Rick Santorum to Puerto Rico: If You Want to Become a State You Need to Speak English

Discussion in 'News / Current Events' started by Crabtownboy, Mar 15, 2012.

  1. Crabtownboy

    Crabtownboy
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    I have been watching Santorum as for me he was a new face in national politics. I know he held office, but I did not follow his activities.

    Now that he is in the race to be the Republican nominee for President I have been watchng him and have begun to have doubts about his ability. This was kicked up a notch with his less than brilliant statement about statehood in Puerto Rica. He said:

    1. English is taught in all elementary and high schools in Puerto Rico, and is spoken by many people in the territory.

    2. There is no federal law to comply to concerning English.

    I have not been impressed with his statements on foreign statement. In fairness to him I have not been impressed with Romney's statements either.

    Santorum's thinking appear much to narrow to be a good president.

    Where is Thomas Jefferson now that we need him?
     
  2. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis
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    I fixed it for you.

    So, did Santorum just guarantee a million more votes for team zero ?
     
    #2 Bro. Curtis, Mar 15, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 15, 2012
  3. Crabtownboy

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    Could be. I am sure he did not win over any of the Hispanic vote and I'd bet he lost some. A million? I don't know, but without their vote he will loose.
     
  4. Bro. Curtis

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    Santorum's thinking appear much to narrow to be a good president.

    ...but without their vote he will loose.

    You should apologize for your statement that conservatives can't read. For it is you that cannot write. Most people correct their mistakes when they see them.
     
  5. Bobby Hamilton

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    Maybe it's time that English did become our official, national language.
     
  6. menageriekeeper

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    Why? Are we Americans not bright enough to learn another language? The US has ALWAYS been multi-lingual, because we are a nation of IMMIGRANTS. Somewhere in the last 400 years or so, one or more of your ancestors immigrated to this country speaking the language of their country of origin. (unless of course you are pure Native American)

    There is no reason why we can't accomodate a variety of languages in this country except for pure pig-headedness and/or bigotry. Anything else denies how this country came into existance.
     
  7. Robert Snow

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    Crabtownboy, you sure do seem to attract Curtis' attention with almost any posting. I wonder why he so infatuated with you. Good thing you don't both live in the same town, or he would probably move in next door to you!

    This seems like a stupid statement for Santorum to make, even if he does believe it. This will probably cost him Hispanic votes.
     
  8. Oldtimer

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    Yes, according to our family tree, all the branches that have been traced, so far, my ancestors immigrated to this country speaking the language of their country of origin. ENGLAND! My father's ancestors, in England, came from France. From what I understand, my great times x grandfather had to learn ENGLISH prior to coming to the ENGLISH colonies.

    With English being my native tongue, traced back to England and beyond, why should I be forced to learn any other languages? My x grandfather had to learn English when he immigrated to England, lo those many years ago.

    If I move to a non English speaking country, would I be expected to learn the language there? I don't have any stats, but suspect that in many cases I'd have to learn the language. However, I'm probably more fortunate than most has English has become the world-wide universal language. For example, pilots, flying international flights use English.

    In closing, how many languages should I learn to be in compliance with your train of thought? French, Russian, Japanese, Chinese, Spanish, ...... add the rest of the native languages from around the world to accomodate all immigrants that do not have English as their native or second language? If, I'm to learn in order to accomodate one group, isn't is distrimination if I don't learn the rest of them, too?
     
  9. Bro. Curtis

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    Robert, I sure do seem to attract your attention with almost any posting,(and sometimes without me posting, isn't that right, Robert ?). I wonder why you are so infatuated with me. Good thing I don't live in Houston, because you would probably move in next door to me.
     
  10. menageriekeeper

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    Ah, but not all American colonies were started by the English. The Dutch settled here (my country of origin, well half of it anyhow, the other half is mutt) and the Swedes. The French settled Louisana and the Spanish settled Pueto Rico and California. Why should I have speak English? Who are you to say that I shouldn't be able to go through life speaking my native language? I have just as much right to mine as you do yours.

    The ONLY reason this is even an issue today is because of events and ideas that got started during and after World War 1. In order to control the destiny of "whites" and continue to subjugate newer immigrants and blacks those in control spread about this idea that older immigrants (here the majority were Anglo/Saxon AND British) were somehow superior to newer ones (more likely to be German, Italian and Irish). It was a power issue plain and simple. After the war this idea died down to a certain extent but only after extreme limits had been placed on immigration during the Great War and not completely until after WW2.

