Saving Faith is the work of God - Jn. 6:29

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by The Biblicist, Jul 24, 2013.

  1. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist
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    Jn. 6:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

    We have argued whether this verse teaches that faith is God's work OR a work required by God from man. The context has been argued both ways. However, there is an easy clear way to settle this argument from the context. If the words "come unto me" can be proven to mean "come unto me in faith" then this demands that John 6:29 must mean that faith is God's work and not man's. Why? Because -

    1. Coming to Christ in the manner described in this context requires both the works of God giving and drawing them (vv. 37, 44). Coming is future tense from both works of God "All that the father giveth shall come" and "no man can come except the Father draw him."

    2. ALL who are given to Christ come to Christ and "OF ALL" nothing is lost.

    3. EVERY MAN taught by God comes to Christ (v. 45) and "taught" in this manner is explanatory of what it means for God to "draw" a man.


    Therefore, both giving and drawing/teaching are the works of God that are directly precede anyone coming to the Son.

    Finally, This work of God in giving and drawing/teaching that NOTHING "of all" is lost secures resurrection to eternal life for all that come. This is impossible for unbelievers and so believing in Christ must be inclusive in this giving/drawing/teaching/coming process.

    1. The same promise of resurrection to eternal life is directly associated with being given, believing, being drawn and eating and drinking of Christ:

    39 And this is the Father’s will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

    40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

    44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

    54 Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.



    2. Eating and drinking of Christ secure eternal life equally as beleiving in Christ which shows they are metaphors of partaking of Christ by faith:


    47 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.

    54 Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.



    3. Both coming and beleiving EQUAL partaking of Jesus Christ so that a person's thirst and hunger for eternal life is completely satisfied by Christ.

    35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.
    36 But I said unto you, That ye also have seen me, and believe not.


    CONCLUSION: If coming to Christ secures eternal life it must mean coming to Christ in faith because unbelievers are not promised eternal life. A person cannot come in this contextual sense so that "OF ALL" that come are not lost without first being given and drawn/teach by God. Hence, faith is the work of God in giving and drawing/teaching as coming is the consequence of these works of God. Faith is created by this divine revelation as the revelation produces confidence or is the persuasion that faith consists.
     
    #1 The Biblicist, Jul 24, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 24, 2013
  2. TisMe

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    Warning before engaging!

    personal attack removed.
     
    #2 TisMe, Jul 24, 2013
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  3. The Biblicist

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    Since the last poster had nothing to say about the content of the OP, I will repost the OP for serious readers to consider again.
     
  4. The Biblicist

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    The simple point that I am making here is that eternal life cannot be attributed to merely coming to Christ if that phrase does not mean "coming to Christ by faith" as eternal life is not obtained by unbelievers.

    That being the case, then it is indisputable that faith in Christ is the work of God, as Christ plainly attributes coming to him as a direct consequence of God giving and drawing him.
     
  5. Van

    Van
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    Yet another bogus thread where the false assertion of 2 + 2 + 5 is made.

    By the numbers:

    1) The context demands the action, believe in Me, is what the men do. They asked what they needed to do, Jesus answered they needed to believe, and they understood it was their action, for they asked for a sign so they could believe. There is no debate, only assertions of absurdity.

    2) The phrase "come to Me" is used several different ways in scripture,
    a) To mean to come to believe in and follow Christ.
    b) To mean to travel toward or into Christ spiritually.
    c) To mean to travel toward Christ physically. ​

    The context provides the answer as to which usage is in view. If the person is being "given" to Christ, the idea is to travel toward and into Christ, and therefore because they are "in Christ" they shall not be cast out, but raised up on the last day.
     
  6. saturneptune

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    In context, if a person is given to Christ, they are elect. Also, points can be made without words like absurdity. They add nothing to the debate.
     
  7. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist
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    How is that? You are surely reading with welding glasses on.

    The real truth is that you cannot deal with the statements and evidences provided so you simply igore them and make empty unsubstantiates assertions. I dare you to tread the OP as given and provide an intelligent response based upon contextual facts.


    Amazing that you would provde evidence to disprove your own unsubstantiated assertions. There is no possible way that either b or c can be sustained in this passage as the out come every single time in every single passage is either obtaining eternal life or resurrection to eternal life and that is impossible for unbelievers. Hence, coming to Christ in faith MUST be inclusive in this context.

    Even you position denies that anyone can "spiritually arrive" IN CHRIST without faith. If faith is not inclusive in the words "come unto me" then it must be inclusive in being "given" or "draw" as there are no other alternatives provided and the conclusion "eternal life" and "raised" are impossible without faith included.

    Even your position denies this is a possible interpretaton as your position denies it is possible to be raised to eternal life without faith (Jn. 6:39,40,44,54). Yet merely being given, being draw obtains that end (Jn. 39, 44) and is thus made EQUAL to believing that obtains that end (Jn. 6:40).

    John 6:45 completely repudiates your whole theory as Jesus defines what it means for the Father to "draw" someone and demands that "EVERY MAN" thus drawn by that definition does in fact come to Christ and thus raised to life eternal.


    Van, you will not deal with the substaance of the OP because you cannot. If you could you would.
     

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