reading about many doctor's who gave up doing abortions out of fear. Maybe someone has a link to a story or some numbers for you. I read things but don't save files. Sorry.

In MANY phone books, the address of the abortionist is not available. Women go to one address to be interviewed and then are given the address for the appointment after they have been verified.

Diane

 

JohnV. that is your opinion and I can respect it. That does not make it right. The Death Penalty is not equally administered so the death penalty was leagl, but not just.

 

Well, there's at least one "doctor" for sure who won't be performing anymore abortions.

 

He is a soul that could have been witnessed to by believers but instead was murdered by a so called Reverand. The Bible commands us to love our neigbors. I am frankly disturbed by this sympathetic attitude toward those who believe in "Kill a Abortionist for Jesus". Hill stated before he died Instead of being shocked, more people should do what I did,

Paul Hill was a excommunicated Pastor Hill had 3 children that he left without a Father. He claimed to care about unborn children yet leaves emotional scars on his own.

 

There was a interesting letter sent to Paul Hill by Gary North (who I generaly disagree with) but this time I think North was correct. Unfortunately Hill did not listen to his counsel.

Dear Mr. Hill:

Sometime in the months following the murder of the abortionist in Florida, Dr. Gunn, you sent me two position papers. One was called, "Was the killing of Dr. Gunn Just?" You added this parenthesis: "Rough draft, numerous revisions still being made." Obviously, you have other things on your mind these days besides continuing the revisions of your rough draft. I am responding to this paper belatedly because you seem to have taken your own suggestions seriously enough to shoot an abortionist, kill his escort, and wound the escort's wife. That, at least, is what you are accused of. A jury will decide.

The subtitle on your paper is called, "A Call to Defensive Action." You also sent another paper titled, "`Defensive Action' Is a Pro-Life Organization Proclaiming the Justice of Using All Action Necessary to Protect Innocent Life."

I did not respond to your letter or to your papers. I cannot find your letter in my files, but I did save your two papers. I should have responded. Perhaps I might have persuaded you that you were headed in a terrible direction. In all likelihood, though, you would not have taken me seriously. I say this because you were excommunicated by your church, and you did not take that seriously. Your church asked only that you cease speaking in public -- such as on the "Donahue" show -- in defense of the right of anti-abortionists to kill abortionists. So, there is no good reason for me to believe that you would have taken anything seriously that I might have written. I do not expect you to take this letter seriously. On the assumption, however, that men can repent before they are cast into hell, which is where you are headed if you do not repent. Let me explain why.

I say that you are headed for hell because I speak judicially. You wrote to me, presumably because I am associated with the Christian Reconstruction movement. You are well aware that we are noted for our judicial theology. You attended classes taught by Dr. Greg Bahnsen in the late 1970's at Reformed Theological Seminary in Jackson, Mississippi. In one of your papers, you cite a book by R.J. Rushdoony. We do think judicially and speak judicially. Ask a judicial theologian his opinion, and you should expect a judicial answer.
The New Testament is clear: when a man is excommunicated from his church, he is to be regarded by Christians as a heathen. We are told specifically by John that we are not to wish such a person Godspeed. "Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds" (II John 1:9-11).

The New Testament is equally clear that God honors lawful excommunications. Jesus spoke to church officers: "Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven" (Matt. 18:18). So, I take your excommunication seriously, even though you do not.

You were educated as a Calvinist in a Calvinist seminary. What did Calvin say about excommunication? He cited Matthew 16:19. "And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven." Then he wrote that "the latter applies to the discipline of excommunication which is entrusted to the church. But the church binds him whom it excommunicates -- not that it casts him into everlasting ruin and despair, but because it condemns his life and morals, and already warns him of his condemnation unless he should repent. . . . Therefore, that no one may stubbornly despise the judgment of the church, or think it immaterial that he has been condemned by the vote of the believers, the Lord testifies that such judgment by believers is nothing but the proclamation of his own sentence, and that whatever they have done on earth is ratified in heaven."