    During WW1 there was extreme suppression of free speech which included the banning of teaching the German language in school (public or otherwise) even though previous to the war German had been right up there with Latin and French as best choice of a foriegn/second language. It was not uncommon before this time for each language to have its own newspaper, printed so that each ethnic group could well understand the events in their own language.

    This bias we have against all other languages comes directly from this time period in our history and its a time period when there wasn't a whole lot going on to be proud of.
     
  11. menageriekeeper

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    Btw, the events I spoke about in my last post, were encouraged by Republicans so I'm not surprised by Santorum's remarks.
     
  12. Crabtownboy

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    I guess it is just my magnetic personality. Did you notice he also believes he can add words to my post when he replies, changing what I said. Is that allowed on the board?

    It appears the Republican candidate are playing to the conservatives only. This may help them win the nomination, but they surely are digging a hole for themselves in the general election.

     
    #12 Crabtownboy, Mar 15, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 15, 2012
  13. Bobby Hamilton

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    Perhaps you forgot how this country came into existence? It was taken by brute force. Pure violence and bloodshed. Or have you forgotten?

    Sure we are bright enough to learn a 2nd language but please tell me why everyone should? Then where does it stop? What's the 2nd language we should learn? Spanish? French? Are we going to accommodate one minority over another? Do we all need to be fluent in 3, 4 or more languages. I'm not sure what the statistics are, but why should the majority flip 180 for the minority. There is accommodating, and then there is going overboard. Anyone who doesn't think America tries to accommodate everyone (except Christians) needs to take a look at the larger picture.

    My comment has nothing to do with bigotry or pig-headedness. People sneak into this country, don't pay taxes, take advantage of our healthcare system and expect us to learn their language when they don't respect our laws and customs? It's a slippery slope to us ending up like the people we took over (which I guess would be fair game...we all reap what generations in front of us sowed ).

    Also, please tell me why we can't make that our national language and still accommodate others? It's not like I said "let's make English the national language and arrest everyone else who speaks something else"
     
  14. Bobby Hamilton

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    You are right...you absolutely do.

    And that has nothing with the United States having an official language. Do you not see that?
     
  15. Oldtimer

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    You have the right to speak any language you choose. If I implied that I think otherwise in my post, I apologize.

    I don't have any opposition to a community to have newspapers published in the language of their choice. Speak any language you choose in your home and with your family. Personally, I think it's a good idea to retain native languages as well as learning English, for people living in countries where the primary language is English.

    You've pulled out war time situations to help carry your point. That's fine, but it is an exception, rather than the rule. WW1 & WW2 cover, what -- 8-10 years on the outside? Special circumstances and sometimes decisions, in 20-20 hindsight that were not the best ones that could have been made.

    Let me simplify and re-ask my questions that you didn't address.

    (1) How many other non-English speaking countries in the world, make learning the languages of immigrants morally or legally required?

    (2) How many languages should the people of the US learn in order to accomodate the desires of immigrants entering this country?

    Let me add a third question, if you don't mind.

    Our school systems teach English at all grade levels. Community colleges frequently include classes to teach English. There are numerous programs available for those who want to learn English, as a second language. There are private tutors, and I believe, computer based learning opportunities.

    (3) IF A PERSON CHOOSES to come to this country, shouldn't he or she make the committment to avail themselves of opportunities to learn to speak English?

    If I decide to go to Italy, should I demand that the Italian government and Italian people read/speak/publish everything in English? If I happened to be from Turkey, should Italy accomodate Trukish and all of the other minority languages, too? Should the US do the same thing?

    In closing, this poses the thought. If end times will have one world religion and one world government, will it also have one world language? If so, which one? Will it be the same one spoken in the Garden of Eden?
     
    #15 Oldtimer, Mar 15, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 15, 2012
  16. billwald

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    Last thing we need is a 51st state, 90% on welfare.
     
  17. menageriekeeper

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    Oh so making them learn English is going to stop them from coming over the border illegally? I don't think so. Something you all may not know is that Mexicans have been coming over the border to work in this country for at least a century! And they were welcomed! They weren't always treated fairly (minimum wage laws were never applied to them), but they were here. You have your big business (remember who supports big business?) to thank for that and we are exactly reaping what they sowed in years not to distant in time.

