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Salvation

Discussion in '2000-02 Archive' started by bart, Apr 22, 2001.

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  1. Joy

    Joy New Member

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    I believe that Bart is Roman Catholic, and that his intentions are not to know the truth, but to make Baptists defend there faith. He answers our questions of him with more questions, or not at all. His circular reasoning has several of us going round and round with him. He is trying his best to cause division and stife between fellow Baptists about what we believe salvation is. These tactics are not new to the board. They are designed to cause doubts in the minds of Christians.

    Fellow believers should beware, and be diligent to answer with Scripture quotations. Bart knows his Bible well enough to take it out of context.

    Remember, he has not answered us about his eternal state in a manner that is satisfactory with the Bible, even after 100 posts of stating and restating clearly from the Bible what a man must do to be saved.

    While clearly all of us weep for his soul, there comes a point where apostacy will not be tolerated.

    Bart, before you ask any more questions, or answer this post, I challenge you to clearly give us the state of your eternal salvation. You say you believe, but has there ever been time when you personally accepted the Lord Jesus Christ as your Savior? Have you confessed your sins to Christ alone and trusted Him for salvation?
     
    #101 Joy, May 3, 2001
  2. renewedspirit1

    renewedspirit1 New Member

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    having been raised catholic, but recently born again by the grace of God, I dont think Bart is catholic (judging by the depth in which he quotes scripture) Church of Christ, though, was a good guess! Bart I agree with all the great info and advise youve recieved so far. I also agree youre a pilgrim in disguise in search of an arguement. Noone knows the bible the way you do and ISN"T a member of some church!!! So which denomination is it? Any one want to take a guess? If you are looking for an arguement why dont you go over to the Jehovah Wittness site-they need all the help they can get over there... I pray you will ask Jesus to come into your heart and begin to have a personal relationship with our Savior!!
     
    #102 renewedspirit1, May 3, 2001
  3. Joy

    Joy New Member

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    Easy renewedspirit! As a Moderator, I took a hard line, but taunting is not necesary. Please be kind one to another. Thank you, JOY
     
    #103 Joy, May 4, 2001
  4. bart

    bart New Member

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    trevor says [​IMG] Do you believe that a man is saved at a certain time and place (ie. at the moment he has faith, or at the moment he is baptized etc.) or is his salvation "being worked out" in a sense by something (works, baptism, etc.)?

    the certain time and place that a man is saved is after he has completed obedience to God, and let me give you this illustration.

    1. hear--romans 10:17
    2. believe--acts 16:31; john 3:16
    3. repent--Luke 13:3; acts 2:38
    4. confess--romans 10:9
    5. baptism--mark 16:16; acts 2:38; acts 22:16; I pet 3:21

    it is after he completes the above that he is saved. i want to illustrate with an old testament example;

    do you remember naaman (man with leprosy)? God told him to go dip in the river 7 times in order for his cleansing. now naaman had to obey God before he would be cleansed. but the point is that naaman was not cleansed until he had completed that last dip. but you see all of the dips worked together, lets say that naaman went to the water and said this "i do not want to dip 7 times for my cleansing, i will just dip once and call that my 7th dip"......do you think his leprosy would have been gone?

    so here is what i believe the bible teaches:
    (new testament)

    hear
    believe
    repent
    confess
    be baptized

    i have already given scriptures for the above and they all have to work together; i do not teach that a person is saved by baptism only,....but on the same token i do not teach that a man is saved by faith only either (james condemns this)....nor repentance only.....nor confession only...............I TEACH THAT A MAN IS SAVED AFTER HE HAS DONE EXACTLY WHAT GOD HAS SAID.........so that is after the last one listed.......(now remember the only eligible canditate for baptism is the person who has heard, believed, repented, and confessed.)

    so again, (to be clear)......a man must hear the word of God, he must believe it, he must confess that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, he must repent, and he must be baptized.
    and then he/she is saved.

    so that should be clear and i appreciate your reply........i will reply to the other questions tonight, i have to go to work.

    thanks trevor.

    bart
     
    #104 bart, May 4, 2001
  5. Danny

    Danny New Member

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by bart:

    the certain time and place that a man is saved is after he has completed obedience to God, and let me give you this illustration.

    1. hear--romans 10:17
    2. believe--acts 16:31; john 3:16
    3. repent--Luke 13:3; acts 2:38
    4. confess--romans 10:9
    5. baptism--mark 16:16; acts 2:38; acts 22:16; I pet 3:21

    it is after he completes the above that he is saved. so here is what i believe the bible teaches:
    (new testament)

    hear
    believe
    repent
    confess
    be baptized

    I TEACH THAT A MAN IS SAVED AFTER HE HAS DONE EXACTLY WHAT GOD HAS SAID.........so that is after the last one listed.......(now remember the only eligible canditate for baptism is the person who has heard, believed, repented, and confessed.)

    so again, (to be clear)......a man must hear the word of God, he must believe it, he must confess that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, he must repent, and he must be baptized.
    and then he/she is saved.

    bart[/QB]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Bart, how were the people in Cornelius' home saved when Peter was preaching to them? (Acts 10:44). It says While Peter was still speaking, the Holy Spirit fell on all who heard the message. They received the Spirit simply by hearing and believing what they heard, not after repenting, confessing, and being baptized.
    Danny

    :rolleyes:
     
    #105 Danny, May 4, 2001
  6. renewedspirit1

    renewedspirit1 New Member

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    Joy2
    With all do respect....I wasnt even going to add to this crazy arguement (because, in m
    y opinion, Bart was exposed 4 pages ago when his question was answered!)until YOU acused him of being a Roman Catholic and a few other things in which I just had to reply! Joy,I didnt intend to taunt Bart but to challange him such as you did. Truth, Bart! Have you accepted Jesus Christ as your savior? If not youve got some great answers to your original question to ponder! Or are ya just trying plant doubt in Chritian minds? Its a reasonable question...
     
    #106 renewedspirit1, May 4, 2001
  7. grace_proclaimed

    grace_proclaimed New Member

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    To all,
    It should be obvious by now that Mr. Bart is not seeking salvation. He is seeking disputation. Consider the following: Bart does not say "What must I do to be saved?" He says "I TEACH THAT A MAN IS SAVED AFTER HE HAS DONE EXACTLY WHAT GOD HAS SAID.........so that is after the last one listed.......(now remember the only eligible canditate for baptism is the person who has heard, believed, repented, and confessed.)

    so again, (to be clear)......a man must hear the word of God, he must believe it, he must confess that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, he must repent, and he must be baptized.
    and then he/she is saved."
    Bart is not a seeker, he is a teacher who is teaching works for salvation. BTW, there is no way to divorce works from saving faith, if works are the result of faith Gal. 5:6. The issue is that he is seeking to make good deeds meritorioius still.
     
    #107 grace_proclaimed, May 4, 2001
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