When an excommunicate then goes out to create his own house church and serve himself and his family the Lord's Supper, as you did, this goes beyond mere excommunicate status; it goes to the status of outright rebellion. Here is a man who is creating his own church, his own world of supposed judicial authority. Here is a man who is bringing the sacraments of the church into his home, in the name of God, when he has been lawfully condemned by the institutional church and told to repent. That act alone judicially enables me to say that by every judicial standard the Bible offers, you are going to hell. You are in open rebellion. God does not honor those men who flagrantly rebel against His church, set up a home church, and ordain themselves to ministerial status.

What you forgot, and what violent resisters want to forget, is that there is a God in this process, and He does act in history to bring His sanctions. You were not authorized by God to represent the public. You were authorized by God to do non- violent things and suffer the consequences personally. You were authorized by God to stand in the gap and get your head beaten in, maybe on videotape, to be broadcast at the six o'clock news. You were authorized to get the public infuriated against the agents who bashed you head in. That is what you were entitled to do. But you were not entitled to gun somebody down. God allows the sword to be used only by someone who is ordained to do it. "Vengeance is mine, saith the Lord." So says Romans 12:19. Romans 13 says that the state is authorized, as a minister of God (v. 4), to act as God's lawful agent of vengeance. If he brings vengeance against evil doers, then God does not have to, and He will not bring vengeance in history against the society as a whole for authorizing a civil magistrate to do evil.

There is a biblical hierarchy of vengeance. God is at the top, and the civil magistrate is under him. You and any other private citizen are not part of this hierarchy. That is why it says, "vengeance is mine, saith the Lord." You forgot that. Those with a revolutionary bent in their psychology will also forget that.

What you are accused of was not only against civil law, it was against God's law. What you recommend is not only against civil law, it is against God's law. Individuals do not have the right under biblical law to bring violence in the name of the community. They have not been ordained to do it, and they are not part of God's lawful, ordained hierarchy of vengeance.

You were quoted in the "New York Times" (July 31, 1994) as having announced: "My role is a prophetic role. . . ." A prophet in the Old Covenant publicly identified transgressions that were so great that God threatened the society with corporate negative sanctions. The office of prophet disappeared when God ceased to give men totally accurate knowledge of the immediate future. But a prophetic role still exists: identifying public evils and forecasting the kinds of judgments that God brings against such public evils. In this respect, I have served you in a prophetic manner. But I am not alone. Your church warned you prophetically by excommunicating you. You ignored this warning. The state warned you prophetically by passing laws against mur- der. You ignored this warning. I am now warning you. I suggest that you do not ignore this warning.

Very truly yours,

Gary North



Read entire letter at http://www.reformed.org/social/let_2_paul_hill.html

 

Kiffin, are you suggestion that the abortionist needed to be saved and Rev Hill kept him from being saved? Are you saying that the abortionist went to Hell because Rev Hill killed him before he got saved?

 

I am saying that Mr. Hill apparently could care less about the man's soul - That's all. The more we look into the so called Rev. Hill the more disturbing picture we get. Don't Support or sympathize with people who believe Christians should "Kill an Abortionist for Jesus". Hill and his allies are lawless rebels (Mt. 24:12).

 

I believe in the sanctity of life, all life. Hill's crime was despicable but that did not justify his being murdered by the state.

 

Hill was not murdered by the state. Romans 13 gives the State, God sanctioned authority to execute criminals like Mr. Hill.

 

The murder of the abortionist was pre-meditated, and without mercy, as he lay in wait and fired shot after shot until the abortionist quit moving. The abortionist butchered pre-born baby after baby for blood money. My emotions are mixed, for the abortionist is many more times a murderer then the gunman with the shotgun.

Dr. Bob's analogy with the killing of a Nazi, was very astute. The concentration camps were legal. The gas chambers were legal. The execution of millions was legal under German/Nazi law. Abortions are legal. The butchering of pre-born babies is legal. A society is judged on how it treats its most vulnerable, and our nation stands guilty.