    Let me repeat: The United States has never had an official language. English was simply the language of the majority in the beginning and the rich and/or powerful thoughout the years. Other groups kept their language and either learned enough English to survive or set their kids to learning our language. That makes them smarter than us because they weren't too proud to learn a second language.

    1) what difference does that make? If the other English speaking countries of the world want to jump off the bridge into nationalized health care, does that mean the US should follow suit?

    And what other English speaking countries are you talking about? Canada? Nope, their citizens learn both English and French. England? The country who's judges allow Sharia law to hold sway in their courtrooms? Phft! Okay, if you want to follow their lead.......just don't ask me too.

    2)How many languages? Just enough to get along in your own community. If you have a large population of Spanish speakers, learn the language. IF not, you can stick with English. :) If some other group lives in numbers around you, learn the language if you want to do business with them.

    3) this is another one of those questions of free choice. Do they need to learn English in order to survive here or is there a community of their own ethnicity that they can join and continue to speak only their own? We have a huge variety of ethnic groups in this country. And I'll admit, sometime it is difficult for government services who have to deal with the language differences, but those folks who work those jobs, picked their carreer so they can learn what they need to do earn their paycheck.

    Not pick at straws, but this was the prevailing thought from the beginning of WW1 until well into WW2 a period of nearly 30 years. And unfortunately it was the exception that created the rule.
     
  18. menageriekeeper

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    Bilwald, you have a link for that stat?
     
  19. Bobby Hamilton

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    Link to me ever saying that?

    You took a simple statement I made and ran with it, and made all sorts of implications and assumptions.

    I simply stated we should make English our National Language. I'll stick by that all day long, because that is THE main language. And what's scary, it's becoming the main 2nd language for most of the rest of the world.

    I never implied that it should be forced on someone. But our tax dollars should NOT be spent in efforts to force a learned language on anyone. So that "aren't American's smart enough to learn a 2nd language" statement is very naive, and IMO very wrong. It's not our job to learn what outsiders speak, it's their job to learn what we speak. That's just basic common sense, and cultural respect. On top of that, not following established customs and laws is both rude and illegal.

    We are instructed to give unto Caesar what is Caeser's, and to give unto God what is God's. While I know I've ventured off topic a bit (but only following your comment above)...the Mexicans (or anyone) who is coming here and earning wages and not paying on it....well, that's also just flat wrong. And there is a pretty good correlation between those people who don't pay taxes and the fact they don't speak English. Obviously (as you stated above) learning the language probably isn't going to change anything, and some of the fine Americans who are taking advantage of these people are just as much to blame (I use the term "fine" lightly).

    Do we have American deadbeats who don't pay taxes? Sure we do. Does any illegal pay taxes? Probably not.

    Anyways, end of rant. You want to speak Spanish, German, French, whatever...fine by me. That is your right. But don't expect me to understand what you're saying, tell me I'm wrong by not agreeing with you on the subject, or get upset because I don't understand your language...because frankly, I don't want to learn it, nor should I HAVE to. That's not my role, at least not in what I do. I'll do my best to go out of my way to help anyone, but English is hard enough as it is. If I decide to venture outside of these United States, then I will take it upon myself to learn whatever language is necessary to communicate wherever I go.
     
  20. Bobby Hamilton

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    1. So now it's okay to pick and choose what leads we follow if it suits you? "Oh well, "X" county only has one language, but they have a poor economy, that must mean following them would be wrong". Just sounds kind of out there.

    2. In some locales, this changes on a very regular basis. Look at the Dallas/Arlington/Irving/Ft Worth (basically Metroplex area). Do you realize how unrealistic it is to ask educators to change this on a very short whim, and to change that type of curriculum on a regular basis? I live in Indiana, and in some of our schools non speaking English kids aren't being taught to speak English, and it is a huge distraction on everyone else (this both falls on the fault of the school systems, and the parents of the non speaking english kids who push to not learn english) They go to school for years with these kids who speak English, yet they can't communicate. They are often in trouble, etc. Why? Why is that needed? Why don't we make it mandatory educate them? That's just plain stupid.

    3. Anyone who wants to earn MY business, better speak English. Simple as that. And that "my" isn't about "Bobby Hamilton"...as much as it is like people who are similar to me. If I go to a place where I can't communicate with a merchant, I'll go somewhere that I can. Again, I wouldn't move anywhere else and try to make a living, and expect people to accommodate me on that front.


    I still fail to see what any of this has to do with the original point I made (although I realize I'm replying to comments you made to someone else).
     

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