This is a prayer I wrote several years ago:

Dear Heavenly Father.We have literally butchered our most helpless upon the alter of convenience. May Your Spirit move upon the heart of the abortionist, may the
scales drop from their eyes and with sheer horror may they look upon the innocent blood dripping from their hands, drop to their knees in prayers for forgiveness, and repent of their sins.

We pray for the mothers that have offered
their babies up to be killed, O'Lord we pray that they will repent of their sins and seek Thy precious forgiveness Dear Lord. We stand guilty before Thee O'Lord,
guilty of complacency, we should have risen up as a mighty army in outrage, back in 1973 when the first babies were slaughtered, but we were silent as the
silent screams began to reverberate, through our collective
conscience.

You judged Israel for allowing the children to be killed upon the alters of Molech, as the blood of babies stained the promised land how much greater is the stain upon our land Dear Lord. How we have failed Thee Dear Lord, we should have purged our land of the alters of abortion,
but we have allowed this to continue, standing silent and unmoving as this insidious evil took control. Oh Lord lead us out of the darkness or let Thy judgement
fall. Too many babies have had to die, it must stop now Dear Lord, and may Thy swift judgement fall upon us all if we fail to repent. May the riches of our country lay
destroyed at Thy feet, dear Father if we fail to repent. How ironic that hands stained with the blood of innocent babies would dare to open Thy precious Word, or to carry it to Church on Sunday.

May we repent of this evil Dear Lord, and may You bring our people out of the darkness and into Thy light.In the name of
the Lamb of God and the returning Lion of the tribe of Judah, the King of Kings and the Lord of Lords, the Lord Jesus Christ, I pray.
Amen and amen.


Abortion is a symtom of a people lost in iniquity and lusting after evil, hearts far from God, eyes blinded by the god of this world. I await the trump of God, and the end of iniquity.


A servant of Christ,
Drew

 

VERY Well Said Drew! Amen!

 

Drew, excellent prayer. Thanks very much for sharing it with us.

One differance it should be remembered between us and Nazi Germany is that when the camps were in place they were a complete dictatorship with no representative government. I am one however who believes that Romans 13 teaches as well as later St. Augustine taught that only authorized agents such as a government has the authority to wage war and execute judgment, not individuals.

The USA is still a republic. I encourage everyone - Vote Pro Life. It is a litmus test with me. Too many Pro life people don't vote. In the end however Washington cannot stop abortion. That requires a changing of hearts and minds, something only the Gospel can ultimately do. That there is legalized abortion in the US is a testimony of how little influence Christianity has had on the USA the past 30 something years.

Abortion is probably America's greatest evil and we should stand up for the rights of the unborn. We however should never condone, sympathize or support anarchists like the "Rev." Hill. They are no more pro life than the abortionists and only damage the pro life movement and move public support for the abortionists and more unborn children are butchered as a result of the actions of such haters.

Thanks again for the prayer.

 

It is not my intentions to offend you, but, you have absolutely no way of knowing if God spoke to Hill or not. This is an assumption that you are making. The doctor's wife is not an innocent bystander. She assisted her husband in slaughtering the babies.

To answer the question someone asked about how many babies were saved by Hill's actions. There were 32 scheduled abortions to be done by the doctor that day. There is no mention of how many others would have been scheduled.

I do not believe that Hill should have killed the doctor. I believe he should have followed the law of the land. I hate abortion. Someone said abortion doctors should be face murder charges. So should the women who have the abortions. Afterall, this is simply contracted murder.

I take an active role in speaking out against this every chance I can. I no longer donate to United Way or any other organization that supports abortion. I write my congressional representatives and the president.

 

You are not offending me. However, I do know God did not speak to him for God does not command anyone to murder people. It is no assumption for God does not contradict His Word. God authorizes Government not individuals to carry out justice (Rom 13).

I agree. It however is not up to fools like Hill to execute that judgment. Government authority should execute that judgment if Pro life legislation and judges would over turn Roe v. Wade. Until then believers should pray for the conversion of abortionists and anti abortion laws and shun violence and also realize that people like "Rev" Hill are heretics that spread lawlessness and murder.

 

A loss of life is a loss of life. I cannot believe you Christians have forgotten about another murderer. Saul..... AKA Paul. He murdered thousands. Then God changed his life and he became one of the most beloved figures in the Bible. If the justice system had killed saul while he was still saul. i don't know where we would be. Who is to say that doctor couldn't have been saved? Can we now pick and choose who should be slain? I think that Captial punishment is just. But, I still mourn the life. Right or Wrong Good or Bad. We need all the Soldiers we can get to minister for the lost. And, it's heartwrenching to me to see a lost soul perish. Jesus said to love EVERYONE. while the doctor's actions were very horrible, and mr. hills actions might have saved lives, it only postponed things it didn't end abortion. the only way we are going to be able to do that is PROVE to the Supreme Court that it is unjust. That it is Illegal to kill newborns, that LIFE begins at conception.

God Bless

 

Actually, the Bible has stories of God commanding people to destroy entire towns including all men, women, children and animals.

God creates all life and says when that life will end. We do not know when we will die. This is why it is important for each and every one of us to accept Christ Jesus as our Saviour and to repent of our sins and ask forgiveness. We should not put off what needs to be done today. For we do not know when our last chance will be.

 

Yes, it does BUT it was only given in the Old Testament Law to Old Testament Israel to destroy the inhabitants of Canaan. Once again God gave it to a Nation to carry out his justice on the pagan nations. You must put this in context or we make God into a sinner. That was not murder but God's judicial action through a government entity. God has never told anyone to murder be it nation or individual. He did use Israel to execute his juducial wrath on the Canaanites but he has never commanded individuals to do such for that is lawlessness.

So no! God did not speak to Mr. Hill. Maybe Satan did. Such theology that says God may have told an individual to "Kill a Abortionist for Jesus" has God violating His own commandments and produces apostates like Jim Jones, David Koresh and Paul Hill.

 

But Paul was repentent after his conversion. Rev Hill was not and even went to lengths to write a book on how to stalk and kill an abortion doctor. This thread is way off on a tangent at this point. The Christians on this thread who are trying to justify Rev. Hill's behavior are probably the same Christians who were so outspoken in their support of impeachment during the Clinton administration. Hey, we DID have a great economy. But according to Christians the ends do not justify the means.....or do they when our point of view is what is in question? To Rev Hill the end was justified by the means and he violated both God's law and man's by taking the life of that Doctor. Now I am no big supporter of abortion or of it's progenators such as the Clintons. There is only one thing that I hate worse than an unrepentant scumbag who uses his/her political position to hide from the fact that they committed a moral and ethical wrong and that one thing is a HYPOCRITE. I'll take a stand and say that most of the apologetics for Rev Hill would tell you that in a situation such as finding a mate to "WAIT, WAIT, WAIT ON THE LORD!" And in the next breath try to make up excuses for Rev Hill's self-absorbed crusade. Rev Hill didn't wait on the Lord - he took matters into his own hands and destroyed a life in the process, breaking one of God's Ten Commandments. Wether you are taking the life of a Doctor performing abortions or the life of an unborn child - it is all murder and Rev Hill will be judged as such for his actions. God did NOT need man when he nuked Sodom and Gommorah or when he sent the Angel to slay the Assyrian army as it camped outside Jerusalem's gates. When we as Christians begin to take up the Sword in service to God is when we need to reread the gospels and try to determine what Christ would have us do.

 

One could use that arguement in pretty much any judicial sentence, so I would hardly call the administration of the death penalty unjust. But that's probably a debate fit for a topic about the ethic natute death penalty.